Trucking Roleplay

[lost in the sea]

1 hour ago, Matt_S said:

@Wolfgang I RP as Matthew Baker and I would first of like to apologies for the screen shot posted as it was a ongoing joke that day about drivers being a bit random and clearly this has been taken out of context and I never indented anything like this to be shared let alone on a public thread. All I found annoying is that I was parked there for a few seconds at most before you arrived, Then you jumped to the conclusion that I was afk, Blocked me in! and waited for me to get out of the shipment screen for me to then get a bit pissed that you were sat infront of me not letting me out. All you could have done is waited half a minute to see if I was actually afk or **walked** up to me and asked. I didnt mean any of this to turn against you or in fact be posted and had no intention of 'calling you out' about a simple misunderstanding.

Thank you, bud. It's a pleasure for clearing you out, I never meant anything against you anyways. I misunderstood the fact and I was wrong myself, ofcourse. I'm a human and I do make mistakes sometimes even not RP infront of people. My wrongdoing. I wish you a very good day and hopefully a healthy discussion here.

[Darcin]

Oh, I'm not in any way saying we should increase the trucker pay, @Moonsong. I think that would make the whole situation with no-RP truckers worse. I was simply pointing out the belief that a trucker 'realistically shouldn't have a really nice car' is complete bunk, along with 'it's one of the worst jobs'. Anyone that thinks trucking is a shitty job had never waited tables or flipped burgers. A trucker can afford some fairly nice things.

 

Truckers make bank IRL. Any trucker that gets access to a pounder in game also makes bank. So if they own a really nice car? It's definitely not 'poor portrayal.'

 

Hell, I do security detail for Kazanov Trucking and sometimes I'll climb to get a birds eye view to look after truckers. The amount of vans I see pull up, get loaded, and go in about 10 seconds is...mind blowing.

[Vash Baldeus]

2 hours ago, Woona said:

Trucking companies should be encouraging their employees to work and should take OOC complaints more seriously. A lot of the same lazy truckers are known about, but nothing gets done to them until an admin does something about them.

 

Yesterday I had a guy, park at on PAVEMENT infront the door of my shop just to unload, when I approached him IC about it he borderline ignored it until I forced him to reply. Reason he parked like that? Side parking was taken up. While other truckers park even on fire lane for a minute or two, roleplay the unload and move on, but this guy.. bluntly parked on the pavement did minimal RP and almost 100% ignored my presence there as well. Next trucker to do that kinda of this will get a report against him and he will be dealt by admins.

55 minutes ago, Darcin said:

Oh, I'm not in any way saying we should increase the trucker pay, @Moonsong. I think that would make the whole situation with no-RP truckers worse. I was simply pointing out the belief that a trucker 'realistically shouldn't have a really nice car' is complete bunk, along with 'it's one of the worst jobs'. Anyone that thinks trucking is a shitty job had never waited tables or flipped burgers. A trucker can afford some fairly nice things.

 

Truckers make bank IRL. Any trucker that gets access to a pounder in game also makes bank. So if they own a really nice car? It's definitely not 'poor portrayal.'

 

Hell, I do security detail for Kazanov Trucking and sometimes I'll climb to get a birds eye view to look after truckers. The amount of vans I see pull up, get loaded, and go in about 10 seconds is...mind blowing.

As a kid, I used to work in Hotels as a kitchen aid, shit job of the ones I had. Trucking has it's other downsides which is the odd work hours and the monotonous driving a truck for hours. I worked security and my job was with people, but yes, a trucker can have a nice car, but not 15 cars.

[Smilesville]

2 hours ago, Moonsong said:

Whether you like it or not is irrelevant I'm afraid, this is a roleplay server and you're expected to roleplay in detail, more so when other players are around. Do we expect you to roleplay every crate meticulously? Of course not but trying to pass off /me unloads the crates as roleplay, is simply not going to cut it.

I would reiterate that RP is more than the lines you crank out, however - and there are indeed only so many ways to describe the removal of crates from a truck or van. I've heard horror stories of bans handed out for someone using an emote that's too similar when people aren't around, an act that honestly doesn't seem all that objectionable to me - and they were told "always RP like someone is there." It's a level of scrutiny that doesn't seem to apply anywhere else.

