Current state of Government / Political RP?

[Halloween]

I was wondering, mainly because of the upcoming elections, what is the current state of GOV / Political RP?

[orca112]

Last time I checked it was a toothless lion due to the deep involvement and micromanagement by LFM/Staff on decisions such as the legalization of Marijuana before it became distant to the average Joe with the change from a more relatable local government to a state Senate somewhere far away and the absence of elections.

But we will see what it may bring to the server with the announced elections, at least it will bring some interactions ingame and politicians fishing for votes during the campaign and election times.

[TheSenate]

The main bottleneck on any kind of political RP is the fact that all of the real politics of the server are completely OOC. Any substantial changes need to be OK’d by FM to ensure they won’t throw something out of balance. I think that pushes a lot of people away from participating in that kind of roleplay since political roleplay is basically a paper tiger where people get fancy titles like Senator or Mayor, but they don’t have any real power.

[Numark]

LOL. Political/Government RP is there now only for the sake of having a role like the person said above. In reality they are just like a regular homeless person with a home and flashy cars due to their income of being online, or even worse, since due to "character portrayal" you are not supposed to do things which a real life mayor/government employee would do.

[Tseard]

dead

[Numark]

Well on a second thought, its good that its that way, who knows what kind of weird things might happen if they just let any tom dick and harry decide what's going to happen with the server.. 😇

[Redke]

2 hours ago, TheSenate said:

The main bottleneck on any kind of political RP is the fact that all of the real politics of the server are completely OOC. Any substantial changes need to be OK’d by FM to ensure they won’t throw something out of balance. I think that pushes a lot of people away from participating in that kind of roleplay since political roleplay is basically a paper tiger where people get fancy titles like Senator or Mayor, but they don’t have any real power.

 

Highly disagree with this. We are very much embedded with legal factions and a lot of bills that are developed are derived from conversations with them, as well as concerns from citizens. People love to dog on the factions purely because they don't see our names popping up in clubs and bars, which is where 75% of the server spends their time. It's very niche, sure, but not inactive by any stretch of the imagination. Most bills that are developed are created for a specific purpose and I think it's quite unfair to over-generalize that just because one certain bill doesn't pertain to your specific character doesn't mean it's useless. One thing I found very fun roleplay was when my character introduced a bill to ban dirt bikes and quads from the roads, which many people publicly voiced their opinion against that. Just like real life, not every bill is going to pertain to everyone.

 

The part about LFM is understandable but it's not as micromanage-y as people love to make it out to be (opinions without experience is my favorite). The only real hump that we run into is when we are waiting for the "Governor" (LFM) to sign off on a bill, which can take a bit of time sometimes. However, it usually doesn't. They only tend to step in if there is something that Nervous doesn't want implemented. Otherwise, it's usually a rare case. I would go so far as to offer them props as well, LFM has been good with allowing things to run their course. When the Senate started, it was a different story. However, as it has switched hands a few times, people have allowed us to do our own thing and we all appreciate that.

Edited March 25, 2022 by Redke

[TheSenate]

9 hours ago, Redke said:

 

Highly disagree with this. We are very much embedded with legal factions and a lot of bills that are developed are derived from conversations with them, as well as concerns from citizens. People love to dog on the factions purely because they don't see our names popping up in clubs and bars, which is where 75% of the server spends their time. It's very niche, sure, but not inactive by any stretch of the imagination. Most bills that are developed are created for a specific purpose and I think it's quite unfair to over-generalize that just because one certain bill doesn't pertain to your specific character doesn't mean it's useless. One thing I found very fun roleplay was when my character introduced a bill to ban dirt bikes and quads from the roads, which many people publicly voiced their opinion against that. Just like real life, not every bill is going to pertain to everyone.

 

The part about LFM is understandable but it's not as micromanage-y as people love to make it out to be (opinions without experience is my favorite). The only real hump that we run into is when we are waiting for the "Governor" (LFM) to sign off on a bill, which can take a bit of time sometimes. However, it usually doesn't. They only tend to step in if there is something that Nervous doesn't want implemented. Otherwise, it's usually a rare case. I would go so far as to offer them props as well, LFM has been good with allowing things to run their course. When the Senate started, it was a different story. However, as it has switched hands a few times, people have allowed us to do our own thing and we all appreciate that.

 

My main point here is all the -real- politics are OOC. What is left over to the government to do in game is left over for a reason, it is largely inconsiquential otherwise. I'm not trying to shit on people who do political roleplay, more power to them. But it is a fact that most of the politics that actually matter on this server are out of character and they always will be. Typically whatever gets left over for IC government to handle is left over for a reason, because OOC powers have deemed that the actions would be largely inconsiquential or are consistent with the standard they are already looking to enforce OOCly. This has always been an issue with IC political roleplay long before GTAW was even a thing, on all of the servers we migrated from. The power given to those elected to IC political positions exists at the pleasure of those in OOC positions of power. The moment anything real happens that people actually seriously care about, 9/10 times OOC forces step in.

