Current State of Extorting Businesses

[Ink]

2 minutes ago, DjoleK said:

It is merely loud minority that is always coming forward. People that have positive/neutral experiences with such roleplay don't feel the need to go and make threads like STATE OF EXTORTION IS GREAT etc...

Usually whenever something is brought up, it is brought up in negative light simply because that's only reason people wish to bring it up.

 

 

You're absolutely correct to discuss the effects of negativity bias on creating a more visible public response from those who have had experiences with the more visible poor roleplayers. Someone else in this thread had also spoken on how well-roleplayed extortion is very difficult to see. These are valid points, and as always, I acknowledge gladly that GTA:W has some really awesome roleplayers. Overall, I'd say the roleplay quality of this server is above average, and that's excellent. I know there are plenty of people out there capable of doing good extortion roleplay (even if extortion as it is portrayed in GTA:W is highly unrealistic). 

 

That being said, I do want to point out that the only people who have spoken in defense of the state of extortion roleplay in this server are personally roleplaying criminals who extort, or who have associates who extort. Many people have come into this thread claiming that a lot of extortion roleplay on this server is "unique and interesting" and that it benefits "all parties involved." I'd imagine on a server as big as GTA:W with as many businesses and legal RPers as GTA:W that there'd have to be at least one person who would come into this thread and offer their unbiased support for the extortion roleplay they've experienced.

 

If I even heard one legal RPer tell a positive extortion RP they've had on GTA:W and how it's benefit their RP, I know that would lend a lot more credibility to the criminal RPers who are trying to argue that all these upset people in this thread are "just exaggerating."

[my_g]

13 minutes ago, Ink said:

As opposed to the biased perspective of the criminal roleplayers defending their cash cow?

I'm just stating that your "accounts" probably come from a biased perspective. Personally I don't currently participate in any extortion rp.

19 minutes ago, Ink said:

I have enough of a statistically relevant sample size that I can fairly make the claim.

I disagree, you've stated yourself you've never been extorted nor committed any extortion's and try to stay away from illegal rp %100, so I don't think you have enough knowledge on the situation to make a claim like that. 

20 minutes ago, Ink said:

I have yet to see a single legal roleplayer pop into this thread (or anywhere) to say "yeah I got extorted on GTA:W and the RP was super fun and interesting, I applaud everything about the RP, really thankful for these dudes for taking the time with me it was awesome." Yet I see a lot of criminal RPers whose characters participate in extortion popping in here and claiming it's great roleplay.

I'd be concerned if someone was that exited to have been extorted.

26 minutes ago, Ink said:

I am not qualified to respond to this point. I've heard people generally express a sentiment that IFM can do more. Which is fair, it's a volunteer position as someone else stated, and as someone who has run IFM on multiple other servers I know it's a very challenging position. But what I'm seeing a lot of in this thread is that although the criminal roleplayers like to parrot "It's an IC problem, keep it IC!" almost everyone acknowledges the importance of OOC moderation of poor portrayal. And a lot of this extortion that's happening is absolutely poor portrayal which leans on the difficulty of investigative RP happening in our heavy RP server.

The majority of factions on the server are held to a high standard and proper portrayal is maintained pretty well (although it's still a game, it will never be completely true to life)

34 minutes ago, Ink said:

I know my roleplay creates RP for other people, that people are excited to roleplay with me, and that I have never had anyone express any OOC frustration at me because of the effects of my roleplay on them. I would prefer to let others speak of my roleplay quality if at all.

Illegal rp does all of those things, it's just that you personally are not interested in it, that doesn't mean others aren't.

36 minutes ago, Ink said:

Approximately two decades of study in the subject, a decent amount of real life experience being around American crime, having lived with organized criminals, having owned businesses, having lived in Los Angeles, New York, and multiple other major American cities, and my real life profession has me in tune with a lot of the gossip of my city both clean and dirty. I don't purport to be an expert on the level of a real world professional in criminal investigation, but I believe that I have more than enough qualification to speak with a degree of confidence on matters of real world criminality in major American metropolises. I would be willing to wager that within this community there are not many who may credibly claim to have substantially more knowledge on the subject without also claiming that they themselves work as police investigators or are personally involved in an American organized criminal organization. Every now and then I'll see people claim that they have connections, but they live in a country like Serbia, or Bulgaria, and the criminal environment of those countries are not similar to the ones portrayed by our server.

Okay fair enough, I'll take your word for it. But at the end of the day, even if you are a criminal investigator the vast majority of criminal activity remains unknown to authorities and the general public. 

43 minutes ago, Ink said:

You realize that that's just when I joined the forum, right?

I assumed you created it the same time you joined, my mistake. When did you join?

[jcat]

On 6/26/2020 at 10:17 AM, Henning said:

Which is WILDLY unrealistic.

