Restricted Crime Zones & No Crime Zones. Are they actually helping? Tell us your experience!

[RedRover]

23 minutes ago, Kappaurel said:

The moment a higher standard of roleplay is considered a BURDEN, you know the server is failing to get anywhere close to what it claims to be (Heavy Roleplay)

 

The fact that this exception even exists is simply mind boggling to me. Absolutely insane. A burden to have higher standards? What in the actual fuck? 😂

[Jeroen]

If gangs shit where they eat / rob where they live, then that should bring them greater risk of ingame legal trouble than if they did it a few neighborhoods over.

[Zetara]

I feel like the crime zone ruling has greatly improved roleplay for me as an illegal roleplayer, It has given me a chance to actually ROLEPLAY which is first and foremost what people should be doing, it has given me chances to roleplay in a public setting with a large variety of players as people feel comfortable rping socially in public settings, where in the past people would rarely be seen rping outside. As my character is a homeless drug addict I haven't had many chances to roleplay prior to this ruling as it is very rare for me to actually step foot into a business. Thanks to the ruling I have finally been able to rp the street rat I chose to play without having to worry about the only potential prospects to roleplay with being subpar 'characters' who only exist to sell drugs, rob and dm that have no sense of realism. I for one hope the restricted area ruling stays for the same reason bike robberies were banned, being that the lack of such rulings only encouraged terrible roleplay.

As it is I hope these rulings stay for the foreseeable future, purely because it promotes criminal roleplay that isn't standard as there are plenty of illegal acts that aren't muggings/assaults/shootouts that can still take place in these spaces, such as car break ins or vandalism which may have actual realistic consequences.  (Realistically you are much more likely to be seen commiting a crime near a bank or central area, especially one near a police station. Why would anyone rob someone realistically in such a high traffic area? And no a single article of a robbery happening in Rodeo drive isn't an argument for how realistic it is for 5+ robberies a day to take place on the in game equivalent, Portola Drive.

There has only been one instance I have not agreed with such a ruling, as I once went to push someone off a bicycle in Legion Square and I didn't have the motivation or the energy to say that this wasn't a violation of the restricted crime area ruling as 1: I was not mugging them/ committing an obvious crime and 2: My character is an established illegal character who had been to TTcF in the past on criminal/felony charges. 

I am passionate about this ruling as I have such limited time to hop on the server and avoiding low quality roleplayers is my priority. I don't think of the 6-7 times I have been robbed in this server that I actually faced genuine, good roleplay from the robbers once. At least once with each and every one of these robberies there was some attempt to powergame/metagame from the robbers  and it was clear they grew oocly upset when I was not armed with a gun. Sure if I was being robbed and was faced with good roleplay I'd be perfectly happy to rp the robbery but if I never have to see /me grabs the phone without finding it on my person again I'd be blessed.

Edited July 4, 2022 by Zetara

[Martyn]

I absolutely hate this rule/restriction, anything that encourages metagame is basically inherently bad game design. I would've liked to see the insane crime problem solved ICly, why is the police policing the city with their hands tied behind their back? Just allow the police to respond appropriately to the crime on the server? Stop restricting them, let the government govern. Let the police police. I think both legal and illegal ROLEPLAYERS (not free-roam illegal mallrats) would agree that keeping shit IC is the best course of action, I mean... Who wants to go around roleplaying, only to find your character in a position where they're about to commit a crime but you have to pull up your Dora the explorer map to find out if you're allowed to do it in that certain location? Only through long term IC circumstances changing (police being very strong) will you see meaningful behavioral changes in the criminals over time.

Edited July 4, 2022 by Martyn

[Vash Baldeus]

59 minutes ago, Jeroen said:

If gangs shit where they eat / rob where they live, then that should bring them greater risk of ingame legal trouble than if they did it a few neighborhoods over.

That too, what's the benefit of robbing the locals of the place you're, it's dumb.

18 minutes ago, Martyn said:

I absolutely hate this rule/restriction, anything that encourages metagame is basically inherently bad game design. I would've liked to see the insane crime problem solved ICly, why is the police policing the city with their hands tied behind their back? Just allow the police to respond appropriately to the crime on the server? Stop restricting them, let the government govern. Let the police police. I think both legal and illegal ROLEPLAYERS (not free-roam illegal mallrats) would agree that keeping shit IC is the best course of action, I mean... Who wants to go around roleplaying, only to find your character in a position where they're about to commit a crime but you have to pull up your Dora the explorer map to find out if you're allowed to do it in that certain location? Only through long term IC circumstances changing (police being very strong) will you see meaningful behavioral changes in the criminals over time.

Problem with your suggestion is the illegal mallrats you mentioned they are the reason those rules were put in place. That exact minority is the reason robbery rules were adjusted.

[Martyn]

Just now, Vash Baldeus said:

That too, what's the benefit of robbing the locals of the place you're, it's dumb.

Problem with your suggestion is the illegal mallrats you mentioned they are the reason those rules were put in place. That exact minority is the reason robbery rules were adjusted.