 

Which is by design, the fact of the matter is that people are hugely invested OOCly in what happens to their characters and in the IC world. It is a game and server management needs to try their best to tailor the experience in a manner that keeps people coming back for more. Otherwise if they allow IC politicians to have too much power, they risk the IC world deviating from the experience they are trying to sell, which in turn drives players away. 

 

tl:dr - My point is, unfortunately, I have seldom heard anyone express interest in IC politics. I have never heard anyone praise or curse their senator, most people don't even know their names. However, pretty much everyone in any sort of decently sized faction cares about who is in FM and what FM is up to. Because everything that really matters for the most part gets handled OOCly by FM. 

Edited March 26, 2022 by TheSenate

[H04X]

Only just seen this thread. I can only speak from the perspective of State Government, not City.


 

On 3/25/2022 at 5:57 PM, orca112 said:

Last time I checked it was a toothless lion due to the deep involvement and micromanagement by LFM/Staff on decisions such as the legalization of Marijuana before it became distant to the average Joe with the change from a more relatable local government to a state Senate somewhere far away and the absence of elections.

But we will see what it may bring to the server with the announced elections, at least it will bring some interactions ingame and politicians fishing for votes during the campaign and election times.

It is true that the faction suffered in the past, however we work very hard to ensure we keep a robust relationship with LFM. Huge shout-out to BaileyG, Storm and Moe for being absolute angels; working with them is a huge blessing and it will definitely aid us in the future to create more interesting roleplay. The pause on elections was an OOC decision by previous LFM leadership, one that was constantly challenged to no avail. Thankfully, we now have a set schedule for the current referendum, while we're also working hard behind the scenes to ensure future elections don't get hard paused and they happen more frequently - the original idea behind the whole deal. We deliberately made the campaign season longer than before. This was done to promote more roleplay and interaction between candidates, government officials and the public as we've seen during the very first election with Oswald Halford. However, it doesn't stop as soon as the representatives are announced and inaugurated. I always encourage people to take any sort of ideas they might have to a senator. As ironic as it might seem, the senate is only fully functional while the players actively seek out involvement. If you're tired of fake charities, getting tickets for parking on red while it was a parking space, wish for lobbying roleplay, wish for a Stand-Your-Ground clause, or tints - approach a senator. They are equipped with the right IC and OOC tools to codify any solutions to your day-to-day issues you may face. It is only natural for them to get into boring bureaucratic bills and whatnot when there is absolutely nothing else to do because no one approaches them with concerns. 

 

On 3/25/2022 at 6:17 PM, TheSenate said:

The main bottleneck on any kind of political RP is the fact that all of the real politics of the server are completely OOC. Any substantial changes need to be OK’d by FM to ensure they won’t throw something out of balance. I think that pushes a lot of people away from participating in that kind of roleplay since political roleplay is basically a paper tiger where people get fancy titles like Senator or Mayor, but they don’t have any real power.

There is a lot to do in legislature. While, yes, there is a layer where everything has to be OK'd by LFM, they've been very open to discussions. The Senate's purpose is to respond to the server's culture and they understand that. 

 

On 3/25/2022 at 8:24 PM, Numark said:

LOL. Political/Government RP is there now only for the sake of having a role like the person said above. In reality they are just like a regular homeless person with a home and flashy cars due to their income of being online, or even worse, since due to "character portrayal" you are not supposed to do things which a real life mayor/government employee would do.

Not too sure what you mean. There's a lot of roleplay involved and it's beyond just going to clubs and whatnot. There's regular backroom chats between lawmakers, a lot of politicking with each other, members of the public and such.

 

On 3/25/2022 at 8:24 PM, Tseard said:

dead

 

Spoiler

 

On 3/25/2022 at 8:45 PM, Numark said:

Well on a second thought, its good that its that way, who knows what kind of weird things might happen if they just let any tom dick and harry decide what's going to happen with the server.. 😇

A lot goes into vetting candidates and members of the faction. I work very closely with LFM to ensure we don't get characters that would be unhealthy for the faction. And besides, that's why we have checks and balances in place. If you feel something is stupid, approach a Senator to have it struck off (if it even passes in the first place). Approach lawyers to have the courts review the validity of the laws passed, like with the SHAFT. Voice your concerns so that the senators may address it. But this self-contradicting approach of "I don't want random people to decide what happens" and "not enough stuff happens IC" doesn't help at all. 

