Roe V Wade in the context of GTA:W.

[Olivia]

I'm going to just comment on this in relation to the game world, not from a real world OOC view.

 

I see and appreciate both sides of this issue. I don't mind it going either way to be honest. My personal opinion: do we really want to spend our time and focus on this? I feel as though there are more appropriate/important matters to focus on in the game world. That said, I don't think we should completely discard it, but let the "powers that be" make a decision for Los Santos and move on. From there, let the players decide within their own story lines how they're going handle it (going to another state, etc). Let's not shut it down for them, but lets not make a mountain out of a molehill issue (again a molehill issue for THIS game world).

 

Two questions we should ask ourselves. First, how many characters will this realistically impact? Second, will this really come up that often for us to spend a huge amount of time debating and then subsequently dedicating resources for?

 

[Midwest]

I will vote no when we ban people from portraying the entire Chechen peoples as terrorists and criminals. Or some of the other peoples that're treated the same. Pretty degrading to literally an entire ethnicity out of character.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Midwest

[Eriks]

The COVID-19 discussion ban (while reasonable since a pandemic actually would have a major in-game impact) created a bad precedent, opening the door for banning any subject deemed sensitive. This is all the more reason to be cautious about continuously banning topics. This isn't Second Life where we live out fantasies, real world events do sometimes impact our universe. Not everyone plays the game for "escapism" from the real world. Don't impose this standard on everyone else.

[H04X]

5 minutes ago, Kari said:

So! A topic I've seen a lot.

Escapism is subjective. (Hence the poll!) It seems a bit useless to keep circling around on that.

You may not like that people don't vibe with rping the ukranian conflict! That's okay. However, there are a group of people who are either close to or living in that tragedy. 

It's a very similar thing here. Obviously, american women are not being subject to genocide, but just because escapism is subjective doesn't mean we can't have compassion for those who /do/ wish to escape from it.

I believe my overall point is the risk vs reward.

Who benefits from this? Who suffers? I think you will find that to many involving themselves in this roleplay, abortion is not a massive part of their characters, and so losing it as a topic may not be detrimental. For some of us? It can make the mood sour to have these topics discussed in RP. I think we're bridging the gap between these topics demotivating people to play, and us literally bawling because we hear 'roe v wade'.

The reality? it's spooky. I don't exactly gain motivation hearing of these things. The same way I didn't when sexual harassment was a thing and people would traumadump that IC. 

I don't think we need to call people 'fragile' for being a little scared. We aren't collapsing in swaths and sobbing, although that's a valid emotion. Compassion. We're a community. It's important to remember that. 

It's equally demotivating to hear the same thing over and over again about banning X, Y and Z because it's a trigger for some people.

[Trupiano]

19 minutes ago, Zoinks said:

I will never be effected by this ruling, but all it takes is a bit of community spirit and empathy to realize that perhaps someone's IRL mental health is more important than whether your fictional, virtual character can discuss abortions or not... 

 

I totally agree with you except nobody is running around talking about abortion or Roe V Wade on the server. Not to mention, this isn't an NA based server so the majority of the community doesn't even know what Roe V Wade is or are effected by todays decision. People mental health is incredibly important, nobody is dismissing that. But given what I've just stated and what I stated in my original reply. Abortion is such a none-issue IC, it so rarely comes up that if your mental health is being damaged that much from it being just a topic on the server? You just gotta log the fuck out.

 

19 minutes ago, Zoinks said:

There's a pretty simple solution to making this work for everyone. Ban it from being discussed in public areas for the time being, but people can discuss it privately as much as they want. Problem solved, no? 

 

Problem not solved, actually it makes issues on this server worse. This is a community of thousands of players from across the world with varying cultures and beliefs. Someone is always going to be offended by something and we're becoming a community where every time a small minority of the community gets "triggered" by a major global event we need to decide if said event is banned or not. I don't need to bring up abortion IC, nor do I ever think I have. But it's apart of life and can when it very rarely comes up lead to great RP. Regardless I shouldn't have to go into private because my character wants to say "Hey did you guys see the SCOTUS decision?"  when he's standing at the bar with his buddies.

