Pan Grama

I think it's a very short-sighted player who would create a criminal, commit a crime and then quit when faced with a punishment they didn't want to do. I kinda agree with you about the player being punished for the character, but I've always believed that RP works best when IC and OOC are working together. If a player is aware that jail is boring and long then maybe they would consider the crime they're about to do. Is it worth the jail time? The player and character are having the same thoughts. That has to be a good thing, right? Like I said in my previous post, I am all for a prison system. However, character crime without fear of character punishment is a bad state. Character crime with player punishment is not ideal either, but better than the former. In my opinion anyway. I was just trying to say that a prison system needs to serve a purpose. If that purpose is to provide exciting Prison RP for players, then that's fine. Is it possible to do that and also act as a deterrent for criminals? I'm not sure. That daunting task falls to the admin.

You should be punished for RPing a criminal. That's the trade-off for being a criminal. Someone who RPs a law abiding citizen doesn't have to worry about that kind of thing. If you're faced with 36 hours of boredom because you were caught committing a crime, then maybe you'll think about that before you do the crime. On the flip side, if a functioning prison system is developed and, as the brand-new feature, everybody wants to try it, how are players going to get their characters into prison? Commit a serious crime and intentionally get caught? I'm all for a prison system. I know a lot of people who are waiting for it to happen. But it needs to serve a purpose. If Prison RP is fun, then it's rewarding players for RPing a criminal. This in itself isn't a bad thing, but a prison system's main purpose should be to act as a deterrent for players to commit crime and remove their characters from the streets if they get caught. Let's not lose sight of that.

With the addition of unique items which will lead to crime investigation and forensics, having a semi-functional prison system would make detective work all the more rewarding.

Exactly this. When I first joined GTAW and had no idea what I was doing. II ended up at the Garbage Depot by sheer chance. A guy was just going out and he asked me did I want to tag along. So I did. He essentially taught me both GTAW and RP at the same time. We talked in-character while we drove around picking up garbage. When I found out about the clothes store, I made 2 outfits. A street outfit and my garbage clothes. I would log in every day and do a couple of garbage runs, dressed in the outfit, and would ask anyone I saw hanging around to come with me. We even started a little community of garbage workers who would sms each other and ask if we were "working". It was a good ice breaker for new players. We'd honk the horn as we passed each other and someone even set up a radio channel that the trucks used and we'd chat to each other while we picked up trash. GTAW was being a Garbage guy for me for at least the first month that I was here. And I loved it. I'd do a couple of runs a day and treat it as being at work. $3K a day was disposable cash for me and I'd spend it in the clubs at night buying rounds and tipping. I'd still do it if I was able to. I understand that people see scripted jobs as a problem, but it isn't fair to just remove something entirely because it's regarded as non-RP. Somebody somewhere may enjoy doing it for the sake of doing it. I'm honestly hoping that the Garbage job is going to be developed and not just removed because grinding.

I think the $200K is a great feature that gives players a tool to create a character with a history. I used my paychecks to buy a used car and a modest apartment because that seemed like the RP thing to do. I have about $50K in the bank which I treat like my savings. I never felt rich when I was receiving the huge paychecks. In fact I found it quite slow and would've preferred to have had the cash all at once so I could set up my character straight away rather than RP living somewhere when I didn't own/rent a place. I never liked the fact that I owned a car but didn't own an apartment. As a legal character I never spent cash on drugs or guns and, without wanting to be rude, I think it's the shortsightedness of players to see the paychecks as a crock of gold.

Man oh man, I'm struggling with this. On one hand I like the idea of cars being parked in driveways and in parking lots. But on the the hand I do believe that this raises more immersion breaking that benefits. Personally I've never had too big an issue with sync. However I get that people who drive in large groups (MCs, Street Racers) experience it. I have no experience to comment on whether sync a big enough problem. My issue is that it seems to be a feature that was introduced without balance. We can no longer "park" our cars, but there is no system in place to compensate from that. I get that we can park it in a garage, but not all homes have a garage. In fact, some of the poorest areas, most likely to suffer from vehicle crime, have none at all. Characteristic? Maybe. In fact, forget all that, I'm just gonna say it. We removed the ability to script rob stores because it was being abused. And now we've added a feature that essentially allows people to script rob vehicles. How are these two different? I have no doubt that vehicle thefts are gonna be abused. Was this even considered when removing vPark? Any feature added to a MMO system needs to be considered fully. Think about the worst possible outcome that can happen with a feature, and then accept that as a certainty. If that certainty is acceptable, then the feature should be included. Personally, I'm not looking forward to logging in to RP and having to spend the next few hours tracking down my car. Once is a sub-plot. More than once is a chore.

