The Corpse Problem

[Kari]

1 hour ago, FatCatTuxedo said:

There was under 40 bodies yesterday, half of which were in hidden places. So that leaves you 20 calls between PD and SD, surely thats not difficult to handle?

The issue herein sits in the fact that we don't WANT to just dispatch a single patrol car to deal with a homicide scene. 

If the scene is literally anything more than a body? you need 3-5 people to sit on a perimeter and lock it down, otherwise it becomes moot in court. And you should RP that, reasonably, this scene COULD go to court, even if you know with every fiber of your being it won't.

3-5 people for a perimeter turns into asking for a detective, or perhaps forensics. This turns into a longer wait, if not a no-show. 

After you pick up whatever evidence exists - if it does, you drive back to MRS and log it in evidence. 

This isn't a 5 minute respond; /do for coroners; leave. It's a 15-40 minute process per scene, provided it is a body that has any sign of unnatural death, and anything - even as small as a few casings around it.  

That's 10 hours, granted, spread across 2 factions, to handle every one of these calls. But it's still 10 hours of time that must be spent, often in high-crime areas where other crime will occur halfway through your scene and take precedent. And the same people aren't going to be doing these calls day in, day out. Likely not even multiple times a night. 

"20 calls for 2 factions" doesn't sound like a lot, until you factor in that these calls - when taken - do take time.

Unless the suggestion here is actually that we want cops to run up to a homicide, figure it out in 5 minutes, /sendtomorgue, spam Y on casings, and run off to the next one. Not to mention the distribution of calls is never constant, so you'll always have one faction picking up more slack. I don't think this is what the majority of people want. 

As much as I sympathize with the fact that sometimes; calls that are less fun simply.. aren't answered - it's not always this. Not everyone has the confidence to lead an investigation, or to respond to calls that are super involved. This confidence is built with time, the reason people don't pick up calls isn't always "it's not fun". It can be a period of heightened activity, a lack of confidence - prior knowledge of lack of resources, or, rather simply, the call just being missed. 

I was hopeful for this change at first, but it's only brought along body-snatchers and undue toxicity from the community. Genuinely, guys, if you want to help, join DMEC, join PD, join SD. Come help. You're welcome to. This is a hobby, at the end of the day, and we'd like to share it with you. But as a hobby, sometimes, stuff is ignored.

[ThatMuricanGuy]

People bitching about LEOs not wanting to sit on a scene with no viable evidence, leads, or actual avenues of roleplay other than calling a coroner and waiting for them to get there after 15-30 minutes. 

 

How about we address the insane amount of violence that makes the server look like Mogadishu in 1993 so we don't have to worry about the streets flooding with random ass uninvestigable bodies? Also shout out to those folks who can't roleplay already driving over their friend's bodies and picking them up and throwing them in their trunk like it's a loot crate they can open later. Glad you prefer a pixel gun over actual roleplay.  

[Kari]

25 minutes ago, zaXer. said:

 

Yes well guess what, that's what you signed up for. All server jobs have a boring side that you have to deal with.

And I'm not an illegal roleplay, I do legal roleplay and often have to resort to police and barely ever get any response.

I'm sorry you've had bad experiences, but please don't tell me what I did and didn't sign up for based off of them
And, again, if you want to be the kind of cop that responds to these calls - PD and SD hire on a monthly basis. 

[Kraethas]

2 minutes ago, Kari said:

I'm sorry you've had bad experiences, but please don't tell me what I did and didn't sign up for based off of them
And, again, if you want to be the kind of cop that responds to these calls - PD and SD hire on a monthly basis. 

 

If I didn't HAVE to get involved in TS to be in the factions, I would have considered a LEO character long ago rather than a low level solo criminal. Some times people may want to join a Faction but cannot due to RL reasons and restrictions.

 

HAVING said that....

 

There are a number of ways to go about this, depending on desire to put in the effort from players and Devs. 

 

1) As has already been said, make PK bodies "expire" after a while. Say an hour or two? Make CK bodies permanent. How? Easy. Let admins apply a "CK" flag on a body that makes it permanent. Easy to code? I don't know.

