radio callout hotkeys for LEO RPers

[undefined]

37 minutes ago, Perstephone said:

TeamSpeak is fine for pursuits. LEO chars should be OP. If you look at the rate of crime vs the rate of arrests it's ludicrous. My problem is that it is not JUST used in pursuits, in fact I was told recently after taking exception to a situation I saw videos of, it's perfectly acceptable to stay in TS while searching for someone after a situation has ended. 

 

IMO TS should represent an in car radio, you can't have both hands on your gun in the middle of a shoot out and reach for your radio... 

 

I have seen SO many examples of TS being abused and people just shrug it off. The line that it's only used for pursuits is BS and there needs to be some stricter rules or more scrutiny around its use. 

In regards to the first thing said - the Teamspeak channel for chasing in pursuit gets cleared out as soon as we lose visual for more than 10-15 seconds, unless told otherwise by the supervisor (which in almost 4 months in LSSD I have not seen a supervisor keep a TAC channel open for more than 20 seconds after we lose visual on a suspect).
Also to mention, the only person who talks in these channels when they're active are A) The lead unit updating direction for others B) Supervisor who monitors the exception.
The only circumstances where this isn't the case are mostly people calling out for others to watch out for traffic density on certain streets, and other things of that nature - I do not know a person who can write fast enough in IC to call these things out on time, and it's a common thing in real life.

On the second point of the in-car radio, I'll urge you to look into some clips of critical incidents on Youtube. Cops shoot with one hand and call it in with the other as soon as they're in cover / the suspect makes a pause in shooting or didn't hit them yet. Cops have the radio on their person for that very intention, as many incidents in South Central LA where a cop got killed in the 90s came as a byproduct of them not being able to reach their patrol car in time to call it in.

I do not know of incidents where people used channels to track people down or whatever you just said, and I'm speaking in my time in the LSSD faction on here. Using Teamspeak when you can write is heavily frowned upon on our side as we still force a lot of stuff in our faction to be done with the means of an IC chat.

[Perstephone]

3 minutes ago, undefined said:

In regards to the first thing said - the Teamspeak channel for chasing in pursuit gets cleared out as soon as we lose visual for more than 10-15 seconds, unless told otherwise by the supervisor (which in almost 4 months in LSSD I have not seen a supervisor keep a TAC channel open for more than 20 seconds after we lose visual on a suspect).
Also to mention, the only person who talks in these channels when they're active are A) The lead unit updating direction for others B) Supervisor who monitors the exception.
The only circumstances where this isn't the case are mostly people calling out for others to watch out for traffic density on certain streets, and other things of that nature - I do not know a person who can write fast enough in IC to call these things out on time, and it's a common thing in real life.

On the second point of the in-car radio, I'll urge you to look into some clips of critical incidents on Youtube. Cops shoot with one hand and call it in with the other as soon as they're in cover / the suspect makes a pause in shooting or didn't hit them yet. Cops have the radio on their person for that very intention, as many incidents in South Central LA where a cop got killed in the 90s came as a byproduct of them not being able to reach their patrol car in time to call it in.

I do not know of incidents where people used channels to track people down or whatever you just said, and I'm speaking in my time in the LSSD faction on here. Using Teamspeak when you can write is heavily frowned upon on our side as we still force a lot of stuff in our faction to be done with the means of an IC chat.

 

"Heavily frowned upon." 

 

This is the company line that keeps being regurgitated. I've literally seen shooting orders being called over TS in hostage situations to someone in a sniper position. TS is abused ALL the time. This report was closed recently.

 

 

Where it appears someone is using TS after beng downed. I was told after the fact the voice is coming from the helicopter and sent this video.

 

https://youtu.be/PGBW-Bm4Gc8?t=1607

 

Where they are in TS communicating about people when they don't even know if they are suspects or not. And this is an ACCEPTABLE use of TS. TS has been used in riots in TTCF, it's been used as a way to make a kill order, to someone who was aiming at a guy holding a suspect. I defend the use of TS 100%, but it makes it very fucking hard, when everyone knows it's systematically abused and everyone just says "It's heavily frowned upon."

 

And what I meant, by when they're shooting. I mean a constant vocal stream of every little thing that happens while they are currently in an active shoot out. 

[Bubonic]

Sounds like a lag fest with a hint of wrong buttons being hit by accident, spamming the chat with a bunch of wrong information. TS3 communications are policed heavily by ES/CS and Staff so that it's not abused, it really is purely for call-outs until static.

[sCrax]

15 minutes ago, Perstephone said:

 

"Heavily frowned upon." 

 

This is the company line that keeps being regurgitated. I've literally seen shooting orders being called over TS in hostage situations to someone in a sniper position. TS is abused ALL the time. This report was closed recently.

 

 

Where it appears someone is using TS after beng downed. I was told after the fact the voice is coming from the helicopter and sent this video.

 

https://youtu.be/PGBW-Bm4Gc8?t=1607

 

Where they are in TS communicating about people when they don't even know if they are suspects or not. And this is an ACCEPTABLE use of TS. TS has been used in riots in TTCF, it's been used as a way to make a kill order, to someone who was aiming at a guy holding a suspect. I defend the use of TS 100%, but it makes it very fucking hard, when everyone knows it's systematically abused and everyone just says "It's heavily frowned upon."

