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Predatory Practices & RP by LEOs/DAs


Doom slayer

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How come there's been an increase in unfair and outright predatory practices by both some LEOs and prosecutors on the server? Why has nothing been done in attempts to mitigate it until recently? What can we do to change it as a community, in hopes of benefitting everybody from both sides of the legal/illegal sphere?

 

I'm not attacking anyone personally in this thread. People roleplay prosecutors because they find fun in it. Great! LEOs roleplay LEOs because they find fun in it. Awesome! Do that.

I only feel as though bringing attention to these things once again in a thread is needed.

 

Several weeks ago, it came to light that there was a practice prosecutors were following, which involved stacking charges if you were found with multiple firearms on your person. This resulted in those prosecuted receiving enough criminal points to obtain a life sentence and in turn have their affected character(s) end up within the Twin Towers Correctional Facility as lifers.

This has since been stubbed, but it shouldn't have happened in the first place whatsoever.

 

More recently, we've seen now further criticism of the aerial support units that are given to the police. These helicopters, which should play a primarily supportive role, have been going around the city, camping out high-crime areas, and taking unfair advantage of the tools they have been given in hopes of finding anything illegal; this then usually results in a forum report that goes up against the pilot because whoever they scoped out was arrested or killed unfairly as a result.

 

You can view this report as an example. This is one of many previous.

 

I'd also like to add this additional tidbit. This is the fine one may have the possibility to receive for skipping out on their bond, if their character chooses to for their own roleplay:

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The amount one can be fined for making a decision in their roleplay can completely ruin their gameplay. Why? What purpose does it serve? Absolutely no-one benefits. One may argue realism, especially considering the charges somebody might face and that skipping out on bond is no small deal, but we're playing a video game. Fining somebody for nearly triple their accumulated wealth is completely outrageous, and I think things like this should be frowned upon.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be any consequence to things like this. There absolutely should be; we have a judicial system for a reason. However, there should be a middle-ground which doesn't involve making GTA:W Debt Simulator 2023 and keeping things favored towards the server being a video game. We RP what we RP because we think its fun.

 

 

 

Leave your thoughts below. Let's keep things constructive.

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Helicopter camera usage should be cut down on some, that's for sure. As a LEO roleplayer, I'm tired of air units spotting things out of the blue that seem a tad unrealistic. Specifically, people holding guns in cars at night, from thousands of feet in the air, using a camera that is far more resolved than its IRL counter part would be.

 

The charge stacking thing was just something that was misconstrued from other common charges being stacked IRL (murder, assault, battery, etc) and has since stopped. Don't really see the need to harp on it. 

 

The last part about the fine makes no sense to complain about. If your character skips out on their court obligations after posting bail, the judicial system you talked about frowns on that very heavily. Those ARE the consequences of skipping court on bail. Your character has already shown extreme disregard for the judiciary, so they get smacked. Obviously, this punishment also scales with the crime they're being accused of. So... Yeah, no. Financial impacts seem to be the only thing most players on the server even care about, so those severe financial repercussions should well stay in place.

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On behalf of JSA, all of the information re/ the judiciary and prosecution (the bond amount, the stacking etc) are all errors and should not have been done in the first place and are against existing rules. We now specifically have practices in place in the DAO to prevent things like this happening. 

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2 minutes ago, Morozzini said:

1.5mil fine? Wtf? Unless we're talking about someone extremely rich who made millions illegally or some big company out there, that's ridiculous.

Actually no, and is fairly in line with IRL for some things.

 

For example, bail for murder in Los Angeles is two million dollars.

 

You can look up the LA bail schedule here:

 

https://www.lacourt.org/division/criminal/pdf/felony.pdf

 

and here:

 

https://www.lacourt.org/division/criminal/pdf/misd.pdf

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Morozzini said:

1.5mil fine? Wtf? Unless we're talking about someone extremely rich who made millions illegally or some big company out there, that's ridiculous.