 

2) Let civilians be able to RP the whole thing with a command that can only be used after a call to 911 has gone unanswered. /civsendtomorgue

 

3) Least possible to happen, most immersive:

Give LEOs a command that will allow them to "catch a glimpse" of the log around the time of death, or go through the investigative RP, emote the gathering of evidence, submit everything in a forum report/UCP request and let an admin come back with the results at a later time. Similarly to 2, if no detective, forensics or DMEC is around, let the LEO emote the scene investigation taking place through /do with NPCs, and submit the request for evidence with as little involvement from the perpetrators as possible, to avoid any bad apples. 

[ThatMuricanGuy]

2 minutes ago, Kraethas said:

2) Let civilians be able to RP the whole thing with a command that can only be used after a call to 911 has gone unanswered. /civsendtomorgue

 

3) Least possible to happen, most immersive:

Give LEOs a command that will allow them to "catch a glimpse" of the log around the time of death, or go through the investigative RP, emote the gathering of evidence, submit everything in a forum report/UCP request and let an admin come back with the results at a later time. Similarly to 2, if no detective, forensics or DMEC is around, let the LEO emote the scene investigation taking place through /do with NPCs, and submit the request for evidence with as little involvement from the perpetrators as possible, to avoid any bad apples. 

2 will straight up be abused.

 

3. Admins already have enough on their plate and this just adds more. Based on my experience in a lot of investigations (Was a Captain in PD doing DB stuff) the moment any kind of NPC stuff gets involved in a case, you start to get the MG/PG accusations thrown around and it just leads to a non-favorable experience for both sides. 

[Miami]

I think a lot of people are missing the point of this update. The whole point of making corpses save is to deter criminals from committing murders. It won't happen on its own but if the police conducts their investigations, finds the murderer, and slap the character with a long jail sentence, with enough murderers locked up, people with established characters will think twice before jumping to murder. 

 

It's meant to give an IC and OOC incentive for people to RP the fear of committing a murder. PK or CK.

 

The real conversation should be about jail times for murderers, murders done by new or throwaway characters, and what happens if a convicted murderer changes names.

[Kari]

6 minutes ago, Kraethas said:

 

If I didn't HAVE to get involved in TS to be in the factions, I would have considered a LEO character long ago rather than a low level solo criminal. Some times people may want to join a Faction but cannot due to RL reasons and restrictions.

 

 

i get this!! i personally have a disability preventing me from speaking!! we also have a deaf member! when there's a will there's a way.

LFM give out no-mic permissions for a variety of reasons, you can always try your hand at explaining your situation. TS isn't truly a requirement, albeit, pursuits are coordinated there. 

I think PK bodies expiring at the restart; while CK's stay, is a healthy fix! Most of the time, cops get way more RP from CK scenes anyways. (And they're easier to navigate! lesser chance of running into a dead man walking or having weird meta concerns as such.)

Edited July 27, 2023 by Kari

[Chaozuo]

3 hours ago, joshua said:

 

your reply was so good that i'm going to ask kilerbite to let you back into prestige. incredible job.

You're pressed bro, Walk outside, Take a breather.

 

PD saying that they have 0 interest in Corpse calls as it provides no oppurtunity to roleplay aside from a couple of pre-written /me lines.

 

Welcome to the world of:

 

-Mechanics

-Gruppe Six guards

- Store Clerks

-Bartenders

-Truckers

-Food Vendors

- Public Works

 

And I'm sure i've missed some.

 

And great you're gonna say well "don't apply for those roles" - Surely the same would apply to yourselves and PD then no ? All of the above jobs have fun and shitty parts, but without a mechanic you're not gonna be able to spend your PD wage on getting your jubilee's painted with big ol' rims. (A seperate issue) However we enjoy making other people do boring shit, But only when it positively impacts yourself ? 

 

Next time police arrest me as an illegal RP'er I'm just going straight to /b and cancelling the arrest as it doesn't provide me with any quality RP. Or we can get into a chase and if you guys win I'll do the same thing.  I call 991 for a question and never get a response, At all, I call 911 for the same question, Get a response and then arrested for misusing an emergency hotline, Make it make sense...

