Official standing about IC population portrayal - Thoughts?

[Smilesville]

1 minute ago, DLimit said:

To address the first point, though, is the idea that criminal-minded people are more likely to be victims of crimes than legal entities simply because they are less likely to notify the police. Usually, lower-ranking members are targeted, specifically the ones that aren't legitimately members of a set/gang/mob etc... criminal affiliation is meaningless, as legal people have more resources towards capturing criminals. They have the whole L.S.P.D., L.S.S.D., and Park Rangers, with an arsenal of technology that's dedicated towards tracking and incriminating people, to support them. Mobsters? Gang-bangers? They can only patrol the area in 1-2 vehicles searching for any clues or hints of the robber.

You vastly overestimate the capabilities of the technology they have; they're only going to find you if they already know who you are. Law enforcement organizations may be well equipped to fight organized crime, but they fall short in tracing sporadic robberies - even in real life. If someone isn't legitimately a member of a criminal entity, I'd tend to leave them out of the "criminal affiliation means you don't get robbed" bit.

Robbers are obsessed with accusing everyone of "stalling" because they know the best chance they have of getting caught is in the middle of robbing someone. Being a member of a criminal organization belies the fact that there are other members who could roll up during that period.

 

Members who're likely to kill them and ask questions later.

[.Pluto.]

18 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

As I've said ad infinitum - affiliation with criminal entities for everyone who comes out of the woodwork to say "gee, it's never happened to me." As amusing as professional courtesy for scumbags would be as a concept, I liken the phenomenon more to the meta knowledge that you're more likely to retaliate. The robbery game is all about the meta, and the shrill voices you're hearing (reading?) is just another aspect of the meta.

 

Thread will get shut down, nothing will change, and ultimately that's their goal.

 

Hate to say you're wasting your virtual breath, but these are the people I mentioned earlier - people who come out of the woodwork using every excuse they possibly can to justify treating crime as a grind and utterly ignoring whether the server is better or worse for it.

 

Fortunately, they're not my target audience. Seems like people forget staff read these.

 

We should have known a man of such perfect grammar and spelling would bamboozle us with sarcasm.

 

If that's the standard we want, that's the standard. Now do trucking and vigilante shootings.

 

I don't care which standard we have as long as it's not a double standard.

 

If it's not bad RP to rob someone in the middle of an intersection in broad daylight, it's not bad RP to shoot that robber dead and leave the scene before someone shows up in a city with the aforementioned death rate. I'd be surprised if the PD was able to clear even 5% of the murder cases that come across their desk.

can u tell us one more time the stories about u getting robbed i rlly wanna hear it, didnt laugh for twelve hours, make my day. the story u keep telling and whining about since 2018

[DLimit]

9 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

You vastly overestimate the capabilities of the technology they have; they're only going to find you if they already know who you are. Law enforcement organizations may be well equipped to fight organized crime, but they fall short in tracing sporadic robberies - even in real life. If someone isn't legitimately a member of a criminal entity, I'd tend to leave them out of the "criminal affiliation means you don't get robbed" bit.

Robbers are obsessed with accusing everyone of "stalling" because they know the best chance they have of getting caught is in the middle of robbing someone. Being a member of a criminal organization belies the fact that there are other members who could roll up during that period.

 

Members who're likely to kill them and ask questions later.

The ratio of "other members rolling up" compared to "the police could be rolling up" is massively different... there are more active police officers, on-duty, than faction members, at a time. Only time some "faction member rolls up" is if you're robbing them within their own hood, which itself, is stupid and rarely happens.

How will an ILLEGAL PERSON be able to retaliate if they don't know who they are? Police are even more well-equipped to find a person over a mere description than the average illegal RPer.

EDIT: In the real world, this is why criminals are targeted more than non-criminals. Easier to rob a criminal knowing that they may have narcotics, a firearm, or some illegal money... even shoes, chains etc... than a legal person that would notify the police minutes after the robbery. Drug dealers that flash their money, clothes, and jewelry get robbed more frequently than any thing.

Edited May 23, 2021 by DLimit

[Trupiano]

1 minute ago, DasFroggy said:

Why choose a realistic crime rate for the setting when criminals can just rob someone within literal line of sight of a police station?

 

I get where you're coming from, but this is the problem with letting realism sink in one area - it's going to go down elsewhere. In this case, your desire for the ability to rob people anywhere, comes with the consequence that now anyone can defend themselves without fear of criminal liability in just as much anywhere, because civilians are just as able to make stupid decisions as criminals.

This is where you and I see things differently, the realistic solution. 

 

I don't think the fact that staff has OOCly decided to change a way they rule on things warrants such a sudden shift in the actions of CWW holders. The crime rate can be solved through IC solutions, many of which I've suggested. I understand it can be difficult to be the target of that crime, but the mentality your suggesting would do infinitely more damage to the server the the crime rate. I get we all have our opinions on robbery RP but at least that RP can be improved. You know what has no RP? CCW holders and criminals getting in gun battles on the streets because one out of every three civilians is carrying a gun, regardless of if it makes sense for their character.