Bail and Fines are not the same thing. Bail is basically collateral to make sure you appear in court if you are released. You get bail money returned if you show up to court even if found guilty.

As to the original complaint things have been changed on the DAO end according to Oli who is JSA Faction Leader to make sure this doesn't happen again. As for the bail amounts I have no issue with them as Judge. Bail is just that bail, it allows you to be released for the duration of your trial. If the crime is serious enough you won't even get bail. Would you rather have a high bail like a 1million dollars you have a chance of paying either through loans or with the help of associate or just be denied bail? Its completely realistic and I don't see the issue there tbh. Helicopter stuff I can't speak to as much.

 

Edited by Power
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The issue is that regardless of its realism, it wholly impacts the player experience in a negative way. The purpose of the DA's office isn't to "win" at the expense of player experience. If this is the alternative, yes, you should just deny bail. An illegal character who got away now has what amounts to a lien over every single asset.

 

Do you know what most players will do in the face of something this predatory? Delete the character once the payment is inescapable. Not everyone has 80,000+ a week coming from a legal faction vault for doing forum work. There is 1,400,000 being sought from a player who has 300k total wealth. It's egregious and ridiculous. 

 

The helicopter cop thing is an entirely different problem, and that one is also egregious. Play-to-win guys catching someone's /ame in a car and calling tactical teams to close in, or worse yet, spying out of render distance so no one even knows they're there.

 

Time and time again people say these issues are addressed but they really aren't being addressed, because one side wants to win.

 

Signed, the server's worst District Attorney

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Personal Opinion about the mention of Police Helicopter

I'm in the LSPD Air Support Division and the following is my personal opinion. We have a set of OOC rules and regulations outlined by Legal Faction Management that we follow. And as far as I see, no one has violated the rules. I can understand why sometimes it is questionable if you are on the ground and caught doing something by AIR because you don't see anything, but most of the times, rules are perfectly followed, and reports will be disputed.

 

4 hours ago, Doom slayer said:

These helicopters, which should play a primarily supportive role, have been going around the city, camping out high-crime areas, and taking unfair advantage of the tools they have been given in hopes of finding anything illegal.

 

Helicopters don't wait for calls from ground units. They can patrol around the city and look for stolen vehicles, robberies, drug interdiction and other criminal activities. 

 

About "camping high-crime area", there is a specific definition outlined on when it is considered "camping" in the LFM regulations we follow. It cannot be assumed every helicopter you see above a turf to be camping. As I mentioned, helicopters fly and patrol around the whole city.

 

If I can see something on my screen, and that would be in my character's line of sight then I see it with the helicopter camera. It is unfair to make people pretend that they don't. This also applies to everything else, not just in a helicopter. There is a noise effect on the helicopter camera. When it's foggy, the camera can barely see anything. And as high as the helicopter goes, it's harder to see. Point is, it is a video game, and what we see or don't see is already dictated by the game mechanics. It is irrelevant to compare to in real life when it comes to game graphics, and what we would or would not see.

 

Of course, if I see someone's /me but not their character like in a bush or under a tent, for example, then I wouldn't take it IC as my character would not see it.

 

 

1 hour ago, pogoyo said:

Play-to-win guys catching someone's /ame in a car and calling tactical teams to close in, or worse yet, spying out of render distance so no one even knows they're there.

 

The helicopter is never out of render distance. If a helicopter sees you, the helicopter is also within your render distance. And if you have your audio all up, you will always hear the helicopter's sound, loud or not, depending on the altitude of the helicopter. 

 

Also, doing their job as a police officer is not "play-to-win" if it is within all OOC rules and regulations.

Edited by TommyX
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3 hours ago, Morozzini said:

1.5mil fine? Wtf? Unless we're talking about someone extremely rich who made millions illegally or some big company out there, that's ridiculous.

dont skip bail then

 

the whole point of bail is to say "i promise to go to court" if u go to  court, u get that money back. otherwise u dont

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