 

Because we aren't debating about literal abortion or human reproductive rights. We're debating if we can even discuss the SCOTUS decision on a virtual RP server where abortion is not an issue nor is it even mechanically possible but hey, just talking about Roe V Wade might do someone metal harm so we should just avoid the topic all together. 

 

That's fucking lunacy. 

[KinnyWynny]

3 minutes ago, Eriks said:

The COVID-19 discussion ban (while reasonable since a pandemic actually would have a major in-game impact) created a bad precedent, opening the door for banning any subject deemed sensitive. This is all the more reason to be cautious about continuously banning topics. This isn't Second Life where we live out fantasies, real world events do sometimes impact our universe. Not everyone plays the game for "escapism" from the real world. Don't impose this standard on everyone else.

I think people are more pissed this is a major senate discussion. Why? We have literally a thousand more ingame relevant issues. But people to choose to discuss this of all things?

 

You’re right, a blanket discussion ban would be bad precedent, but this is actively effecting ic politics, and it shouldn’t when priorities are skewed. 

 

We’re a West Coast State, what the hell are we doing? If you want to make up an issue that’s majorly relevant, start writing bills about our water crisis, OR GUN ISSUES. Which actually effect ic events way more and don’t piss as many people off.

 

1 minute ago, H04X said:

It's equally demotivating to hear the same thing over and over again about banning X, Y and Z because it's a trigger for some people.

Please tell me you’re not equivocating the existential dread of possibly being forced to carry to term and suffer lifelong health issues and mental health problems to you reading text on a videogame forum.

[Dingus]

It's not an issue of sensitivity, it's an issue of exhaustion/annoyance.

Most Americans I know are tired of talking about it IRL, and they don't want to deal with it IG. 

Edited June 24, 2022 by Dingus

[Kari]

3 minutes ago, H04X said:

It's equally demotivating to hear the same thing over and over again about banning X, Y and Z because it's a trigger for some people.

As I was earlier told, I'm certain there are ways of avoiding topics that demotivate you. (/s)

Some people are over-sensitive, of course, but they are still just as demotivating. We are roleplaying a world with a darker than average setting.

But that's why there's a poll. I don't claim my opinion to be the most popular one- but it is my opinion. 

I think that the argument of 'how much will your character be effected by this' should go both ways. I recognise work was put into SAGOV for these bills, but. I cannot see it as a major detriment to anyone's character if it is to be banned.

Demotivation sucks. Come play Divinity Sin sometime. 

[Kipps]

I feel like some people are obsessed with dreaming up new ways to pointlessly regulate people's roleplay.

 

This server has gang violence, drug addiction, suicide, racism and robberies. These are horribly sensitive topics to a lot of people, but we trust the average player enough to roleplay around them respectfully -  punishing those who don't.

 

And, frankly, if this really bleak roleplay setting is where you go for 'escapism' from unpleasantness, maybe find a better outlet for that. Most of us just want to roleplay fun and interesting characters.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Kipps

[Zani]

1 hour ago, KinnyWynny said:

Honestly if your faction can only gain interest by discussing hot button OOC political discourses that don’t effect IC events that much instead of making waves by discussing hotbutton IC issues like criminal law reform or any sort of drug reform. I have a hard time justifying your existence as an entity that can honestly just be ran by LFM as nameless senators.

 

Allow me to respond to you with a quote from what I previously said. I also urge you to read the entire message that I put forth.

 

1 hour ago, Zani said:

The matter is a prominent topic in the United States, and that’s why the SA Senate went ahead with it.

 

Are we not a political faction? Has it not thus far been allowed for said reason?

 

The Senate has brought important bills forward throughout its course. All I said was, this brought an actual IC involvement and interest in politics. I fail to see how I am claiming that this was the ONLY way I can bring roleplay to the faction?

 

Your claims have no basis. This is (in part) a lawmaking faction. Every faction contributes in their own way for the attempt to roleplay a governed society with law and order. So for us not to discuss things as I quote from you "criminal law reform or any sort of drug reform" is not the mindset we should be having.