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Police Helicopter Usage


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2 minutes and a cooldown of 5 to wait around somewhere else does feel pretty extreme, the time over target should be longer for that amount of wait time, can't make much out in two minutes. And what counts as "one area of the map" here? 

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6 minutes ago, Anonymouse said:

Realistically agree with the fact that there'd be a lot lot lot more vehicles everywhere, and people, meaning you wouldn't find a car full of four people with gloves and masks on nearly as easily. But it goes both ways and the balancing factor is that you can go shoot someone on an "empty" street which would realistically, in an actual city, have dozens and dozens of people to witness said crime. Plus people recording it, as does happen often these days. Or CCTV, traces of hair, easier ways of finding fingerprints, shoe prints, and so on. Realistic to find a car full of people gloved up and masked up from an AIR unit? Chances are slim. But criminals also have the opportunity of mowing down a crowd of people in say Vespucci on Bay City Avenue. And if no cops or nearby pedestrian's witness and call the cops? You get a free pass of killing 4+ people in what's meant to be a big city full of life and people, which comes with recordings, physical evidence left behind, car plates and so on. The 'balancing' issue swings both ways. Not realistic or balanced when a pair of gloves and running into a friends house / apartment completely negates anything LEO's can do. Which leaves LEO's with either having to witness it or catch them shortly after due to a 911 call, or turn in a few casings for it become a cold case because the lack of abilities Detective's have due to server script. LEO's don't have the "luxury" of catching a criminal after a crime has been committed due to game and script limitations just as criminals don't have the luxury of being able to slip off into a crowd.

While I understand the intention of what you're trying to say, and while the areas don't make sense these sort of things go unreported in real life all the time.  They are often found after the fact and that's part of why investigative units exist.   If every crime could be stopped in real time and witnessed there would be no need for detectives and crime scene investigation but that's simply not the case.   While the area these things happen on the server doesn't always make sense, I'd argue that 95% of them are found within 10 minutes and information can be gathered from bullet casings, blood and if there's mapped CCTV admins or the involved players will typically fill in the gaps.   Also half of the LEO roleplayers on the server have those mental sound mods where they can hear gunshots from much further than other people.  I'd argue that I've witnessed maybe three incidents where PD/SD didn't get to a scene within 10 minutes, let alone not while it's actually happening in the three months I've been active on an LEO character, including when I play right before/after server reset.

5 minutes ago, Jeroen said:

The changes are dumb and the changes made aren't done with the LEO air units as a collective, and are therefore incompatible with most of their wishes.

 

Currently phoneposting so I'll explain it in detail later in the evening.

I don't know why you think the server administration should be consulting with LEO air units if the concern is how certain people in those units are acting.  There was never going to be a reality where they'd do things just as everyone in those units was happy, it has been the actions of people in those units that has led to a ruling being required.

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1 minute ago, Jeroen said:

This is a dangerous assumption my friend.

No, it is not "dangerous."

 

Who maintains the helicopter? Do you hire civilian staff to work on it? Do you have a copilot/TFO? Is the helicopter stored somewhere, or is it magically spawned at a helipad with no infrastructure to maintain and operate it? Do you have a dedicated pilot character, that is of a realistic age/appearance/education or is this your "cop" character that is also trained in pursuit, investigative and tactical methods? 

 

I would have no quarrels with aerial units being given impunity if people roleplayed actual pilots and flight staff, if there was cool roleplay behind it. Yet, from what I have seen, "rolling deployments" are the majority of callouts. No events, no involvement of factors outside of the inner circle of the faction with access to the vulture drones (bar exceptions to a few factions that have been attempting that). Nothing. Just an eye in the sky that reports everything to all on-duty police staff. Yet, everyone else on this server is expected to showcase a specific style of roleplay, that is in-depth and persistent to the capacities their character/organization/faction is claiming to realistically have.

 

You are not here to police the server for criminality so it is not in your interest to catch every (in character) wrongdoer. You are a player (roleplayer, if you would), just like everyone else. And I do not think that the current portrayal was adequate enough, and I think the community/staff realized that and moved to corrugate inadequate behavior.

