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Noticeable increase in shootings and violent occurrences


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2 minutes ago, YAOMINGFROMEASTSIDELONGOS said:

The old OSS gang unit from SD used to do a good job with this, and illegal roleplayers were willing to have passive roleplay with them because they knew that they just wanted to roleplay and not try to fuck them over. 

 

This.

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The rates of pretty much everything is going to be skewed on a video game roleplay server. There’s a ridiculous rate of violence because this server isn’t remotely close to real life in most ways. Why is every 1 in 5 citizens a police officer? Why are there near hundreds of Italian American mobsters on the server when there’s virtually no LCN presence in California? Because people are going to roleplay what interests them and do things that make since in their perspective, and quite frankly could give a fuck less if they boost the murder rate. You can’t compare the crime rate to anything realistic when the server averages between 400-800 players and half the server population is either a hardcore criminal or police officer.

 

This is also an IC consequence. If you kill a police officer in real life America you’re life isn’t worth shit from that point on. You will be hunted and prosecuted until you’re either dead, away for life, or on death row. Very rarely do LEO factions pursue investigations into anything, including a cop kill. They just respawn and go back on patrol in a few hours. I know investigative RP can be hard, but don’t give me the bullshit that it’s impossible to investigate a gang or OCG. Recent SD operations like Operation Zookepeer, Operation Genghis Khan, and latest Operation Shakedown prove that to be false. Operation Safe Jails does this day in day out as well by building files on prison gangs as a result of IC violence towards deputies. If LEO rpers chose to pursue investigations instead of just cleaning up and moving on, you could see results. Instead, many chose to ignore it because they didn’t have their way. I believe adding an LEO faction that focuses on investigations could also help with this. 
 

For those saying there’s too many weapons in the hands of illegal rpers, you’re full of shit. We have more guns than people in the United States and even in an anti 2A state like California, criminals circumvent these laws. It’s easy to get a shitty stolen pistol on the streets of Los Angeles for 80-200 dollars. We need less Dracos and automatics and more cheap throwaway guns. This will cause looting and unnecessary police shootings to go down as people know losing a gun or getting a new one isn’t as big of a deal. 

Edited by county vida
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2 hours ago, NickyW said:

 

And in response to @BjornV? Fuck em. Let them (those who complain about police cracking down on crime) complain. I totally support IC restrictions based on crime. I wholly believe that the ridiculous crime rate is still within the realm of a problem that can be handled IC'ly. Maybe LSPD leadership just needs to work on a better plan to secure the city. It's not like the LSPD is a model police department in terms of presence (I understand they're busy, but still. It's not like there's a shortage of people who want to RP police officers).

 

The problem is that every government faction (PD included) wants to RP a realistic US state vs the South African lawless Tribal Wars showdown we actually have. This means. High employee standards, high complaint standards, high law standards etc. Just the fact we're a US state means there's a ton of law that applies to us. We can't start letting everyone be a cop, give them a gun and tell them to crack some heads in South Central- It's not what we want either, this only furthers the cops vs robbers mentality which is already too strong. The problem is mentality. "Fun" supersedes the mind of criminals whereas they end up standing on bridges shooting at cops. Harmless fun to them, but not fun to the officers. 

Nah. The problem needs to be fixed by cutting down on said crimes through giving more tools to deal with those crimes- Not by raising presence in hoods and trying to choke out gangs in general. Leave that to coordinated injunctions, please. There is a reason why over the last year, detective bureaus haven't grown but shrinked quite a bit even though LEO factions have grown.

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I think legal RPers got nothing to talk about, you guys brought back the cat ears. Shame
If that brings RP over guns and shootouts, then I'm Natasha Valentine.

Edited by Tifa
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2 minutes ago, Mooseicles said:

Shit-flinging aside, from my perspective as a primarily illegal RP'er, LEO's have all the tools necessary and more to combat the illegal scene. They just don't utilize them to their full effect and would rather, as previously mentioned by other posters on this thread, act as emotionless robocops that charge into gunfire. What I've witnessed is more and more LEO oriented content being added to the server, and only a few minor changes to how they operate such as the helicopter rule because having someone hover over and area of the map for 30 minutes straight shining a moonbeam on a group of people for simply standing around was beyond stupid. I'm all for cutting down on blockwipes, they annoy me just as much as they do you, as they actively disrupt roleplay in an area often for hours at a time because someones ego was hurt OOC. The argument for poor portrayal however extends to both sides. There are quality illegal RP'ers, and there are the shitters and DM'ers which give the scene a bad reputation. Then there are quality LEO RP'ers who portray actual human beings and who has a goal to RP instead of just a play-to-win mentality. And then you got the other LEO's who's main source of knowledge about law enforcement seems to stem from Training Day and other Hollywood action movies. I've seen mentions of harshers punishments being dealt for consistent rulebreaking and I am in your boat on that, but there are bad apples on all three sides, within the illegal scene, the LEO scene, and the legal scene.

You are right, lets dispense with the shit flinging. I have a natural reaction to dish out what I receive. For better or for worse I guess..

