Updating rules and perception around shooting in public areas / daylight / or near cameras

[CertifiedKiller]

On 3/19/2021 at 7:13 PM, Smilesville said:

Legal penalties are only one component of the issue - as many are quick to point out, the prospect of prison is so daunting for some that they elect to have their characters (temporarily) killed in a shootout. I believe we could accomplish the desired end result by:

• Lengthening prison sentences across the board. Not to their real life counterparts, but much closer to realistic than the current slap on the wrist.
• More strictly defining when a character is PK'd. I would go as far as to say that unless the intent (of the player, not the character) is to kill someone, they are considered wounded rather than killed. Hardly realistic, you could point out, but this is the best way I can think of to combat the meta game behind jumping into a PK to avoid jail time.

Under my proposed amendments, even if you attempt a suicide by cop, your character is simply wounded by the shootout and is still required to serve time for their crimes when they've recuperated. This adds weight to the decision to commit a crime; with a more OOCly balanced "risk versus reward" ratio, we can get to a point where we don't necessarily have to question the motives of players who claim their characters are "stupid criminals" because there's no longer a mechanical incentive to play that way.

no

[marbella mondays]

On 3/8/2021 at 12:17 PM, amphetamine said:

The location / time of day shouldn't matter as much as the reasons / escalation prior to the incident beforehand.  Just my 2 cents though.

 

[DasFroggy]

1 hour ago, bidi bidi bom bom said:

 

The problem is that it does matter. If someone attempts to initiate a crime in what should be a populated area, there is simply never going to be enough players to realistically allow for the reaction that should occur. 

 

If some script like a /crime command existed to do a dice roll for witness 911 calls, I could see this restriction being lifted. As it is though, the compromise is that some areas are simply too risky for certain crimes to occur. 

[marbella mondays]

11 minutes ago, DasFroggy said:

The problem is that it does matter. If someone attempts to initiate a crime in what should be a populated area, there is simply never going to be enough players to realistically allow for the reaction that should occur. 

 

If some script like a /crime command existed to do a dice roll for witness 911 calls, I could see this restriction being lifted. As it is though, the compromise is that some areas are simply too risky for certain crimes to occur. 

That's an RPG element and I'm heavily against it. Not everyone gets caught for doing crimes in public, in broad daylight. If a cop sees you, you're caught. If not, you're not. If you got a reason to do something, do it. No need to complicate shit that doesn't need complications added to it.

[DasFroggy]

7 minutes ago, bidi bidi bom bom said:

That's an RPG element and I'm heavily against it. Not everyone gets caught for doing crimes in public, in broad daylight. If a cop sees you, you're caught. If not, you're not. If you got a reason to do something, do it. No need to complicate shit that doesn't need complications added to it.

Then the rule remains. As it is, crime is already wildly out of control, to the point that there are more violent crimes happening daily in los Santos than the top five most dangerous nations combined. That is a LOT of crime, amidst a very small population.

 

Without some concession of some sort, there are simply no grounds to have this rule removed.

 

...and believe me, there are opportunities both both sides to prosper. I want criminals to be free in choosing where and when they commit a crime, but given the completely unregulated and rampant amount of crimegrinders that go unaddressed? ...there is just too much to lose. The community would dwindle and die very quickly.

Edited March 23, 2021 by DasFroggy

[Sixty]

26 minutes ago, bidi bidi bom bom said:

That's an RPG element and I'm heavily against it. Not everyone gets caught for doing crimes in public, in broad daylight. If a cop sees you, you're caught. If not, you're not. If you got a reason to do something, do it. No need to complicate shit that doesn't need complications added to it.

**Shoots someone in broad daylight just around the corner from the Mission Row PD station near the coffee shop.**

 

**No cops around.**

 

**Doesn't get caught.**

 

Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. Even if it was a good reason, this would never happen realistically without you being caught or witnessed by someone. Street cameras, gun shot sounds, people who would be in close proximity to the police station, etc. To let this go just because a cop didn't see you regardless of the atmosphere around you? Yeah, no thanks. Surrounding atmosphere needs to be taken into account and currently the rule does that. I see no reason to change it based on your reasoning.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Sixty

[marbella mondays]

1 minute ago, Sixty said:

**Shoots someone in broad daylight just around the corner from the Mission Row PD station near the coffee shop.**

 

**No cops around.**

 

**Doesn't get caught.**

 

Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. Even if it was a good reason, this would never happen realistically without you being caught or witnessed by someone. To let this go just because a cop didn't see you regardless of the atmosphere around you? Yeah, no thanks. Surrounding atmosphere needs to be taken into account and currently the rule does that. I see no reason to change it.

If they weren't caught, they weren't caught. Not everyone is caught by doing a crime.

[Sixty]

2 minutes ago, bidi bidi bom bom said:

If they weren't caught, they weren't caught. Not everyone is caught by doing a crime.

While true, that stance for a heavy RP server is ridiculous. You can't just justify shooting someone for good reason without taking into account where you are, who would be around you, and things that would realistically be there in that location. This isn't a death match server and that's what it would turn into. No thanks.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Sixty

[marbella mondays]

Just now, Sixty said:

While true, that stance for an RP server is ridiculous. You can't just justify shooting someone for good reason without taking into account where you are, who would be around you, and things that would realistically be there in that location. This isn't a death match server and that's what it would turn into. No thanks.

If they aren't there in game, they don't exist. This lore was established before. I'm not gonna pretend there's civilians walking around when there isn't, that breaks my immersion.

[Sixty]

Just now, bidi bidi bom bom said:

If they aren't there in game, they don't exist. This lore was established before. I'm not gonna pretend there's civilians walking around when there isn't, that breaks my immersion.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is 100% wrong. Plenty of people have been punished for committing crime in an area where there would normally be civilians or a populated area.  That's why this entire thread was started because of the administration's stance on that based on time of day, how realistic the location is for committing crime, etc.