Would you like it if there was a juvenile and sometimes 18+ year old prisoners talk to the minors?

[Snoof]

I think segregation in prison is either something we should go fully realistic or fully unrealistic with. Either separate people the way they're supposed to be separated to preserve realism or put everybody together to maximize the potential for interaction and make it crystal clear that it is that way ICly. going for something in between the way we're doing right now just puts it in a weird state where you can't really fully embrace either version of reality and that makes the incarceration experience pretty hard to feel immersed in imo.

 

I think Juvie could absolutely work, but if you want people to actually care about it it has to be something other than just regular prison with smaller inmates. Make it different in some interesting way. Maybe Juvie's a lower security type prison, bigger dorm-like cells shared by lots of inmates instead of regular 2-man cells. Maybe meal and rec areas are co-ed in Juvie since nobody in there's a sex-offender and people get to interact with people they don't normally get to interact with in a jail setting without it being weird. People don't have the kind of concrete expectations for what Juvie is like that they do for prison so I think it's a great opportunity to create an environment that's built to foster RP instead of being as 'real' as possible. 

[eTaylor]

35 minutes ago, Snoof said:

I think segregation in prison is either something we should go fully realistic or fully unrealistic with. Either separate people the way they're supposed to be separated to preserve realism or put everybody together to maximize the potential for interaction and make it crystal clear that it is that way ICly. going for something in between the way we're doing right now just puts it in a weird state where you can't really fully embrace either version of reality and that makes the incarceration experience pretty hard to feel immersed in imo.

 

I think Juvie could absolutely work, but if you want people to actually care about it it has to be something other than just regular prison with smaller inmates. Make it different in some interesting way. Maybe Juvie's a lower security type prison, bigger dorm-like cells shared by lots of inmates instead of regular 2-man cells. Maybe meal and rec areas are co-ed in Juvie since nobody in there's a sex-offender and people get to interact with people they don't normally get to interact with in a jail setting without it being weird. People don't have the kind of concrete expectations for what Juvie is like that they do for prison so I think it's a great opportunity to create an environment that's built to foster RP instead of being as 'real' as possible. 

The population doesn’t exist to support it

[Mistery14]

A "Beyond Scared Straight" in real life works because a majority of the prisoners are still decent human beings at heart, they know what's good, but in LS? Nah, I doubt it'd work. People are gonna swing and shank those teens left and right like punching balls as soon as they step in.

[DLimit]

3 hours ago, Mistery14 said:

A "Beyond Scared Straight" in real life works because a majority of the prisoners are still decent human beings at heart, they know what's good, but in LS? Nah, I doubt it'd work. People are gonna swing and shank those teens left and right like punching balls as soon as they step in.

Not with the threat of ad-seg for months to years on end. I.E. Caulfield nearly catching life in Seg after shanking a prison guard.

A lot of these programs provide inmates with incentives for participating in the program, as-well, so people who sign up would more than likely comply. They'd more than likely assign Trustees, as-well, into the program.

I actually think it would be the opposite. More like the 14-17 year-old gang-bangers won't portray fear.

[Engelbert]

I think we have enough juvenile characters on the server, to warrant a legit creation of a juvie department.

[TeaEnjoyer51]

I definetly think there's enough (M)'s in jail to have a juvie. Even if you don't see them IG they might just be waiting the time out so they don't have to RP with 40 year olds that are locked up for life.

I find it weird how my 14 year old character can get arrested for tagging up a wall and resisting arrest, and sit at the table with a 40 y.o that's spent his whole life in jail and is in there for a triple homicide. So the only time I really do get IG in jail to RP is when my other (M) faction members get IG to RP in jail with me. Jail isn't even THAT active from what I've seen. Imagine like 4 or 5 minor characters in juvenile, that's more than enough people to have some amazing RP! Especially if there's interesting stuff to do in juvenile. 

+ There's a whole lot of discords for jail, The black car, etc. People could just do what they do already... And let people know if they are going IG on Juvenile. I genuinenly think there's enough minors in jail at the same time to have a juvenile. 