That particular standard just seems nebulous, is all - and I earnestly believe the server should strive to have a very clear definition of what's acceptable and what isn't.

 

2 hours ago, Moonsong said:

Certainly the job brings more life to the streets as you mentioned but when an alarming percentage of truckers are rushing around without regard for their own lives, or for others that becomes an administrative headache to deal with. Especially when certain players think it's an IC issue, it's not a healthy mentality to have.

I still think there's an IC way to deal with it that we're overlooking; why not have PD hand out reckless driving charges that prevent an offender from trucking after it's been applied? Mind you - while I have concerns about the way emotes are 'graded' above, I absolutely understand cracking down on those cutting corners, nearly swiping other cars, not stopping at a single traffic light, etc - I just think it's better to deal with it IC.

[Koko]

4 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

why not have PD hand out reckless driving charges that prevent an offender from trucking after it's been applied?

This. I'd be happy as a trucker if a possible sanction would be after a warning (or a couple) to go back one tier in the truck you are allowed to drive. Not so fun to go back to the Speedo (or then lose your license) when you're straight up grinding.

[Moonsong]

Quote

why not have PD hand out reckless driving charges that prevent an offender from trucking after it's been applied? 

Having spoken to several pd and sd about this there's a few reasons as to why it's not so prevalent as it would be under ideal circumstances. Some would see it as a waste of time, as they'll rarely heed the warnings anyway and just keep doing it regardless and can often be a pain to roleplay with as they just want to get back to grinding. It's a lot of effort for the officers and deputies for little gain. It's seen in the same light as trying to pull over cop baiters. The second concern is that it would be a full time job, probably requiring the formation of a specialised unit which currently I'm not sure there's the manpower for to cover the busier trucking times. It would be great for sure but I don't think it wouldn't solve the main problem.

 

To do that, it would need updates to the trucking script and more players reporting the bad eggs so we can educate them or punish them where necessary, because as things are right now it's an administrative issue until we can snuff out misconceptions and indeed flawed views on what is and isn't acceptable trucking roleplay. Unfortunately that means us stepping in.

 

I'm not going to speculate on individual ban reasons but I can assure you that other factors are generally considered when handing out punishments, whilst some on face value may seem harsh the reality is most likely quite different once other factors have been considered, like previous history, behavior towards staff the severity of what they've done and other stuff (non exhaustive of course). Punishments aren't always as they immediately appear.

[Koko]

34 minutes ago, Moonsong said:

Having spoken to several pd and sd about this there's a few reasons as to why it's not so prevalent as it would be under ideal circumstances. Some would see it as a waste of time, as they'll rarely heed the warnings anyway and just keep doing it regardless and can often be a pain to roleplay with as they just want to get back to grinding. It's a lot of effort for the officers and deputies for little gain. It's seen in the same light as trying to pull over cop baiters. The second concern is that it would be a full time job, probably requiring the formation of a specialised unit which currently I'm not sure there's the manpower for to cover the busier trucking times. It would be great for sure but I don't think it wouldn't solve the main problem.

I understand the point (and just to reiterate, I speak as a trucker RPer), but I think the response is ultimately a bit weak, imho. It sounds (correct me if I'm wrong) like PD has just assumed it's too big a problem to even tackle, but personally... I'd say 99% of truck routes when grinding eventually go through places like Cypress Flats (which is also a very tempting, straight road that's not very busy and encourages Mach speeds). It also makes sense that there would be more police presence near the Port of Los Santos (the point where a good chunk of pickups are based). Isn't that Traffic's responsibility to begin with? Just sit a unit in Cypress Flats and every trucker that speeds through is trapped in the Port, essentially, and easy to give a slap on the wrist. If repeat offenses mean loss of the driving/trucking license, people will soon learn the hard way.

 

There is always the possibility that truckers will develop alternative routes to avoid savvy police, but I think those dedicated rogue truckers will be a minority compared to the current situation.

 

One of the main problems I see right now is that the current system of tiers of drivers (in order to access higher load vehicles) encourages early grinding, but by the time people have reached the 100 deliveries needed they have already become skilled at speeding in order to get through the system, and they know the ins and outs of trucking. At that point the system is only training us to be better at breaking the law, because ultimately a fine just means a bit of money lost on our route. 