Short description: Add an optional parameter to the /outfit command to quick load an outfit. Detailed description: Using /outfit # quickly loads the #th outfit removing the sight of standing with your arms extended scrolling through your outfits. Using /outfit with no parameters brings up the menu as it does now. Commands to add: /outfit [id] Items to add: N/A How would your suggestion improve the server? This is a very minimal quality of life improvement that would speed up players' ability to change outfits and removes the OOC of watching people scroll through their clothes. Additional information: This should be placed at the lowest possible priority and should only even be considered if it is a quick and easy feature to implement.

OK so I want to reply to the $5000 per paycheck issue first. The number was arbitrary. It was just a f'rinstance to show what I meant by a large amount. The prices can be anything the devs like based on how much they was $1 to be worth in the game's economy. If the base unemployed paycheck is £200, then the supercar tax could be $250. That way there is no feasible way that someone unemployed could own and maintain a supercar. Which is how it should be. Now say someone gets a job, scripted or RP that pays $400 per paycheck. $250 goes on a supercar. Then take away fuel and rent (my suggestion is kinda how properties are working now anyway) they could be left with very little per week. Which is their own fault for owning a supercar. Living beyond their means. In this case fishing or mining or whatever serves no other purpose than topping up their wage. Cash becomes an RP prop rather than a means to get stuff. It then forces people to role-play the position they are in. It might not be what the player wants, but we're directly trying to reduce the type of OOC cars here. If someone works in a bar and they're getting $300 per paycheck, they drive a car that they can afford. Don't look at it as a tax, it's the cost of your lifestyle. Now I'm not suggesting that people will be forced to work in a bar when their background is a law school graduate. But faction jobs pay a wage. You may need to perform some minimal job once a day/week just to qualify for the paycheck, but the fact is, you're ICly working as a lawyer or whatever and they pay is higher than being unemployed. A Grove Street banger is not going to be able to ICly join a law firm and earn lawyer paychecks. He is going to be able to join a Set and earn dealer paychecks. The lawyer may want to show off and drive a car that he can't really afford and walk around with $50 in his pocket. The banger might drive a 40 year old car and be carrying $1000. These all seem like realistic scenarios to me. I think the tax (repayment) should be ignorant of how you use the car. ICly you own it. Whether you drive it only on a weekend or not is irrelevant. If you want a hobby car, you drive what you can afford. Or maybe even sink all your cash into it like people do IRL. If you work in a bar you still shouldn't be allowed to own a supercar, even if you only use it once a week. My suggestion would eradicate the need for the $5K paycheck. When the player starts they are given some cash. Not a lot but enough to get started. Say $2000. Now say an Asea costs $1700 and has an upkeep of $50. The player is unemployed but instantly has access to a low end vehicle that they can buy. They earn $200 pp for being unemployed. They can easily afford to maintain their car. I hold to my idea. The numbers, I agree, need to be discussed. But I genuinely think this is a real solution to changing player's attitudes towards what constitutes an affordable car for their character. Please, anyone challenge my idea, or suggest changes to it. I very much want this to be considered.