[Handshakes And Gang Signs]

The current system for youth offenders really doesn't make a lot of sense. I agree sometimes minors will be charged as an adult but thats for the most part excusive to murder or a frequent offender being seventeen. 1+ for a youth detention center or at the very least a camp. 

[Snoof]

14 hours ago, eTaylor said:

The population doesn’t exist to support it

Doesn't it though? There's 600 people on the server while I'm writing this. If 1% of them were RPing in Juvie, you'd have plenty of people to RP with in there. I don't think that's far-fetched at all.

[eTaylor]

1 hour ago, Snoof said:

Doesn't it though? There's 600 people on the server while I'm writing this. If 1% of them were RPing in Juvie, you'd have plenty of people to RP with in there. I don't think that's far-fetched at all.

That’s assuming the intake of new juveniles surpasses the outflow of those that served their time. Even if it incidentally does because of a specific incident, it never surpasses outflow. Meaning that you always have a declining population. And that’s not accounting for the fact that not every juvenile is interested in juvenile detention roleplay. 1% of 600 players being in juvie amounts to 6 players. You can’t guarantee all of those 6 players are going to stay for the juvie roleplay. Even assuming the that they are most juveniles are arrested for misdemeanor petty crime, or a handful of specific felonies that wouldn’t send them beyond juvie. People also rarely get arrested simultaneously or for the same charges. Spread those 6 people out across a single day and you’ll have inmates relieving each other. Add time zones as a variable and you’ll have even less clustered around specific hours. Add the fact that the jail system on GTAW is pretty dependent on guards and factions, which are also inconsistent in availability. Then there’s human behavior and the fact that a lot of people log out after getting processed, meaning that the arrests that are made often only start being interactive in the system hours or a day later, spreading that number further. I could go on. 

Edited March 21, 2023 by eTaylor

[Snoof]

1 hour ago, eTaylor said:

That’s assuming the intake of new juveniles surpasses the outflow of those that served their time. Even if it incidentally does because of a specific incident, it never surpasses outflow. Meaning that you always have a declining population. And that’s not accounting for the fact that not every juvenile is interested in juvenile detention roleplay. 1% of 600 players being in juvie amounts to 6 players. You can’t guarantee all of those 6 players are going to stay for the juvie roleplay. Even assuming the that they are most juveniles are arrested for misdemeanor petty crime, or a handful of specific felonies that wouldn’t send them beyond juvie. People also rarely get arrested simultaneously or for the same charges. Spread those 6 people out across a single day and you’ll have inmates relieving each other. Add time zones as a variable and you’ll have even less clustered around specific hours. Add the fact that the jail system on GTAW is pretty dependent on guards and factions, which are also inconsistent in availability. Then there’s human behavior and the fact that a lot of people log out after getting processed, meaning that the arrests that are made often only start being interactive in the system hours or a day later, spreading that number further. I could go on. 

The server has a lot of teenage characters running around at this point and as a rule nearly every one of them is an active criminal. Sure it'll be less active at certain times of the day than others and there'll be good days and bad days, but that's true for literally every other concept on the server too. Just because something won't be a massive party all the time that doesn't mean it shouldn't exist. If it did, we should've stopped separating prisoners by gender a long time ago. All I ever hear about women's jail is how dead it is 90% of the time. 

 

The argument for Juvie existing on the server is that it doesn't make sense for underage kids to be thrown into lockup with all the experienced career-criminals and lifers, and that them being there actively makes the incarceration experience less immersive for both parties. I think a lot more people would be willing to RP out their time spent in lockup if it actually felt 'right'.

 

One of the reasons I proposed for it to have major differences from adult prison is in part to make it less reliant on guards and a dense population by pushing everybody closer together. I also don't think there should be such a thing as crimes that would send them 'beyond' juvie if this was to exist. Our regular prison doesn't have different security levels because we can all agree that that would stretch the population too thin, so why should the underage version?