Heavy RP, realism, suspension of disbelief and char depth

[Trupiano]

31 minutes ago, EliH said:

Also I recommend trying to debate the topic at hand instead of acting like a child and saying “Nuh uh, the server is ONLY 100% realism and that’s how I want it and it’s never gonna change! REEEEEEE!”

Oh good the old "They don't like my ideas so they must be stuck in their ways" post!

 

First off let me address this whole "realism" dilemma. At this moment GTAWorld is a Serious RP server with a dedication to being realistic. This isn't some personal belief of mine or the other people arguing with you in this thread. This is the servers stance, If you want to change it I suggest you make a suggestion thread but I assume your smart enough to realize how well that thread will go.  

 

I'm open to debating if you can actually form an argument that you can stand on. You suggested removing the prices from cars and properties, in return I pointed out that we already have an issue with people RPing wealth outside their means, Your suggestion to remove prices would only make this problem worse as the prices of said items are one of the only ways that problem is combated.

 

You say staff should just view everyone's RP and ban those who aren't choosing to RP correctly. There are currently 15 staff members who would undertaking that task, all of whom are also players. There are probably, 1000/1500 active players? So now those 15 staff members who don't get paid and have to hop out of RP to Shadow each player to make sure they are RPing their assets correctly? That doesn't seem fair to them or really that productive.

 

You said Allow people to create the factions they want, that we should lift the strict requirement for realism in factions. As there are no perks of being an official faction whats the point of lifting the requirements? Why not just RP as a group and not post a thread? I believe official factions should be restricted to factions dedicated to being as real to life as possible in their RP. The rest of you don't need a thread. If your interested in RPing as a faction here's a sneak peek at the level of research FM liked to see: 

 

 

That is a quarter of the research materials I was sent when I started RPing a mob character. Yeah it looks like an unnecessary amount but the difference between a well researched faction and a poorly researched faction in leaps and bounds.

 

Edited October 2, 2019 by Henning

[KFN]

18 hours ago, Henning said:

What exactly are these perks of having an official factions? 

All the perks factions have now, literally no change other than allowing anyone to make a thread and have the faction develop freely, rather than it all being behind a staff wall.

[Topinambour]

16 hours ago, bluepilled said:

The only thing I'd disagree with is the context you use "mundane" in. It's fairly subjective. There's nothing wrong with "niches" on an RP server and arguing RP has to cater to the preference of people around you seems very clique-like. I don't enjoy having to roleplay in a hospital but I won't expect the people involved to create some elaborate plan to garner interest or make my surgery "fun." You honestly can't expect to expose your character to the public under the assumption all of the rp you're involved in will be engaging. There are dull moments in every form of literature. Authors and creators aren't going to foam from the mouth as they write or create, twenty-four seven.

True! It was poorly / clumsily written on my part. What I meant by "mundane" things are "things you have to do IRL, that are boring IRL, and that you wish you didn't have to do IRL". I used "mundane" because of my own language dumbness ^^ The idea is that if you don't want to queue at the DMV IRL, why would you want to log on an RP server and do it there? 

 

Now, you are right though about niches. I haven't mentioned them extensively in my original post out of fear that it would be too long (... it's already too long ? ). So, it's totally my bad ^^ Niches do, and should exist on RP servers that reach a certain size. And they certainly shouldn't be discouraged from existing as long as they don't cause issues with suspension of disbelief. The point I was attempting to convey was that a specific niche shouldn't become the "RP police" and make their own personal interest the standard of quality of the server. E.g.: My char loves astronomy, but I wouldn't go and bully those who dislike it, and say their RP is "of a poor quality", and that "on THIS SERVER, we have STANDARDS and people who can't properly RP astronomy discussions have no place here".

 

The issue was more about a certain niche trying to bully everyone else into believing that their very specific interest, for more mundane stuff, is the standard that should be expected on the server (and that anyone disliking what they like should be shunned). We have a great example of it in the discussion about Vinewood houses, in fact. Also on this thread in fact.

 

16 hours ago, bluepilled said:

Like, you seem well-read enough to realize that RP also depends on YOU. Why would you immediately think "oh man I lost 15 mins of potential quality rp" instead of trying to turn an unwanted scenario into a potentially enjoyable one? It affects the ideas you want to materialize negatively and assuming you.

It's true, actually. To a certain extent, of course - some players have little interest in RP'ing along with people, and instead RP using people as props or NPCs. In such cases, the best you can do is to hope the scene will end quickly so you can move on. But you are right that there are opportunities that can be used to enrich a scene perceived as "dull", especially if you have a more quirky and/or social character. And you are also right, it's part of that collaborative experience of RP ? 

 

49 minutes ago, EliH said:

imo it seems like he’s just tired of all these bad replies and people trying to change the system in a way that benefits only mallrats. 

The problem is that the attitude of those minorities doesn't make mallrats run off the server, but actually good players. A Conan Exiles server I've been on for the last year or so (where, trust me, the standards of RP are /INFINITELY HIGHER/ than anything you'll see here) welcomed a lot of former GTA players last year. They were all pretty damn good, with involved stories, a concern for credibility, good writing, etc. Most of them were tired of (quote) "The fucking RP police" being overly toxic all the time and acting like high school bullies. Again, not a single of them were mallrats, none of them had any particular problem with the rules, and none tried to do anything wildly unrealistic. Among those exiles (haha, irony :p), only a couple came back to GTAW (like the lovely @Bombielonia). The rest are like "nope, no way". Again, because of those people.