I've made this a new thread because I have a lot to say on the new proposed proposed solution to the luxury cars epidemic and I didn't want make a large reply in the main thread. I propose that a single tax be applied to each car that a player owns that is taken automatically from every paycheck. The tax is linked to the car itself. Some low-end vehicles may be exempt, mid range may have nominal taxes, luxury cars pay more and supercars pay a ridiculous amount. Let me explain my reasoning for this. The first reason is that it cuts down on unnecessary red tape. There is no true RP value to having to wait for a player to be online so we can go to an office and fill in forms. We've seen it before with people waiting for firearms licenses or getting their cars from the impound. Secondly, it's a relatively simple system to apply. I think it may already be in the code and not used cos people didn't like paying $20 per vehicle when one is a Faggio and the other is a Bati. Thirdly, and this is the reason why I am so for my own idea, it automatically adds an in-character factor to the game. This is the part I want to explain and may become quite long, even though I'll try and keep it short. Imagine we have a Strawberry gangster RPing as a drug dealer. He may make a few thousand dollars a day from RP. It may even be an official faction job that pays him a few thousand dollars per paycheck. Over time this is going to build up to the point where he can afford a nice car. We now have a hood rat who sells weed driving an expensive car and robbing people and liqueur stores. It doesn't make sense. Imagine we have a player who's been playing for a few months and has built up a good faction, legal or illegal, that brings in the big bucks. She owns 5 supercars and drives around like city like a crazy bastard, when in reality she should be a respectable part of the community if legal, or not wanting to bring attention to her if illegal. These two characters are opposites of the RP food chain, yet they have the same attitudes and access to the same vehicles. Now imagine that there was a $5000 per paycheck tax on a supercar. The hood rat can only really afford that if he sells a lot of weed. Or robs a lot of stores. Either way, it isn't really a viable way to live. He'll always be poor and may even get into negative cash just by owning an OOC car. The faction leader is in the same position with the 5 supercars. No job is gonna pay $25,000 per paycheck so it's decision time. Own one good car. The players are forced to RP within their character's means, which automatically adds an RP element to the game; You see a player riding around in a Jester, you automatically have an idea of how much that person is earning. Because they can afford a Jester. You see a Baller riding around in a modded Chino, you have an idea of what kind of gangsta he is. It all encourages players to get RP jobs, that pay paycheck money that allow them to own cars. It also eliminates people's ability to grind cash for cars. If you're spending an hour fishing to get the cash, your paycheck is gonna tick and you have to pay. You may be able to fish for a few weeks to be able to afford a good car, but once you own it, you're not going to be able to maintain it. Simply fishing or mining for hours is not going to make you richer. Now there would need to be a discussion on how to handle people spending cash on a car that they can't afford to maintain, because nobody is going to want to play a character in debt. We get enough of that shit IRL. Mainly, it shouldn't be possible to afford a car if your paycheck doesn't cover the tax, despite how much cash you have. Kinda like a credit check and refusal. Secondly, if a player buys a car and then loses the ability to pay for it, then their paycheck could actually be a negative number. Then their cash is going to eke away over time. If it ever gets to the point where they can no longer afford the paycheck, then the car can default and be taken from them. All IC of course. I do propose that the actual cost of the cars come down. Maybe by a factor of 10, to signify the fact that you're buying a money pit. Look at it as a downpayment, and the paycheck are the repayments. This would also keep the used car market alive. This is just my proposition and reasoning behind it. I welcome any criticism about things that I may have been too simple in explaining, or more importantly any glaring mistakes I've made. Thanks for getting to the end.

I think I agree with this. It's stated that "Increasing the purchase price of the vehicles won't help" yet the very first suggestion is to apply a 20% vehicle registration. Effectively increasing the price of the car by 20%. The easiest and simplest solution would be to tax the vehicle automatically from the paycheck. Make it a % of the vehicle cost, or price by class or speed, any can work, but make it expensive. Ideally more than the actual paycheck itself unless they have a job that provides the cash to cover it. This cuts down on all the bureaucracy and development. It also works in-character too as you'll need to be employed in something high paying in order to be able to afford it. We see a player driving an expensive Af car, we know he's a lawyer or doctor. Or gangster.

I've thought about whether Playable NPCs (PNPCs?) would benefit the game. A player signs up to be a PNPC and is vetted/denied like the other staff. Maybe players with a few months history and a record of good RP. Approved PNPCs would be like the mechanics are now, with certain permissions of the premises they are working in. How they differ though, is a player would be able to "switch" into the PNPC when they are needed. Say a character enters a 24/7, all online Players with PNPC status are given a flag that a character is needed in a store, again like a mechanic now. However the player that accepts it is immediately transported to the location, maybe with a different look and uniform, and role-plays working there. When the RP is finished, the PNPC "ends" the job and is transported back to their original character and location. This would create the impression of IC staff without the need for a character to stand around in a store/garage/reception waiting for RP. The player goes to the RP, not the other way around. The PNPC players will be able to turn on and off their availability and maybe even given a wage for it. I don't think I've explained it very well; I'm kinda writing from an idea that's been bouncing around in my head. And again, I'm not sure if it even is a good idea. But I thought I'd add it to an NPC thread and see what people think.