 

I'm not contesting you on the fact we have the tools. Ask anyone and they'll gladly tell you they'd want to deal with everything going on in an IC fashion. The problem is we CAN'T utilize them to their full effect. Because the  #1 reaction always comes in the form of "But.. But that'll disrupt our roleplay." The reason people are getting fed up and bringing it to the forums from an LEO side, is because the latest incident last night was the proverbial drop, in a long long line of constant shootings that ended up being pointless. That end in bickering from both sides, and PD's left to just stand there. Waiting till it gets resolved. Which last time I was in one, last week, took 30-45 minutes. Repeat that for several days a week, every week.

 

I apologize for generalizing the Illegal RP community, I'm usually far more composed. I've had great interactions with people, I go out of my way to make things as realistic as possible for them, and generally try to make people have a good and enjoyable experience. And I believe I'm doing so correctly, evident by the fact that 9/10 times I get a PM or a /B message thanking me & the people I was with for making stuff an enjoyable experience. When I get those messages, It tells me I'm actually contributing to providing a fun experience for people and it helps me to keep going. And that's honestly been my drive for 2 years.

 

But again. Look at it from my perspective, when lately all you respond to, is streets littered with bodies. Getting shit on for what you're doing in a video game on an OOC level (Yes, people are that petty). And some nights are spent by you standing by a scene with an admin on it. Often for pro-longed periods of time. To top it all off, the IC programs and projects pursued before were shut down by LFM/IFM. Leaving us unable to actually deal with the problems we face today on an IC level. We get subjected to the worst kinds of behavior on a repeated basis. It makes people cynical, and that cultivates an us-vs-them mentality.

 

Something has to change. Either start taking OOC measures to curb this level of sheer mayhem, or start giving us free reign to take IC measures and combat the problems that way. As we were intended to do all along.

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The solution is simple, any meaningful death, any shootout should be a CK, you get arrested for murder? Life sentence. Imagine being in a situation when you need violence but you might lose your character development if something goes wrong? Much more intense. And if after a CK you lose your assets? That'd be perfect. Ironman mode, wanna become a successful mob boss or gang leader? A true legend? Be smarter than everyone else and don't get killed or arrested. 

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Great thread to bring out to the general public. I think both on the Illegal, Legal, Civilian & Staff Side, we all agree with what is being written about the constant shootings, DM, and that whole mentality that shooting is the fix to everything and anything.

Funny enough, Staff is discussing this topic as-well, we created one a few days ago and have been actively discussing since. I can assure all of you that Management will review this topic as-well in the next few days (we will have to lock it at some point) and help get to the bottom of the issues that have been presented on the community. It's no secret that murders are skyrocketing on a daily.. In real life, a person might never see a violent crime happen before their eyes.. When people here might see it on a daily basis. 

However I ask for everyone that is posting here to be the "change" that they want to see. Don't be apart of the problem and also come on this thread and say how you want it to be changed. It only takes a handful of people that actively play the community on both the Illegal & Legal side to start the "movement" of change. If you are apart of an Illegal group, try to start transitioning away from violent crimes constantly, if you are a civilian, start taking violent crimes serious in-front of you (don't run away from robberies and RP some fear for example and make them more violent). 

It's a joint problem from everywhere, and shouldn't just be focused on Illegal gangs persay. We all know those civilians that think they are John Wick and can take down 15 people surrounding them with guns. We all need to get into it together and help change the flow of the community if we want it to be that way. Administrators can only hand out so many ajails and bans before that "mentality" has been spread to new members and it continues on a repeat cycle. 

The one thing I ask is that we all continue to be civil on the thread. If you don't agree with someone, that's okay, you don't have to call them a crap tier RPer. We all have different POV's and that's what makes it great, because it allows Management to get a better fundamental understanding of what you want us to change, how you want us to, and when you want us to. On the Administrative side, we are looking into what we can do, whether it be harsher punishments, letting it be handled through other means, IC means.. It's still a lot to discuss and not something we can snap our fingers and fix. 

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Just now, Lurleen said:

The solution is simple, any meaningful death, any shootout should be a CK, you get arrested for murder? Life sentence. Imagine being in a situation when you need violence but you might lose your character development if something goes wrong? Much more intense. And if after a CK you lose your assets? That'd be perfect. Ironman mode, wanna become a successful mob boss or gang leader? A true legend? Be smarter than everyone else and don't get killed or arrested. 

I'm neutral on the whole illegal vs legal shit but why would illegal characters be forced to CK and start from scratch when LEOs are able to take their previous position? 

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5 minutes ago, BINGBONGBALONEY said:

I'm neutral on the whole illegal vs legal shit but why would illegal characters be forced to CK and start from scratch when LEOs are able to take their previous position? 

A LEO must engage in a shooting if there's one, an illegal character can choose not to shoot and play their cards in a different way, or if powerful enough, send someone else to do the risky job for you. And, if making things hardcore produces less shootings, you could even enforce this rule for LEO's eventually since there would be less risky situations. LEO's could engage in more civilian RP and less action one. Imagine rping a relationship, friendships knowing your character be gone for good if something bad happens. 

A middle point would be, once your character reaches XX amount of in game hours, any kill is a CK.

Edited by Lurleen
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