 

On 3/25/2022 at 9:10 PM, Redke said:

 

Highly disagree with this. We are very much embedded with legal factions and a lot of bills that are developed are derived from conversations with them, as well as concerns from citizens. People love to dog on the factions purely because they don't see our names popping up in clubs and bars, which is where 75% of the server spends their time. It's very niche, sure, but not inactive by any stretch of the imagination. Most bills that are developed are created for a specific purpose and I think it's quite unfair to over-generalize that just because one certain bill doesn't pertain to your specific character doesn't mean it's useless. One thing I found very fun roleplay was when my character introduced a bill to ban dirt bikes and quads from the roads, which many people publicly voiced their opinion against that. Just like real life, not every bill is going to pertain to everyone.

 

The part about LFM is understandable but it's not as micromanage-y as people love to make it out to be (opinions without experience is my favorite). The only real hump that we run into is when we are waiting for the "Governor" (LFM) to sign off on a bill, which can take a bit of time sometimes. However, it usually doesn't. They only tend to step in if there is something that Nervous doesn't want implemented. Otherwise, it's usually a rare case. I would go so far as to offer them props as well, LFM has been good with allowing things to run their course. When the Senate started, it was a different story. However, as it has switched hands a few times, people have allowed us to do our own thing and we all appreciate that.

Very well put. Basically this. I still want people to protest outside the Capitol after a session, it'd spice things up.
 

On 3/26/2022 at 6:21 AM, TheSenate said:

 

My main point here is all the -real- politics are OOC. What is left over to the government to do in game is left over for a reason, it is largely inconsiquential otherwise. I'm not trying to shit on people who do political roleplay, more power to them. But it is a fact that most of the politics that actually matter on this server are out of character and they always will be. Typically whatever gets left over for IC government to handle is left over for a reason, because OOC powers have deemed that the actions would be largely inconsiquential or are consistent with the standard they are already looking to enforce OOCly. This has always been an issue with IC political roleplay long before GTAW was even a thing, on all of the servers we migrated from. The power given to those elected to IC political positions exists at the pleasure of those in OOC positions of power. The moment anything real happens that people actually seriously care about, 9/10 times OOC forces step in.

 

Which is by design, the fact of the matter is that people are hugely invested OOCly in what happens to their characters and in the IC world. It is a game and server management needs to try their best to tailor the experience in a manner that keeps people coming back for more. Otherwise if they allow IC politicians to have too much power, they risk the IC world deviating from the experience they are trying to sell, which in turn drives players away. 

 

tl:dr - My point is, unfortunately, I have seldom heard anyone express interest in IC politics. I have never heard anyone praise or curse their senator, most people don't even know their names. However, pretty much everyone in any sort of decently sized faction cares about who is in FM and what FM is up to. Because everything that really matters for the most part gets handled OOCly by FM. 

Well, yes. We focus on the server's own culture and events. There's countless instances of this. We had a large debate last year regarding capital punishment. That involved the whole server, a large number of people protested, over 40 cops signed a petition to oppose its abolition. Or when a senator introduced a ban on dirt bikes and the whole server responded to the bill. Everything was kept IC and these weren't just average topics. Not every bill is going to excite everyone and that's just something that has to be swallowed. But I do understand what you mean by this. I look forward to working with LFM to introduce some newer system to create more IC controversy through Senate actions (of course, with accountability) and to keep things in-character rather than trail it off course and start an OOC fest. In fact, there are some discussions currently on-going. 
 

On 3/25/2022 at 2:47 PM, Nani mo Iranai said:

I was wondering, mainly because of the upcoming elections, what is the current state of GOV / Political RP?

To answer this: There's a lot going on. This round of elections is just to oil the cogs, things are looking good for the future of the faction and political roleplay as a whole. Just requires some patience, engagement, and ambition.

[Koko]

From someone that was offered to run for office but declined because my character at the time wasn't a US Citizen and didn't have a green card and I thought it wouldn't make sense: It all seems like a lot of paperwork which is neither here nor there (it's sort of what you sign up for), yet honestly, for every one interesting bill there seems to be a host of mostly inconsequential changes and proposals that promote the idea of political change more than they actually bring. Another big issue really is that most Senators are not even known figures, some Senators seem to appear from the aether and sit their position and don't have a particularly active media presence.

 

The Government world is thus really alienating since ultimately you don't really have to campaign really hard for support, since what you need is the Government faction's support most of all. A lot of candidates also seem to sometimes have very vague campaigns on things that really don't matter to the server life such as opinions on abortion which really just make partisan lines really pronounced and polarizing for no reason. Ultimately in a server of this size your average middle-class character that's active in social media or engaged to some degree current events should be familiar with the names of their Senators at the very least.

 

I still would very much return to the idea of district representatives fighting for their own neighbourhoods to promote tangible, day to day change in their local communities that characters at a grassroots level can engage with, rather than this emphasis on state-wide legislature.