Gmail accounts also allow you to "append a plus ("+") sign and any combination of words or numbers after your email address."

I would like your permission to use this as my band's name.

If you buy a vehicle new you're usually allowed to choose what colour you want. As an addendum to this suggestion, maybe make resprays very expensive. That way there is decision making on whether to get the colour you want, or buy used and pay to respray. All IC of course.

You don't really need it to say locked, unlocked or even status. Replace the speedometer icon with the coloured dot.

Inside and outside voice. I dig it.

What is the legality of off-road tires in the city? And is there a negative to using them on roads, like slower acceleration and longer stopping distances?

Banned for riding your Sanches like this: When you should've been riding it like this:

This is one of those ideas that seem great on paper and could also create some amazing movie style Heist RP. If it's done properly. And therein lies the hook. What would essentially happen is that the Money Truck would be robbed every time it goes out. In fact I imagine there being a queue of gangs lining up to be the first to rob it. Now as long as everyone involved is OK with this kind of scenario, then there isn't a problem. However, how would the Truck Driver role-play being held up at gunpoint every single time s/he goes out? Let's say s/he survives the first three. The fourth time out, that driver is gonna be packing a shotgun/SMG and be completely ready to use it. In fact, I'd say a bit too keen. This kind of scenario has the potential to escalate quickly to the point where it's gonna be a gun siege every time. Again, this isn't necessarily a bad thing. But with crazy gun fights come the complaints. I'm all for Heist RP. And @Rekhoem is definitely on to something with the idea. But I think it should fall under Group Robbery in the rules and be pre-agreed upon and admin supervised. I'd vote yes, with very specific conditions.

As a native English speaker I know it's easy for me to say that this is an English server so it should be 100% English. And while I don't necessarily disapprove of something like non-English threads, cos I do understand that sometimes, someone wants to think and just "be" in their native language, I do have a hard time agreeing with creating something that would intentionally lock out players. I know it's not really the same thing, but would you approve a thread that only allowed IPs from the UK or USA?

Because everyone is coked off their tits and never eats,

Ever wish you could delete a post?

So I'm not gonna excuse myself right now, but I'm just back from the pub and I'm pretty fucking drunk. I got home and I had the idea to log in and have a bit of a drive around on my character cos I'm digging GTAW right now.. I log in and /vget my vehicle and go for a drive. Almost straight away I realise that I'm far too drunk to drive and turn around and drive back to my parking spot to /vpark it cos I'm bollocksed. I log out and then it hits me. My typing, right now, is terrible. This is taking me fucking minutes to type and then re-read to fix my mistakes. No way am I capable of RP typeing in real-time. So how would this translate into role-play. If a cop had caught me driving like I was and pulled me over, I would not have been able to RP cos it's taking me so long to type right now. What rules am I breaking? Does my character get arrested for being drunk? Or do I personally get A-Jailed for OOC?

All the rules are subjective. Who decides how far a character can fall before s/he's hurt? Or how fast you're traveling when you hit a signpost before your car is damaged? The rules are there to provide some kind of real-world perspective to a video game engine being used a role-play platform. What I've always wanted to know is, why would someone choose to come to a Heavy Role Play server, and then drive around like it's GTA Online?

I think DaHes pretty much nails it here. While I understand that a player would want to get the drop on another player I don't think it's fair to simply declare "{Player1} rushes {Player2}" and then start FlappyBirding your mouse button. Player2 could be in the middle of typing and not even looking at the screen. But his character would most certainly be looking at the guy he's having an altercation with. Even if you argue that Player1 is attacking first and has the initiative, Player2 could still be locked in a chatbox and isn't capable of IC defending himself just as a reaction. Text based combat, done properly, should enter some kind of phase where both players agree on it, kind've like 9.0 Offensive Roleplay. The player who declares the phase should be the one to go first and the defender can't react till it starts. I know this all seems simple in a forum post and IC combat tends to be heated, but implementing some kind of official start to combat would prevent a lot of these kinds of complaints. Edit: This obviously shouldn't apply to stealth attacks.