The Police Department & You

[Shekh]

6 hours ago, Cascade said:

I think people have already stated this but, we have only the law set out by the government which have no difference in juvenile charges. I always encourage our guys to rp with illegal rpers in a way that gives us both an enjoyable scene and aids character development. My character who significantly older, has often had conversations with kids in cuffs with the whole "Was this worth it? Think what you are doing with your life kid?" Kinda chat and for the most part its been a fun bit of rp, sometimes I don't get much back.

 

However playing a juvenile does not mean you get away with breaking the law, sometimes officers may choose to use their discretion on really minor offences, and hope a bit of leeway helps build a relationship and perhaps steer them towards the right path.

 

However, still the element of the law that we are governed by I'm afraid, perhaps a suggestion of a juvenile wing of the prison might be a great alternative but again something we have no control over.

If more PD were like you I wouldn’t complain. The PD ive dealt with for the most part have just ignored what I say when i try initiate dialogue. 
 

And of course juveniles should get lower sentences, that’s literally part of why drugs/guns are handed to kids irl so that they can take the blame since they’re young. I believe for non-violent crimes kids should get a little bit less time.

[Armaros]

2 hours ago, Westen said:

So, as a faction, I don't believe this is a fair argument. Sure, it's a game, but if we take the "it's only a game don't take it seriously" approach, the quality of people in the faction will drop, and the negativity surrounding law enforcement will increase. 

I get that, I'm not saying to take it that light, but for people to go through so many hoops just to patrol is just a lil insane.

[Big_Smokes]

4 hours ago, Armaros said:

I understand that this is not the kind of feedback you want right now, but I thought that the faction took itself too seriously. I'm not against it that much, I personally am okay with it, and will join PD again, but the time it takes to get onto the streets 'n' do any work is kinda massive. 

To jump in on this, the time requirement (two weeks of recruitment, one week of academy, another week before the induction starts) is going to be dramatically decreased in the weeks to come as we are reworking our recruitment system from the ground up. This does however not change the amount of knowledge and information you need to absorb in order to be a part of the faction, we are merely changing the way said knowledge is introduced to you.

 

The short version of that is, we're focusing more on the curriculum presented to you while you're already a part of the faction at the lowest possible rank while extending our probationary period, so that many more things are introduced to you as you go and you can take the time to actually learn how to roleplay being a law enforcement officer.

 

Doing research before you join the faction though is highly advised. Look at things like for example the most important case laws used by police officers in the US, basic protocols on traffic stops, and the general day to day life of police officers both on and off duty.

 

Example of a video that explains a majority of very important case laws used on a daily basis:

 

 

 

[Armaros]

3 hours ago, Big_Smokes said:

To jump in on this, the time requirement (two weeks of recruitment, one week of academy, another week before the induction starts) is going to be dramatically decreased in the weeks to come as we are reworking our recruitment system from the ground up. This does however not change the amount of knowledge and information you need to absorb in order to be a part of the faction, we are merely changing the way said knowledge is introduced to you.

 

The short version of that is, we're focusing more on the curriculum presented to you while you're already a part of the faction at the lowest possible rank while extending our probationary period, so that many more things are introduced to you as you go and you can take the time to actually learn how to roleplay being a law enforcement officer.

 

Doing research before you join the faction though is highly advised. Look at things like for example the most important case laws used by police officers in the US, basic protocols on traffic stops, and the general day to day life of police officers both on and off duty.

 

Example of a video that explains a majority of very important case laws used on a daily basis:

 

 

 

That's very good news. Very happy to hear you're going to remove some red tape. 

[MikeyMike]

My personal gripe with the police on the server is that the officers pulling me over or anyone else for that matter aren't nearly as nosy and curious as they should be. They act like scripted robots. "License and registration, plz. Hang tight while I write you a ticket. Here you go. Good day."

Watch any cop show ever (or if you've ever been pulled over in your life) and you'll know that cops ask a thousand questions. Where are you coming from? Where are you headed? Why there? Where's home? Have you had anything to drink? Are there any weapons in the vehicle? Take on a role of a public protector whose job it is to ask questions in order to determine whether this person is involved in anything they shouldn't be involved in. That's the one area I'm hoping the PD improves on in the future.

Edited April 6, 2020 by MikeyMike

[eTaylor]

My only gripe with the Los Santos Police Department is their inconsistent quality in relation to police reports. Whether it’s a simple arrest report or an incident report. The frequency of the inconsistency leads me to concluded that there is a reasonable possibility that these reports are not moderated or at all reviewed. While I believe that the LSPD does cover police reports in their training, a large number still lacks standardized reporting methods. A lot of reports are not filed in the first person, nor do they report events in chronological order. Arrest reports often simply detail the circumstances surrounding the arrest or the way someone is arrested, but doesn’t include the basis for probable cause or what the arrest was actually about in relation to the charges. 
 

Since these reports are used as statements of facts in criminal proceedings I want to stress the importance for them to be properly and professionally handled. Reading a lot of reports I am given the impression they may be seen as an inconvenience internally and are as such brushed off as insignificant. This leaves room for critical errors and systemic negligence, with all consequence in tow.
 

Reporting individual reports is one thing, but I’d like to see a structured response to improve the reporting capabilities of officers department wide. Ideally the LSPD would adapt one method of reporting and standardize it for the future. At the least, officers should be aware to take extra care with reports involving not guilty and no contest pleas.