 

OOCl'y Attacking criminal RP'ers for shooting first and not developing their characters correctly literally provides no substance to this debate, That's exactly the same as what LEO's are doing by ignoring these bodies ? (ignoring the boring shit and focusing on the fun shit)

 

Plain and simply, RP as a leo and act like one or alternatively hop out of the fac and go RP as something else. Or even better, Get the coroners to start advertising consistently again in order to get people on board with Coroner RP, Delegate your shite workload that you don't want to do, Facilitate the growth in a department meaning you can focus on the fun shit.

 

G6 Guards I can tell you 9/10 would love to be mobbing around shooting at people and spending there whole time doing fun shit, But instead choose to guard businesses, Conduct installs and provide a positive impact on the server which otherwise likely wouldn't be filled, They chose G6 for the character development and therefore RP the roles accordingly, The RP might be boring but it has a positive impact server wide, The same goes for truckers, Trucking companies provide a substantial benefit to the servers economy, Fill a labour gap for a hell of a lot of people, And ultimately provide components to half of the server, And yet the jobs boring as hell... Maybe LEO's should start focusing on the fact that there is a serverwide impact to the ignorance to RP certain things based on them being boring, Yet once again it falls down to " We don't want to RP that part of our job so can you remove it from the server please ?"

 

I'm not saying that world should feel like a grind and everyones been at the point in world where it does and you have no interest in it, But saying that you don't want to RP it cause its boring and provides no beneficial RP is a joke, When everyone else is still meant to RP bodies being all over the gaff. Corpse's can stay, LEO's or coroners need to change to facilitate the new part of the script and work with what you've been given, Rather than removing a whole new aspect of RP for Criminal RP because its boring for you lot to deal with.

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Chaozuo

[varthshenon]

Reading through the posts, I think this update was a wakeup call for RPQM to see how the illegal and legal scenes operate. The (allegedly) high number of dead bodies produced each day is the result of the illegal scene jumping to the guns at every corner, while the high amount of abandoned dead bodies (or allegedly ignored "mundane" calls) is the result of the legal scene doing pick and choose without considering their portrayal. Both are wrong in my opinion.

[FatCatTuxedo]

2 hours ago, Kari said:

The issue herein sits in the fact that we don't WANT to just dispatch a single patrol car to deal with a homicide scene. 

If the scene is literally anything more than a body? you need 3-5 people to sit on a perimeter and lock it down, otherwise it becomes moot in court. And you should RP that, reasonably, this scene COULD go to court, even if you know with every fiber of your being it won't.

3-5 people for a perimeter turns into asking for a detective, or perhaps forensics. This turns into a longer wait, if not a no-show. 

After you pick up whatever evidence exists - if it does, you drive back to MRS and log it in evidence. 

This isn't a 5 minute respond; /do for coroners; leave. It's a 15-40 minute process per scene, provided it is a body that has any sign of unnatural death, and anything - even as small as a few casings around it.  

That's 10 hours, granted, spread across 2 factions, to handle every one of these calls. But it's still 10 hours of time that must be spent, often in high-crime areas where other crime will occur halfway through your scene and take precedent. And the same people aren't going to be doing these calls day in, day out. Likely not even multiple times a night. 

"20 calls for 2 factions" doesn't sound like a lot, until you factor in that these calls - when taken - do take time.

Unless the suggestion here is actually that we want cops to run up to a homicide, figure it out in 5 minutes, /sendtomorgue, spam Y on casings, and run off to the next one. Not to mention the distribution of calls is never constant, so you'll always have one faction picking up more slack. I don't think this is what the majority of people want. 

As much as I sympathize with the fact that sometimes; calls that are less fun simply.. aren't answered - it's not always this. Not everyone has the confidence to lead an investigation, or to respond to calls that are super involved. This confidence is built with time, the reason people don't pick up calls isn't always "it's not fun". It can be a period of heightened activity, a lack of confidence - prior knowledge of lack of resources, or, rather simply, the call just being missed. 

I was hopeful for this change at first, but it's only brought along body-snatchers and undue toxicity from the community. Genuinely, guys, if you want to help, join DMEC, join PD, join SD. Come help. You're welcome to. This is a hobby, at the end of the day, and we'd like to share it with you. But as a hobby, sometimes, stuff is ignored.

 

bold of u to think they would let me in PD or SD