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Just now, Nick87 said:

2 minutes and a cooldown of 5 to wait around somewhere else does feel pretty extreme, the time over target should be longer for that amount of wait time, can't make much out in two minutes. And what counts as "one area of the map" here? 

As an active pilot, 5 minutes is a very reasonable time to 'return' to a zone, should nothing be happening in that zone and I'm just flying around looking for crime. The two minutes, though, is laughable in how short it is. It takes a helicopter that full two minutes JUST to fly over South Central, let alone slowing down so you can actually see anything. Just more proof that these rules were not created with ASD 'in the loop', if you will. This is being forced upon us.

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2 minutes ago, Bomber Harris said:

It is a video game, not real life. Stop bringing up real life capabilities and aerial components when you don't put in any effort portraying a pilot or managing a rotary wing aircraft. You get in, do a single line of roleplay, a pretyped ATC message and fly off. This contributes nothing and there is no cool portrayal. I won't even touch upon how ridiculous it is to operate the ball camera and fly at the same time.  

 

If pilots are not putting in the same effort/portrayal with which real life helicopters are regarded, you cannot make the case that you need real life capabilities to persecute virtual (in character, pretend) criminals. This is a video game and fun needs to be had on both sides. Yes, people will drive around masked up and with gloves while commuting to their intended spot for nefarious acts. So what? Are they destined to get executed by police operatives and thereby lose IC assets and a story-continuity they have been developing?

 

 

This argument is so hypocritical. We all know it's a game. But you can't pick and choose when it's a game and when it's real life. You literally follow up that statement with "how ridiculous it is to operate the ball camera and fly at the same time." We get that, but as you said literally two sentences before, it's a game. We don't have the ability to have a TFO on every single flight because, you guessed it, it's a game!

 

Now I will refrain from calling out illegal RPers because I'll be honest, I have no prior experience playing as one besides petty crime. With that said, I HIGHLY doubt they are all putting in the same 1:1 realism you are expecting out of a LEO pilot into their gun maintenance, care, handling or half the other things required to be a successful criminal in real life. You even mention one of them, driving around masked up and gloved. If you don't want a helicopter to see you driving around masked up and gloved, here's a though, don't! Put your mask and gloves on when you arrive at the destination. In the scenario you are speaking up LEO shouldn't be nerfed because they illegal RPer is too lazy to be a smart criminal.

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3 minutes ago, Coach said:

This argument is so hypocritical. We all know it's a game. But you can't pick and choose when it's a game and when it's real life. You literally follow up that statement with "how ridiculous it is to operate the ball camera and fly at the same time." We get that, but as you said literally two sentences before, it's a game. We don't have the ability to have a TFO on every single flight because, you guessed it, it's a game!

 

Now I will refrain from calling out illegal RPers because I'll be honest, I have no prior experience playing as one besides petty crime. With that said, I HIGHLY doubt they are all putting in the same 1:1 realism you are expecting out of a LEO pilot into their gun maintenance, care, handling or half the other things required to be a successful criminal in real life. You even mention one of them, driving around masked up and gloved. If you don't want a helicopter to see you driving around masked up and gloved, here's a though, don't! Put your mask and gloves on when you arrive at the destination. In the scenario you are speaking up LEO shouldn't be nerfed because they illegal RPer is too lazy to be a smart criminal.

You have a magical all-seeing aircraft. This is the "I win" button for 99% of pursuits. Of course you should have a TFO and not be given free reign to do whatever you wish. The game logic on realism I am applying is to the fairness aspect, which you provide 0 of if you are an unlockable achievement for the ground units like it is a game of Call of Duty.

Edited by Bomber Harris
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3 minutes ago, Phased said:

I don't know why you think the server administration should be consulting with LEO air units if the concern is how certain people in those units are acting.  There was never going to be a reality where they'd do things just as everyone in those units was happy, it has been the actions of people in those units that has led to a ruling being required.

Speaking as a member of the command team in PD's ASD, what is frustrating to me is we were never approached about this. We had a couple offhand complaints here and there, but it was never brought to us as any more than "a few bad apples". So to get a message this morning linked to this MASSIVE MASSIVE change without being given the opportunity to make the change ourselves is pretty disappointing.

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