 

A truck is a fortress on wheels; literally a death machine to anyone they might collide with (without even thinking about things they might be carrying, which IC include firearm parts, which would be a huge security issue if they scattered all over in an accident). Loss of the license under sever reckless driving is the least one should expect, to be honest. IRL these events depending on the speed and circumstances might easily mean jail time.

 

Behaviours like the nonsense trucking present around the job is why we lose things. Even if other truckers might moan at me, I do believe we should all strive to keep our IC livelihoods and encourage good RP over grinding.

Edited October 30, 2020 by Koko

[Valkyria]

1 hour ago, Koko said:

Isn't that Traffic's responsibility to begin with?

Realistically, no. This would fall under the Los Angeles Port Police.

 

The issue with truckers is the fact that you know they're not roleplaying it. There's no IC motivation for driving over curbs, swerving into lanes or busting U-turns on the highway. If there was one past "i want to get there faster this is an ic issue", then I'd be OK with it. But fact of the matter is, it's either a neon orange or a spinnaker blue Speedo treating it like it's some kind of Fast and Furious server, but with vans instead of tuned up JDM cars.

 

1 hour ago, Koko said:

At that point the system is only training us to be better at breaking the law, because ultimately a fine just means a bit of money lost on our route. 

And this is why combating it is simply not a plausible solution. You practically just stated that you don't care about a fine, it just means a bit of money lost on your route. Why would PD or SD bother doing traffic ops for people who treat tickets as something that's just a bit of money lost? They need to document it, write it up, submit it on their respective forums for their respective divisions, add it to the MDT and go through the database. Edit a previous post to hyperlink one thing or the other, all the while you've already made whatever money you've lost and congratulations, you've recouped your losses.

 

It's absolutely an OOC problem because driving like so is not IC driven.

 

You write it off as something that's easy, but there's a lot of things to do after issuing a citation.

Now imagine doing this, but x50 because realistically, you'll catch at least 50 truckers doing the same shit in a single patrol. Congratulations, you're just a glorified ticket machine and you're playing a roleplay server without having fun in the slightest because it's an absolute slog to do.

 

Truckers aren't roleplaying for the most part. Holding W isn't roleplay. There's always the 1%, but they're not the problem. People who bust a U-turn in the middle of a highway just to minmax their profits — are.

 

Not to mention, I haven't really seen (or heard of) trucking companies cracking down on such behavior.

[Koko]

2 minutes ago, Wirbelwind said:

And this is why combating it is simply not a plausible solution. You practically just stated that you don't care about a fine, it just means a bit of money lost on your route.

Just to be clear, I write in the first person because I am a trucker RPer and I don't intend to write from a position of personal RP elitism as I am a part of this RP industry regardless of what I do or don't RP. I'm simply acknowledging that the industry has problems, but if you see the time I have been in a trucking company with my number of deliveries compared to some of my peers, it's very easy to guess that I'm likely not speeding around like a maniac. I do care about fines, which is why I haven't had a single fine issued yet. I'm just talking about what I assume is the mental justification of others.

 

5 minutes ago, Wirbelwind said:

You write it off as something that's easy, but there's a lot of things to do after issuing a citation.

Now imagine doing this, but x50 because realistically, you'll catch at least 50 truckers doing the same shit in a single patrol. Congratulations, you're just a glorified ticket machine and you're playing a roleplay server without having fun in the slightest because it's an absolute slog to do.

I didn't mean to imply it was easy, I'm sure it's a slog, and I do apologize if I sounded overly simplistic in my answer. It's just a bit disheartening to read that it's such an issue that few immediate solutions are on the horizon, because that's just the road of the script disappearing altogether. If it wasn't clear, I'm on the side of stopping reckless trucking.

9 minutes ago, Wirbelwind said:

Truckers aren't roleplaying for the most part. Holding W isn't roleplay. There's always the 1%, but they're not the problem. People who bust a U-turn in the middle of a highway just to minmax their profits — are.

I do think the driving aspect is RP in itself. It fills the streets, and gives the illusion of a lived-in world. Which is why I think it's worth preserving, provided we work on removing the problematic elements.

[Dom.]

I posted a suggestion a while ago because I personally wanted an experience more akin to Elite Trucking.

 

The grind is tedious and unenjoyable.