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Suggestion to counter vigilante CCW/PF wannabe heroes.


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Just now, Cypher99 said:

Lol tell that to every criminal out there who excuses a “hardened” life to pull a gun instead of role play an ounce of fear for their lives. 
 

Kettle, meet pot. 


I mean isn’t that why they’re robbing people in the first place? Cause life is hard? LMAO.

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31 minutes ago, UTOPIA said:

I would be in favor of stricter OOC and IC regulations on PF/CCW holders and generally making a gun license more difficult to obtain overall. Using your PF gun to commit an act of vigilantism should be looked at very critically, it is already against the law IC, but I think it needs to be regulated way more heavily.

 

IC:

  • Whenever you get into a shooting with a PF/CCW gun, you should have to let the firearms licensing bureau know.
  • Vigilantism should be a heavier sentence accompanied with potentially murder/manslaughter, whatever. 
  • Place of residence should be taken account when applying for PF/CCW. (Live in a bad neighborhood, crime ridden area, etc.)
  • More consequences to letting your PF gun bang on someone.

 

OOC:

  • Character backstory should be taken into question when applying for PF/CCW. (Has this character recently had a crime committed against them, are they in fear for their life?)
  • Character should have a good REASON to have a CCW license.
  • Failed attempts at vigilantism should be instant CKs.

 

Hey, I'm one of the people that run the Firearms Licensing Division within PD. A lot of these concerns are already addressed from an IC standpoint (I've bolded them). CCW licenses now need to be ICly justified via a "Good Cause", similar to California's screening method. It's fairly strictly enforced by everyone in the division that handles them. (It's also really controversial from both an IC and OOC standpoint, but LFM/Management have affirmed it is here to stay due to past issues of portrayal.)

 

PF restrictions cannot really be considered from an IC standpoint, it's a pretty gross second amendment violation to restrict firearm possession to that degree (whereas the second amendment does not explicitly cover the right to conceal carry a firearm, which is why extra restrictions can be imposed on that permit.).

 

Placing OOC restrictions like this can make FLD's job very hard, as we're not admins - We can't really verify that what they're saying from an OOC standpoint is true, without having to constantly pest admins to check things, which is something they're already subject to thanks to the rampant abuse of PF licenses across the server (and they do a very good job of catching and dealing with them alongside us). So, yeah, OOC things like that need to be very heavily discussed before they can reasonably become a thing. And I do also think the changes that were brought in last year have helped improve portrayal significantly compared to how rampantly awful it was prior.

 

Edited by joshua
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Bottom line. People who break these rules in a blatant manner should first be reported and then far more harshly punished. A CK or a 60 minute ajail just isn’t doing it. The behavior is wrong on an OOC level. They just go right back to doing the same thing on another character. It’s time to weed out the bad apples rather than simply putting them in time out. 

Edited by Cypher99
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Just now, Cypher99 said:

People who break these rules in a blatant manner should first be reported and then far more harshly punished.


The debate at hand is about vigilantism, not the amendment of rules.

 

If you pull a heroism act and fail to rp fear when I’m robbing you, I’d expect a CK on your side. Keep the reporting at a minimum and let IC play out, but a PK won’t work because people will just repeat over and over again.

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3 minutes ago, joshua said:

 

Hey, I'm one of the people that run the Firearms Licensing Division within PD. A lot of these concerns are already addressed from an IC standpoint (I've bolded them). CCW licenses now need to be ICly justified via a "Good Cause", similar to California's screening method. It's fairly strictly enforced by everyone in the division that handles them. (It's also really controversial from both an IC and OOC standpoint, but LFM/Management have affirmed it is here to stay due to past issues of portrayal.)

 

PF restrictions cannot really be considered from an IC standpoint, it's a pretty gross second amendment violation to restrict firearm possession to that degree (whereas the second amendment does not explicitly cover the right to conceal carry a firearm, which is why extra restrictions can be imposed on that permit.).

 

Placing OOC restrictions like this can make FLD's job very hard, as we're not admins - We can't really verify that what they're saying from an OOC standpoint is true, without having to constantly pest admins to check things, which is something they're already subject to thanks to the rampant abuse of PF licenses across the server (and they do a very good job of catching and dealing with them alongside us). So, yeah, OOC things like that need to be very heavily discussed before they can reasonably become a thing. And I do also think the changes that were brought in last year have helped improve portrayal significantly compared to how rampantly awful it was prior.

 

Thank you for the information, I hope LFM and IFM can come to an agreement with regards to heightening regulations while keeping it simple and smooth enough for you guys to keep doing at a reasonable rate for the sake of your personal time.

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Civilians played along for a while with the "must show fear" meta, but eventually got tired of it.  The rule seemed exploited by most robbers to railroad every encounter down a boring, predictable path.  At least when PFs are made rare, and almost everything accepts bank money, robberies might be for the RP rather than script items.

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1 hour ago, Murat said:

If you pull a heroism act and fail to rp fear when I’m robbing you, I’d expect a CK on your side.

 

This is how it is already. Fear RP rules dictate that your character can be CKed if they don't portray proper fear. It even restricts what constitutes "fear" to an unrealistic degree for the benefit of the criminal participants.

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Nobody here is saying that this is the biggest problem right now buddy, and we're certainly not discussing about the "biggest problem" in this server. This forum section is called "Rule Suggestions" for a reason.

If you think you know the biggest problem as you say, then you should follow other venues besides this suggestion.
 

45 minutes ago, Timzii said:

shouldnt robbers then also be character-killed if they are killed during the act? I agree to the suggestion tho

 

That would kill the whole drive for robberies, we aim to have fun and show a realistic portrayal of robberies.

Limiting vigilantes with CCW permits in this specific situation, isn't by no means a restriction towards the civilians, and certainly not a win for the illegal rpers. It's just a punishment for a players that disregard their characters' lives during such situation, and I'm surprised to see this wasn't implemented before.

Infact, it's aimed towards a more healthy environment. I'm sure nobody would want to be shot in the back of his head by a wannabe hero during a robbery, the same way I'm sure nobody would want to be held up at a gunpoint in the middle of Downtown or Vinewood.

 

It feels like the server's separated between two groups, where as everyone tries to benefit his side. Just because this suggestion is aimed towards legal rpers with CCW permits then that doesn't mean it has to reflect back to illegal rpers. It's a simple suggestion that aims to fix a small tendency some inexperienced people tend to do.

If you feel like throwing a suggestion for Robbers to have the risk of being CKed during a robbery, feel free to do so. But this definitely isn't the right place for it.

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