Edited April 6, 2020 by eTaylor

[Westen]

12 minutes ago, eTaylor said:

My only gripe with the Los Santos Police Department is their inconsistent quality in relation to police reports. Whether it’s a simple arrest report or an incident report. The frequency of the inconsistency leads me to concluded that there is a reasonable possibility that these reports are not moderated or at all reviewed. While I believe that the LSPD does cover police reports in their training, a large number still lacks standardized reporting methods. A lot of reports are not filed in the first person, nor do they report events in chronological order. Arrest reports often simply detail the circumstances surrounding the arrest or the way someone is arrested, but doesn’t include the basis for probable cause or what the arrest was actually about in relation to the charges. 
 

Since these reports are used as statements of facts in criminal proceedings I want to stress the importance for them to be properly and professionally handled. Reading a lot of reports I am given the impression they may be seen as an inconvenience internally and are as such brushed off as insignificant. This leaves room for critical errors and systemic negligence, with all consequence in tow.
 

Reporting individual reports is one thing, but I’d like to see a structured response to improve the reporting capabilities of officers department wide. Ideally the LSPD would adapt one method of reporting and standardize it for the future. At the least, officers should be aware to take extra care with reports involving not guilty and no contest pleas.

Hi. I run the Police Training & Education division within PD. Report writing is a major thing for me and I am actively trying to promote better report writing. But it is difficult. Writing things to an evidential standard is difficult in the first place, and English isn't everyone's native language so that becomes 10x harder because of the particular way that certain things are phrased ("legalese").

 

What I have noticed is that a lot of reports seem to follow a format as defined by an arrest report generator. Personally, I don't agree with the use of an arrest report generator because it suggests a lack of confidence in their ability to write a comprehensive report.

 

If you have specific concerns and examples, please, please send them to me and I am more than happy to talk about them with you.

[eTaylor]

28 minutes ago, Westen said:

Hi. I run the Police Training & Education division within PD. Report writing is a major thing for me and I am actively trying to promote better report writing. But it is difficult. Writing things to an evidential standard is difficult in the first place, and English isn't everyone's native language so that becomes 10x harder because of the particular way that certain things are phrased ("legalese").

 

What I have noticed is that a lot of reports seem to follow a format as defined by an arrest report generator. Personally, I don't agree with the use of an arrest report generator because it suggests a lack of confidence in their ability to write a comprehensive report.

 

If you have specific concerns and examples, please, please send them to me and I am more than happy to talk about them with you.

English not being a primary language isn’t a problem per say. Grammar and spelling errors while avoidable are negligible, and legal terminology is a pre but not a requirement in my eyes. Besides these reports would help improving language significantly over time. The core should be factual reporting based on what happened, with specifying information, written in the first person and in chronological order, answering all W’s and so forth.
 

I’d much rather process a factual report with horrible English over a report written in perfect English with no facts or proper reporting. The former I can translate and “legalize” in proceedings, the latter is just a dismissal in progress. I also feel that officers are not held accountable for bad reporting, resulting in worsening reports. I am not versed in your internal systems, but the LSSD doesn’t have this problem. Perhaps training personnel there, or those responsible for the reporting system, could offer more useful insight. 

[arrdef]

It's very difficult to have an entire faction replicate decent report-writing because the prevailing mindset among many people is that; if it's not IG, then it's not worth roleplaying. Some members are also fairly young, and a 17 years old player who wants to roleplay a cop may not be very enthused at the idea of documenting his character's use of force in a written testimony.

This only adds to the concerns that make it difficult to motivate actual professionals who are paid to do this; they generally won't see any results from their reports, even if they do lead to something, simply because they're not in a position to see it. So they don't care.

 

Given these factors, I wouldn't put the blame squarely on PD leadership for shortcomings relating to that. It's one thing to ask for good reports from members of specialized divisions who handle important investigation; it's another thing to ask the same of every officer bob who finds a body in an alleyway.

Edited April 6, 2020 by arrdef

[eTaylor]

1 hour ago, arrdef said:

It's very difficult to have an entire faction replicate decent report-writing because the prevailing mindset among many people is that; if it's not IG, then it's not worth roleplaying. Some members are also fairly young, and a 17 years old player who wants to roleplay a cop may not be very enthused at the idea of documenting his character's use of force in a written testimony.

This only adds to the concerns that make it difficult to motivate actual professionals who are paid to do this; they generally won't see any results from their reports, even if they do lead to something, simply because they're not in a position to see it. So they don't care.

 

Given these factors, I wouldn't put the blame squarely on PD leadership for shortcomings relating to that. It's one thing to ask for good reports from members of specialized divisions who handle important investigation; it's another thing to ask the same of every officer bob who finds a body in an alleyway.

The only real requirement for reporting is that which involves the prosecution of another character, report writing is not difficult at all. It takes 2 maybe 5 minutes to write a single statement of facts. Maybe 2 minutes extra if you need to add supporting evidence. If you cannot spare a grand extended 10 minutes for hours of roleplay, I genuinely question Bob’s reason to be a cop. It’s not just about back to back shootings, and reports definitely do have a major and significant effect. Just take a look at the current court cases.

 

Regardless, we’re not asking for incredibly large all consuming 60-40 patrol paperwork style reporting or even reporting on literally everything. But if officers can’t be bothered to write facts, and include more than the way they handcuffed someone that’s their prerogative. It just reflects bad on them as a faction in my opinion, and then they really don’t have a leg to stand on when they complain about when the vast majority of their cases are being dismissed or thrown out.
 

The LSSD seems to have a good balance, perhaps it’s a matter of time and numbers. Either way, I don’t see why it cannot be the same for the LSPD. If need be I’d love to create a simple module for reporting where everything is covered without having to write 700 paperwork dockets. But again, that’s for the faction to determine.