 

 

Only because in reality law enforcement is far, far more effective and organized crime is far, far more dangerous than the IC situation we have on the server.  Normal people know that going to the police is the best chance they have.

 

The situation on the server is much more like a small town in the Wild West, with many small groups of armed criminals, ineffective law enforcement, and a somewhat larger group of civilian individuals and small business owners.  The big difference is that law enforcement is much more effective at suppressing the civilians' ability to arm themselves and defend their lives and property, whereas in the Wild West most people were armed and law enforcement probably wouldn't care if a known criminal got himself killed while committing a crime.

 

Under these conditions it is highly reasonable, and quite possibly legal, for the business owner to open fire on criminals who threaten him.

 

What is unreasonable is for the business owner to go to another criminal group to sort the problem out.

 

The business owner would be a party to all sorts of crimes, and he would only consider this if law enforcement were so non-functional that there would be little chance of him being held legally accountable for his dealings with organized crime.  Even then he would be indebted to the gangsters who 'helped' him with his problem, and enmeshed in their influence.

 

Given that law enforcement falls more heavily on civilian characters than on criminal characters, I don't think the server is to the point of law enforcement being that non-functional.

 

The trouble is, it has to be like this.  If the server rules and IC law enforcement policies were balanced, civilians would arm themselves, criminals would would keeping robbing them and extorting them because that's their core rp, civilians would form militias and protect themselves because it's a fucking bore to have to play the victim over and over, then the criminal gangs would take revenge, and the server would turn into this:

 

 

and then this...

 

 

 

then this...

 

 

 

 

And then this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by jcat
typo

[DLimit]

I've had a character that was extorted, effectively, by The Conti Crew, as he was obligated to pay them $8,000 a week in exchange for access to firearms and protection. Overtime, it developed into a C.K. due to legitimate I.C. reasons. However, it was an interesting experience that had lasted over a month, as the extortion was conducted through "mutual interests" rather than through fear.

 

There are numerous variables that contribute to an effective and enjoyable "Extortion" experience. If you're the type that cannot handle being a victim in a heavy role play server? Then, it's a P2W mentality, which should be readjusted if one desires to roleplay on the server... utilize one's consequences to develop one's character. If it's an issue revolving around poor portrayal of R.P.? Then, REPORT THEM. REPORT THEM. REPORT THEM.

Edited July 1, 2020 by DLimit

[Mecovy]

Personally I don't like it only because of how many people will try and do it. Extortion and Robberies can be fun, but not if you're like a conveyor belt with every gang under the sun taking turns to rob you (my 2017 experience). Isolated, its fun and can add depth.

[rootless cosmopolitan]

Average day in the life of a master extortionist™ on GTAW

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by rootless cosmopolitan

[DasFroggy]

On 6/29/2020 at 8:41 PM, my_g said:

I'd be concerned if someone was that exited to have been extorted.

Perhaps not extorted, however the most recent mugging was actually quite fun. As opposed to the five second "/b show /inv or ill kill you", the muggers actually took time to search, asked what I was comfortable with giving up, and even went to some effort to let me participate in more ways than just showing my inventory. I gave them a fairly generous assortment of inventory items and cash as a result.

 

If a criminal organization was similarly mindful, extortion roleplay would be both welcomed and fun.

Edited July 1, 2020 by DasFroggy

[my_g]

3 hours ago, DasFroggy said:

Perhaps not extorted, however the most recent mugging was actually quite fun. As opposed to the five second "/b show /inv or ill kill you", the muggers actually took time to search, asked what I was comfortable with giving up, and even went to some effort to let me participate in more ways than just showing my inventory. I gave them a fairly generous assortment of inventory items and cash as a result.

 

If a criminal organization was similarly mindful, extortion roleplay would be both welcomed and fun.

Majority of people won't feel this way though, however good the rp may be most people are always gonna be mad when they get screwed over.

[Torlo]

8 minutes ago, my_g said:

Majority of people won't feel this way though, however good the rp may be most people are always gonna be mad when they get screwed over.

It's not about that at all, losing can be rather fun my character losses a lot since he's not a good fighter and he's very afraid of confrontation. But every time I've been involved in extortion it's always been sub par, they walk in during business hours when the place is packed and demand the owner, it's really poorly done most of the time.

[my_g]

1 minute ago, Torlo said:

It's not about that at all, losing can be rather fun my character losses a lot since he's not a good fighter and he's very afraid of confrontation. But every time I've been involved in extortion it's always been sub par, they walk in during business hours when the place is packed and demand the owner, it's really poorly done most of the time.

again that's great and all but most people simply don't share this attitude, even if they may say they do to support their narrative. It's commonplace for people to be angry when they're character is fucked over, whether it be getting robbed, extorted or whatever, it's natural even.