As a regular citizen, how much should I fear Character Kills?

[ode]

As an average joe i tend to live in constant fear because god only knows.

[RedRover]

25 minutes ago, ode said:

As an average joe i tend to live in constant fear because god only knows.

While that’s certainly one angle, I’ve known people (granted they were born and raised in Texas 😂) who’s “average joe” was shoot first, ask questions later. They never hesitated to pull a concealed firearm in several situations. They might not have fired, but it did act as a deterrent.
 

I think another part of the issue is that many (not all) on the criminal side seem to think they should be impervious to feeling fear in the face of danger just because it’s a civilian pulling the weapon. Fear RP should go both ways. No one is immune and a lot of people here think it’s only one sided, when it’s not. Fear RP is not always curling into a ball, sometimes it’s fight or flight. Fight may be stupid, but it happens. Flight also happens where people literally run away when they shouldn’t. Other cases people do simply curl up and comply, but it shouldn’t be a standard enforced that it’s the only way to show fear RP. 
 

It shouldn’t be an OOC punishment to fight or flight so long as it makes some sort of sense. Did the perpetrator get distracted? Did they lower their weapon? Take their eyes away from where they should’ve been? Was the “average joe” RP’d having experience and training? This should be IC training (time at an IC range, etc). If fight ends up not working, then their character dies (Forced CK). Simple as that. If they were cornered with no logical way out and they pulled anyways, dying in the process? Automatic forced CK. 
 

Bottom line. Unless powergaming or common courtesy rules are broken, more leeway should be given as to how people react and portray fear RP. It’s not a one-size-fits-all situation and shouldn’t be enforced as such. However, the penalties for making such decisions should be more common. I’ve seen so many situations, both legal and illegal characters that were warned or ajailed and allowed to keep their characters instead of being force CK’d. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by Brofessor

[DasFroggy]

1 hour ago, Brofessor said:

While that’s certainly one angle, I’ve known people (granted they were born and raised in Texas 😂) who’s “average joe” was shoot first, ask questions later. They never hesitated to pull a concealed firearm in several situations. They might not have fired, but it did act as a deterrent.
 

I think another part of the issue is that many (not all) on the criminal side seem to think they should be impervious to feeling fear in the face of danger just because it’s a civilian pulling the weapon. Fear RP should go both ways. No one is immune and a lot of people here think it’s only one sided, when it’s not. Fear RP is not always curling into a ball, sometimes it’s fight or flight. Fight may be stupid, but it happens. Flight also happens where people literally run away when they shouldn’t. Other cases people do simply curl up and comply, but it shouldn’t be a standard enforced that it’s the only way to show fear RP. 
 

It shouldn’t be an OOC punishment to fight or flight so long as it makes some sort of sense. Did the perpetrator get distracted? Did they lower their weapon? Take their eyes away from where they should’ve been? Was the “average joe” RP’d having experience and training? This should be IC training (time at an IC range, etc). If fight ends up not working, then their character dies (Forced CK). Simple as that. If they were cornered with no logical way out and they pulled anyways, dying in the process? Automatic forced CK. 
 

Bottom line. Unless powergaming or common courtesy rules are broken, more leeway should be given as to how people react and portray fear RP. It’s not a one-size-fits-all situation and shouldn’t be enforced as such. However, the penalties for making such decisions should be more common. I’ve seen so many situations, both legal and illegal characters that were warned or ajailed and allowed to keep their characters instead of being force CK’d. 

 

Honestly, running away should be allowed without risk of a CK unless the criminal has the intended victim cornered or surrounded.

 

We could drop crime-restricted/free zones entirely right now if that were the case. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by DasFroggy

[Power]

I remember I was leasing the parking lot of a bar to sell cars in because I needed one to legally sell cars in I was a Dealership owner at the time. No criminal activity, mostly legal character I sold cars without a business license but nothing criminal. I was kicked off the property by associates of the guy who rented to me and got into a heated argument with them. The trio I got into the argument with ended up gunning me down because I threatened their would be consequences if they were still here in 5 minutes since I had a signed lease to use the parking lot. Turned out those guys were mob connected and I as a civilian was expected to reasonably assume a group of assholes are mob connected. I was told since I made a threat that would be unrealistic. Tell me what business man thinks he gets to an argument with a group in a public parking lot will end in him being gun downed? I think the rules are skewed in a way that regular players are forced to be afraid of doing things they wouldn't in real life. 