 

Hey maybe I'm wrong, in which case go ahead and gun us all down but I really think a few months of focused community lobbying of politicians and PD could see a solution to this issue that everyone is fine with without an OOC heavy handedness by staff or the server devolving into a wild west shoot em up.

[DasFroggy]

2 minutes ago, Henning said:

This is where you and I see things differently, the realistic solution. 

The realistic solution is not to commit a crime where traffic would be a regular thing, with dozens if not hundreds of witnesses. Time of day shouldn't matter, but location should. 

 

3 minutes ago, Henning said:

The crime rate can be solved through IC solutions

One of which is a gun, being utilized for the purpose it was made.

 

3 minutes ago, Henning said:

I understand it can be difficult to be the target of that crime

It's not difficult. I've encountered a number of muggers that have allowed for a fun and entertaining roleplay rather than just a straight up crimegrinder drive for script assets. Sadly the latter is the daily trend now, with the former being once every couple of months.

 

5 minutes ago, Henning said:

You know what has no RP? CCW holders and criminals getting in gun battles on the streets because one out of every three civilians is carrying a gun, regardless of if it makes sense for their character.

I've tried to exercise every other possible option, even cooperating fully. The results rarely exclude hospitalization, as most crimegrinders brutally beat their victims to limit the possibility of getting caught.

 

6 minutes ago, Henning said:

Hey maybe I'm wrong, in which case go ahead and gun us all down but I really think a few months of focused community lobbying of politicians and PD could see a solution to this issue that everyone is fine with without an OOC heavy handedness by staff or the server devolving into a wild west shoot em up.

The crime problems can be solved with IC solutions, for sure. One of the easiest solutions is to simply have a gun and kill anyone that decides to draw a gun in a public space while concealing their identity, clear indicators of hostile intent.

 

If you want to avoid this, there are IC solutions that criminals can begin pursuing, more specifically finding and ensuring that the crimegrinders who are dragging down your reputation are made into examples, with no subtlety or hushing of the act. Make a spectacle of it, and violently rip apart anyone that does something stupid, otherwise the civilian population is going to resort to what you're willing to accept, in this case gun violence with minimal provocation.

 

When I can get robbed within line of sight of a police station, the city isn't safe anymore. It's not even remotely safe. It's a region where society is breaking down, and the empty streets are actually pretty realistic, because only people ready to kill would be willing to live in a city with five times the murder rate of the entire country of colombia.

[Engelbert]

I think the problem lies in mundane things. I know this not exactly good spot to analyze this, but crime rate is high, because people roleplay with GTAO routine. IE you must be doing something or don't play at all. Yep...that's what happens. Like sitting in a bar and scrolling through phone? No no we must do something, we created these characters for. Roleplaying just laughing at a bbq party won't cut it.

[.Pluto.]

Just now, DasFroggy said:

The realistic solution is not to commit a crime where traffic would be a regular thing, with dozens if not hundreds of witnesses. Time of day shouldn't matter, but location should. 

Last staff meeting resulted in - there is no "dozens if not hundreds of witnesses WOULD BE there irl". No players on the street? You can't use "ppl n traffic would be there" as an argument. Naeno said it, and explained, in the most sacred place, IFC, as far as I know.

[DasFroggy]

1 minute ago, Engelbert said:

I think the problem lies in mundane things. I know this not exactly good spot to analyze this, but crime rate is high, because people roleplay with GTAO routine. IE you must be doing something or don't play at all. Yep...that's what happens. Like sitting in a bar and scrolling through phone? No no we must do something, we created these characters for. Roleplaying just laughing at a bbq party won't cut it.

Free running is dope, and honestly it'd be so much more dope if criminals didn't resort to gun violence the moment someone tries running. There are a LOT of places a free-runner can go, and honestly I'd love to get into a chase at some point, but whenever anyone tries it...

 

...it's straight to shooting and a CK.

[Engelbert]

Just now, DasFroggy said:

Free running is dope, and honestly it'd be so much more dope if criminals didn't resort to gun violence the moment someone tries running. There are a LOT of places a free-runner can go, and honestly I'd love to get into a chase at some point, but whenever anyone tries it...

 

...it's straight to shooting and a CK.

I actually rp a free runner and urban explorer. I myself was suprised how many locations are out there I didn't know about before. I usually run around in Davis, which was kinda myth breaking the first time, cause I actually met people who didn't wanna rob or kill me at all.

[DLimit]

5 minutes ago, .Pluto. said:

Last staff meeting resulted in - there is no "dozens if not hundreds of witnesses WOULD BE there irl". No players on the street? You can't use "ppl n traffic would be there" as an argument. Naeno said it, and explained, in the most sacred place, IFC, as far as I know.

They should seriously revert that rule if they are seeking to maintain realism. Real-life robberies requires some form of challenge, which specifically revolves around being undetected when committing the crime. Now, people can abuse this change by simply robbing people when the server's player count is low.

EDIT: It's entertaining knowing that you have to lure a victim into an alley-way or remote area that's away from public sight.

Edited May 23, 2021 by DLimit