 

And what I meant, by when they're shooting. I mean a constant vocal stream of every little thing that happens while they are currently in an active shoot out. 

LOL this is actually crazy.

[Bigg]

no

[Barbary]

Absolutely not.

[imi]

Wouldn't help to solve the issue; but yes metagaming via teamspeak is a massive issue currently, it isn't as sealed and tight as suggested by others and there's a lot more work that can be done to prevent unfair advantages given to LEOs when compared to illegals; particularly concerning issues raised above.

Edited August 6, 2022 by imi

[Stormy Monday]

no

[mj2002]

5 hours ago, Ink said:

Unfortunately, this is something which will never change. Using microphones for police work has been a facet of the GTA RP community since about 2008. Almost all the decision-makers in this community have spent their entire GTA RP careers where microphones were a requirement of LEO RP. For many of our players, mics have been a part of GTA LEO RP since before they were even old enough to play video games on their own. This, like many similar issues in GTA RP, is one of those things where the conservative faction makes the call, and the conservative faction can see no other alternative. In their mind, microphones are the only solution. Most of the people who even would have the power to change this standard have no reason to--the microphone standard works perfectly for their own needs, so why would they willingly strip some of the flexibility and special power that they have?

 

Microphone use has always and will always be a detriment to a text RP server. Voice chat splits the limited bandwidth of the human mind, and in all my experience RPing, I've only met a few players who truly and honestly could roleplay flawlessly while bullshitting about whatever else in voice chat. Doesn't matter if they're LEO, criminal, or whatever, people sitting in voice chat while RPing will often have more quiet characters, they will often engage in more non-verbal ("metagamed") communication [example: "look at this corner in the wall, doesn't it look silly?" or "oh, check out this guy walking up to us with the stupid outfit... what is he wearing!?"], they will frequently be prone to goofing around more, and ultimately they will not deliver as strong of a character portrayal while their mind is split (and dulled) with conversation droning in the background. Even in this community, when LEO RPers post videos--whether for fun, for reports, or for any other reason--they often have some bland chit-chat in the background entirely unrelated to what's happening IC. These are distractions, and definitely reduce RP quality--for some people by only a small amount, for some people by a considerable margin.

 

(Of course, I've had this conversation dozens of times before, and pro-mic people will swear up and down that their RP is flawless and 100% undistracted while they voice chat, which is almost certainly a lie, so it's kind of moot.)

 

We can argue to and fro about whether or not LEO RPers "need" microphones to give them some edge against criminal RPers, and I've always been on the fence about it. As someone who has been on all the sides of the RP spectrum, I've been on communities in the past where I played a LEO and sat in voice calls with a bunch of prepubescent British boys RPing badass tough police officer heroes in West Coast 1990s USA. Mics definitely helped. But no matter what, it's an unfair advantage that is given only to one group of players with no similar opportunities for other types. Although I appreciate GTA:W's community for making strict Teamspeak guidelines and including ways for disabled people to kiiiiinda take part in police RP, it's still not ideal. It makes no sense that criminals are not allowed to also use voice chat in tense situations such as shootouts or driving but police are. There's no real good OOC reason for this--that police are better trained? I mean, maybe, but LEO RPers do actual training which gives them an actual benefit in combat which most criminals do not bother to do, so it's not really fair to call mic use a compensation for IC training. That police have better equipment and tracking devices--true, and a legitimate argument, but of course there are other ways this could be portrayed through the game mode's script which does not involve a third party voice chat protocol.

 

 

 

This is all very sensible, but there are a few things missing.

 

The first is that, of course there is an OOC reason why only LEO factions are allowed to use microphones. Their use of microphones can be controlled, monitored and it is fairly easy to shut down abusers. This all comes from the fact that those allowed to use microphones are doing so in a administration operated voice server. This is not the case for other roleplayers, at this time anyway.

 

Another thing that's missing is an alternative solution. How would you solve this without cars having to slow down in the middle of a pursuit in order to type something out? As you mentioned, this conversation has been had dozens of times. I've never seen a decent solution to this problem. The proposed call outs by the first post in this topic really arent it, in my view.

[einxsa]

23 hours ago, mj2002 said:

 

This is all very sensible, but there are a few things missing.

 

The first is that, of course there is an OOC reason why only LEO factions are allowed to use microphones. Their use of microphones can be controlled, monitored and it is fairly easy to shut down abusers. This all comes from the fact that those allowed to use microphones are doing so in a administration operated voice server. This is not the case for other roleplayers, at this time anyway.

 

Another thing that's missing is an alternative solution. How would you solve this without cars having to slow down in the middle of a pursuit in order to type something out? As you mentioned, this conversation has been had dozens of times. I've never seen a decent solution to this problem. The proposed call outs by the first post in this topic really arent it, in my view.

it could work similar to the radio callouts system used in Valorant, which works near flawlessly to convey information to other people on your team for tactics and strategy, no reason it wouldn't work in GTAW.