 

Edited June 4, 2022 by Power

[Nyami]

Wow, I didn't expect this thread to blow up with responses as much as it did.

I looked through a lot of these answers and from both reading them and experiencing things in game, I can gather that civilians are technically not the best type of characters to play here if you don't want to risk being CK'd (unless I misunderstood somehow, which I might have because I am really tired right now.)

It's a real shame, because I was hoping this place would be the online life simulator of my dreams. Maybe I'm more fit for somewhere else, be it another GTA RP or a different program like Second Life. Not saying I'm going to permanently quit, but it sucks that, like ode said, I feel like I have to be in constant fear of losing my character.

[El Bandito]

18 minutes ago, Nyami said:

Wow, I didn't expect this thread to blow up with responses as much as it did.

I looked through a lot of these answers and from both reading them and experiencing things in game, I can gather that civilians are technically not the best type of characters to play here if you don't want to risk being CK'd (unless I misunderstood somehow, which I might have because I am really tired right now.)

It's a real shame, because I was hoping this place would be the online life simulator of my dreams. Maybe I'm more fit for somewhere else, be it another GTA RP or a different program like Second Life. Not saying I'm going to permanently quit, but it sucks that, like ode said, I feel like I have to be in constant fear of losing my character.

 

You have misunderstood because it's extremely unlikely that a pure 100% legal civilian character will be ck'ed out of the blue. The risk is further reduced if your character simply complies with every robbery/mugging/extortion and doesn't seek retaliation afterwards or during the incident.

 

In comparison illegal characters are far more likely to be ck'ed since most sign over their CK rights to their factions and sometimes even umbrella factions. Additionally illegal characters tend to get into beefs with other illegal characters, which can sometimes build up to a CK. 

Edited June 1, 2022 by El Bandito

[ScarletRose]

1 hour ago, Nyami said:

Wow, I didn't expect this thread to blow up with responses as much as it did.

I looked through a lot of these answers and from both reading them and experiencing things in game, I can gather that civilians are technically not the best type of characters to play here if you don't want to risk being CK'd (unless I misunderstood somehow, which I might have because I am really tired right now.)

It's a real shame, because I was hoping this place would be the online life simulator of my dreams. Maybe I'm more fit for somewhere else, be it another GTA RP or a different program like Second Life. Not saying I'm going to permanently quit, but it sucks that, like ode said, I feel like I have to be in constant fear of losing my character.

Honestly, it's not that bad. 

I've been playing on the same character for over a year now and I've only been PK'ed by another player once. PK meaning... My character died, but not permanently. I was able to respawn and just pretend all the rp that led to my character's death never happened. In one year, I've only managed to be killed by another player one time, and it was completely due to a situation my character caused. In terms of CKs, my character has never been close to being CK'ed, not even close. 

My point is that being CKed and losing your character is extremely rare (if you play a strictly legal civilian and avoid crime/making enemies). The only possible way to be CK'ed as a legal civilian character who isn't in a faction is to... 

A. Be killed by another character, who proceeds to submit a CK application to get you killed. Which... CK applications require a ton of evidence and good reasoning to be accepted. You're not going to be CKed over a random killing or something like that. The person who killed you would've needed very good reasons to kill you and it would've needed to be properly RP'ed over weeks/months for it to be accepted by admins. And if there's even one rulebreak during the entire RP surrounding your killing, you can report it or appeal and potentially reverse that CK. The chances of this happening and you being CK'ed from another character killing you is very rare, unless your character has enemies who want you dead... Which if you're a legal civilian, would also be a rare situation. Only criminal/gang characters really have to worry about this CK route, since they're usually making more enemies than legals.

B. You failed to roleplay fear during a robbery or something similar, and your character dies that way. This one's a little more plausible, but easily avoided. Just properly RP fear during threatening situations. If another character is robbing you and you decide to pull out a gun while already being aimed at, and you die, that could count as a CK if the other party wants to report you. Just, simple... Roleplay your character being in fear properly. It's already part of the rules anyways. 