 

If the disdainful attitude is meant to keep the good players and make mallrats leave the server, it would appear it's having the exact opposite effect ? To be fair, this thread is also me being already tired of this, and trying a last thing to see if a more reasonable position can be reached. But their attitude is tempting me to just drop Paints News and go back where I came from (along with those I came back with). 

 

[Trupiano]

Just now, KFN said:

All the perks factions have now, literally no change other than allowing anyone to make a thread and have the faction develop freely, rather than it all being behind a staff wall.

I'm leadership in an official faction...

 

Unless I'm just entirely outside the loop (Which I'm pretty sure I'm not) Factions currently get no perks besides the thread. They used to get shit like a garage and vehicles that can't be stolen but that was removed several months back.

 

I'm telling you people, your fighting a fight that will get you nothing in the end.

[KFN]

2 minutes ago, Henning said:

I'm leadership in an official faction...

 

Unless I'm just entirely outside the loop (Which I'm pretty sure I'm not) Factions currently get no perks besides the thread. They used to get shit like a garage and vehicles that can't be stolen but that was removed several months back.

 

I'm telling you people, your fighting a fight that will get you nothing in the end.

Oh in that case then the only perk I'd see them actually having is getting their thread pinned in the faction section so that it remains constantly at the top as a reminder to how factions could/should potentially be developed to get it to its highest standard or just keep it there.

[EliH]

14 minutes ago, Henning said:

I'm leadership in an official faction...

 

Unless I'm just entirely outside the loop (Which I'm pretty sure I'm not) Factions currently get no perks besides the thread. They used to get shit like a garage and vehicles that can't be stolen but that was removed several months back.

 

I'm telling you people, your fighting a fight that will get you nothing in the end.

Sure doesn’t seem that way when all the FM staff who were super anal and 100% realistic are no longer on staff, and Nervous is opening up faction applications.

 

@Topinambour It’s pretty funny reading some of these comments, it reminds me of old day FiveRP, and we all know how that went.

 

Let me ask the naysayers this so we can have some actual discussion. What are the downsides of allowing “unrealistic” factions/RP? It’s not as if shit RP will magically be allowed now. Unless you’re saying they inherently cause shit RP, which is pretty retarded considering theres other RP servers such as Space Station 13 that have way higher RP standards and aren’t “realistic” whatsoever.

Edited October 2, 2019 by EliH

[KFN]

2 minutes ago, EliH said:

Space Station 13 that have way higher RP standards and aren’t “realistic” whatsoever.

Okay, this has to be a joke, we all know SS13 is shit-positing galore and has really low roleplay standards, really fun game though recommend to everyone with more chromosomes than the usual. 

[KFN]

3 minutes ago, Rumbunctious said:

On the flip side of that coin, FiveRP allowed "unrealistic" factions to exist. And we all know how that went.

I certainly agree they shouldn't allow the creation on entirely unrealistic factions like some kind of ninja faction, however I do believe it should be slackened to allow a bit more free reign and allowing gangs/mobs etc what you would definitely find believable to be in a western setting, without having to be a near direct rip off of some real life criminal organisation and with more proof or research than that or level 2 college courses.

[EliH]

29 minutes ago, KFN said:

Okay, this has to be a joke, we all know SS13 is shit-positing galore and has really low roleplay standards, really fun game though recommend to everyone with more chromosomes than the usual. 

Depends on the server. Some are low-RP, others high RP

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, EliH said:

Sure doesn’t seem that way when all the FM staff who were super anal and 100% realistic are no longer on staff, and Nervous is opening up faction applications.

Completely irrelevant since the majority of us decided to resign due to issues within the Management team that we did not wish to be on board with. Nervous will confirm that if needed and I'm happy to back things up with chatlogs - couldn't care less.

 

Anyhow, this topic will end up getting locked. For what it's worth, the server was intended to be a serious roleplay server. There are a small minority of players that stick to what the server was advertised as: serious roleplay. Then there are the others that fall outside of the serious bracket and treat the server like it's a free pass to own expensive cars with little to no roleplay or character development, switch character concept every 5 minutes and then complain because no new race cars or Rockford Hills houses are being added to feed their piss poor representation of what being "rich" is.

 

It will never change no matter how many threads are made. The reason "FM were super anal and 100% realistic" is because we were told quality was needed to be enforced in the server. That is what we delivered whether people viewed it as harsh or not. It was our job to filter out stupidity and minimize the risk of the community being turned into a shitfest of unrealism, but as proven, that'll happen regardless unless people employed to do that job are allowed to do it and sometimes make people upset in the process. It's not a nice job to do, it's a necessary job and naturally you are the most hated person in the staff team due to your team being one of the few that don't sugarcoat shit and tell people that they're doing things wrong against the server's intended direction.

 

31 minutes ago, EliH said:

What are the downsides of allowing “unrealistic” factions/RP? It’s not as if shit RP will magically be allowed now.

You just answered your own question with an assumption, basically. The downsides of allowing factions and RP that do not fit on the West Coast of America (with inspiration, yes, inspiration from California) is that unrealism will follow and with unrealism comes poor roleplay. Faction concepts are and should be denied due to them not fitting in that specific region. For example, you wouldn't see an East Coast Crips set on the West Coast of America. It wouldn't make sense nor would they fit in.

 

Same goes for cartels. Cartels do not exist on the West Coast, cells do. And, well, since we don't have an actual opportunity to visit South America then it just wouldn't make sense nor be viable to have a cartel cell within the server.