 

How exactly is that a problem with my suggestion? If we allowed the police to function at its full potential even these players I mentioned wouldn't have the complete freedom anymore to fuck with everyone they come across. Because the police wouldn't have their hands tied behind their backs anymore with stupid shit like "you can't fly your helicopter in one area for too long" or... "No rico cases" and most likely many more restrictions placed upon law enforcement factions which I'm not even aware of. Whoever came up with the notion that the police and the criminal community needs to be balanced need a reality check.

[Vash Baldeus]

13 minutes ago, Martyn said:

 

How exactly is that a problem with my suggestion? If we allowed the police to function at its full potential even these players I mentioned wouldn't have the complete freedom anymore to fuck with everyone they come across. Because the police wouldn't have their hands tied behind their backs anymore with stupid shit like "you can't fly your helicopter in one area for too long" or... "No rico cases" and most likely many more restrictions placed upon law enforcement factions which I'm not even aware of. Whoever came up with the notion that the police and the criminal community needs to be balanced need a reality check.

Rico cases would shut the whole factions aspect down.

[Zetara]

33 minutes ago, Martyn said:

I absolutely hate this rule/restriction, anything that encourages metagame is basically inherently bad game design. I would've liked to see the insane crime problem solved ICly, why is the police policing the city with their hands tied behind their back? Just allow the police to respond appropriately to the crime on the server? Stop restricting them, let the government govern. Let the police police. I think both legal and illegal ROLEPLAYERS (not free-roam illegal mallrats) would agree that keeping shit IC is the best course of action, I mean... Who wants to go around roleplaying, only to find your character in a position where they're about to commit a crime but you have to pull up your Dora the explorer map to find out if you're allowed to do it in that certain location? Only through long term IC circumstances changing (police being very strong) will you see meaningful behavioral changes in the criminals over time.

Problem is, quite often the times that cause these rulings to be put in place were around the time there were only 1-3 LEO officers on MAX, which lead to most players getting away with things unpunished at a time the server was pretty dead. Bad mallrat characters were able to get away with shit roleplay with 0 actual consequence and even if they were seen by police it was all too easy to just evade and get away unpunished considering there are only 2-3 Officers online (With 0 air support.) Things like this can't just be solved icly as the server is pretty dead between restart and 2pm when most of these crimes take place. If such roleplay was allowed these hours would be even more dead than unusual which potentially means there may not even be a single Officer online, it would also be unrealistic to ask LEOs to log in at this time as a shift could be rather dead or stupid late in the night/ early morning when most LEO officers have jobs/university classes. 

[RedRover]

42 minutes ago, Vash Baldeus said:

Problem with your suggestion is the illegal mallrats you mentioned they are the reason those rules were put in place. That exact minority is the reason robbery rules were adjusted.

You can keep things IC way more often when there is proper support from the server to punish the minority for being shit tier role players. It’s insane that we let a smaller group of players dictate the environment of the server rather than getting rid of that minority altogether. It’s a two-pronged approach that requires putting less band-aids on where there should instead be a monumental policy shift and more focus on punishing rule breakers who step outside the rules and continuity standards. There’s simply too many situations where ignorance has been used as an excuse for the 100th time or the server is afraid of losing a minority of people for being more hardline with the rules.

 

The crime zones were never necessary if the standard expected of both new and long time players was higher. It used to be better. We shouldn’t need a roadmap of where we can and can’t commit crime. Most players utilizing common sense know what’s right and wrong. New players are still expected to read the rules. That’s the point of the application right? Sometimes even new players know they’re doing something wrong and it’s obvious when they use the ignorance card versus when they genuinely didn’t know. Players who use the ignorance card over and over are just playing the staff and getting away with it. These are the players that often end up dictating silly rules to try and combat their behavior over and over rather than get rid of them entirely after being given enough chances. There, I said it. 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Brofessor

[Trupiano]

25 minutes ago, Brofessor said:

The crime zones were never necessary if the standard expected of both new and long time players was higher. It used to be better. We shouldn’t need a roadmap of where we can and can’t commit crime. Most players utilizing common sense know what’s right and wrong. New players are still expected to read the rules. That’s the point of the application right? Sometimes even new players know they’re doing something wrong and it’s obvious when they use the ignorance card versus when they genuinely didn’t know. Players who use the ignorance card over and over are just playing the staff and getting away with it. These are the players that often end up dictating silly rules to try and combat their behavior over and over rather than get rid of them entirely after being given enough chances. There, I said it. 

 

Just to add to this, the problem isn't a bunch of randoms who don't know or care about the rules. Sure they exist and create headaches, but it really stems from the small select group "veteran" players who receive intense favoritism from staff. It's a fucking joke on this server that the people who advice staff on Illegal RP are some of the worst culprits of OOC dealing, DMing, and PVP focus. Staff knows this, they've known about that behavior for years yet those same players always get official and always get supplier. 

 

It's a good old boys club where your either "in" and receive all the support you could ever want or your "out" and they'll do everything in their power to kill your faction off the server (And fail).