C. You choose to IC'ly commit suicide or just in general, decided to kill off your character on your own terms. This one doesn't really count, but it's a way for you to CK if you want to get rid of your character.

That's pretty much it. The only real possibility your character can be CK'ed is route B. Just roleplay fear properly and you won't be CK'ed over a robbery. CKs are very rare for legal civilian characters, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Edited June 1, 2022 by ScarletRose

[Nyami]

22 minutes ago, ScarletRose said:

Honestly, it's not that bad. 

I've been playing on the same character for over a year now and I've only been PK'ed by another player once. PK meaning... My character died, but not permanently. I was able to respawn and just pretend all the rp that led to my character's death never happened. In one year, I've only managed to be killed by another player one time, and it was completely due to a situation my character caused. In terms of CKs, my character has never been close to being CK'ed, not even close. 

My point is that being CKed and losing your character is extremely rare (if you play a strictly legal civilian and avoid crime/making enemies). The only possible way to be CK'ed as a legal civilian character who isn't in a faction is to... 

A. Be killed by another character, who proceeds to submit a CK application to get you killed. Which... CK applications require a ton of evidence and good reasoning to be accepted. You're not going to be CKed over a random killing or something like that. The person who killed you would've needed very good reasons to kill you and it would've needed to be properly RP'ed over weeks/months for it to be accepted by admins. And if there's even one rulebreak during the entire RP surrounding your killing, you can report it or appeal and potentially reverse that CK. The chances of this happening and you being CK'ed from another character killing you is very rare, unless your character has enemies who want you dead... Which if you're a legal civilian, would also be a rare situation. Only criminal/gang characters really have to worry about this CK route, since they're usually making more enemies than legals.

B. You failed to roleplay fear during a robbery or something similar, and your character dies that way. This one's a little more plausible, but easily avoided. Just properly RP fear during threatening situations. If another character is robbing you and you decide to pull out a gun while already being aimed at, and you die, that could count as a CK if the other party wants to report you. Just, simple... Roleplay your character being in fear properly. It's already part of the rules anyways. 

C. You choose to IC'ly commit suicide, which is your own choice and is another way to be CK'ed. But again, this is something you have to voluntarily agree to, you can't be forced to CK your character via suicide. 

That's pretty much it. The only real possibility your character can be CK'ed is route B. Just roleplay fear properly and you won't be CK'ed over a robbery. CKs are very rare for legal civilian characters, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Thank you for this very clear explanation! This makes me feel a lot better.

 

I think this topic can be locked now, unless anybody else feels like it needs to stay open.

[DLimit]

On 6/1/2022 at 12:28 AM, Nyami said:

Wow, I didn't expect this thread to blow up with responses as much as it did.

I looked through a lot of these answers and from both reading them and experiencing things in game, I can gather that civilians are technically not the best type of characters to play here if you don't want to risk being CK'd (unless I misunderstood somehow, which I might have because I am really tired right now.)

It's a real shame, because I was hoping this place would be the online life simulator of my dreams. Maybe I'm more fit for somewhere else, be it another GTA RP or a different program like Second Life. Not saying I'm going to permanently quit, but it sucks that, like ode said, I feel like I have to be in constant fear of losing my character.

You have a higher chance of being CK'd as an illegal character, within a faction, than as a civilian character, 100%.

Take my word for it, a lot of people over-exaggerate their claims, here, but it happens, rarely, to civilian characters.

I really do recommend experiencing with the server, yourself, for a little longer to determine whether it's suitable for you.

EDIT; I've been on this server for 3 years. All of my forced CK'd characters were criminal RPers, and that was around 4 of them (with two of them happening in T.T.C.F., and they only lasted 2 weeks, each, tops, due to some poor mistakes my character's made, and they were faction members). Most of my CKs were VOLUNTARY CKs, conducted by myself. I've never had a civilian character CK'd. Does it happen? Yes. But, I'd say at a ratio from 1:20... 1 civilian CK for every 20 criminal CK.

Edited June 2, 2022 by DLimit

[Ski_]

Davis RPers frequently CK on their own, OCGs/Mobster only CK if they have to because they got faction CK'd and legal characters get CK'd very rarely.