The insane time needed to report/request...

[mj2002]

27 minutes ago, Trupiano said:

GTAW is the only server where I've seen the staff team grow and grow yet the amount of work that gets done seems to be less and less. 

 

And I know somebody is reading this and immediately rage typing about how much hard work staff does that we don't see or that they are volunteers. Frankly I don't really care and neither should you. This server is unable to meet it's most basic management duties in a timely manner, that's unacceptable for a community with thousands of players that generates tens of thousands of dollars in donations a year. The worst part, on top of that there seems to be a never ending and always changing amount of bureaucratic hoops to jump through to get anything done. Something that only puts more strain on the staff team by creating more work to sift through. It's ridiculous how many times I've seen someone report a situation only for it to take so long for staff to address it that said situation spirals into two more reports and a CK appeal. 

 

Whatever staff is doing, its not working and I hope a serious discussion is had within staff about find a solution. But it's become very clear to me as a player that the entire system of how staff operates needs to be reworked from the ground floor because this issue is systemic. 

 

You should care about the volunteer work being done by the staff. They, in part, make your experience here possible and prevent the server's environment from descending (further) into complete chaos. Essentially, that chaos, is what you can expect on every single other server currently in existence. Administrators put their free time into helping the community keep itself together, and I believe they deserve a little more respect. Remember, you are donating money, not paying for a service where support staff are at your beck and call. 

 

As for the bureaucracy, paperwork, applications, and work needed to sift through reports and so on. You realize that this is not present just to annoy people, right? It is present to keep things fair. Almost all this experienced bureaucracy is in place in order to keep the playing field level for everyone. Many of goals that these systems have are intangible and hard to turn into a one-liner response that sounds good in a discussion. However, they are important.

 

That application required for the hearse? That's in place so that it isn't used as a tool to troll other players. We both know, they'll be used to taunt players in some conflict with another group of players. Not characters, because realistically that'd never happen, but players.  Can that list be refined and improved, sure. However, it is there for a reason. If you have a view point to contribute on what should be on the list, then make a set of suggestions. Leaving a comment in a random thread isn't going to reach Property Management.

 

The application required for that house or business? That's in place to keep the distribution of limited properties fair for other players who might also wish to apply for the same property. This keeps the quality of roleplay and the business concepts at a high quality, so people don't turn every single building into a casino or a bar, even if the exterior is completely unsuitable for this. This is the grand scheme of things that is important for the server, but which you don't necessarily experience first hand right away.

 

Keep this in mind when you feel like you're jumping through hoops. They're there to keep things fair for everyone, not to annoy you for no reason.

 

Do there need to be improvements? Sure, we all know the waiting times are sometimes very lengthy. I don't like the new trend that forum reports are picked up with "It has been a month, are you still interested in pursuing this?" as a first reply by administrators. But they're doing the best they can without burning themselves out. Instead of complaining about staff, try to see how you can contribute yourself.

 

• Trouble with applications for properties, houses, or vehicles? Ask for help! Fellow players and staff members will be happy to get you going. This is not like the server application where you have to do everything by yourself. Try to understand what Property Management is attempted to learn from you, and fill in your applications accordingly.

 

• The forum reports taking so long to be handled? Next time you are involved in one, simply state your side of the story and stop replying. These reports take so long because people argue with each other over and over again, helping no one. Maybe not you personally, but you know every second report ends like this.

 

• Apply for staff! Each month, staff members retire (or are removed 😔) and the team can use new volunteers to help ease the workload of all other staff members. Do you want to improve the situation? Start helping out. This is a lot harder than creating a thread and complaining about the situation, but unlike doing that, applying actually helps everyone.

 

Don't get me wrong. Many posts here have valid concerns and waiting times are long. However, please don't blame ordinary administrators for this. If anything, direct your energy towards management. But even better, help out with suggestions, guides, helping new players, helping any players, applying for staff, etcetera. Anything that makes the life of the average administrator a little easier when it comes to their work here, helps the entire population.

[Esc]

5 minutes ago, knppel said:

 

I have no full insight obviously, but my impression after looking at it for a year now is that overgrown bureaucracy within the staff team.

In particular this concerns decisions individual staff teams take, or may not take depending on which respective sub-staff-divison they're also on.

 

As mentioned I've not observed this server as long yet, but the amount of micromanagement that happens here does, even with best efforts, decrease efficiency in handling many things.

 

 

As I've said some months ago on a related topic, rpqm more than any other section suffers from a lack of guidelines for players on how to interact with it as a body, as "bad roleplay" is first of all subjective impression and not easily objectively to prove fact.

 

Unrelated to specific issues that could possibly be tackled by delegating more staff to handle topics (may it be rpqm or anything), I've recently seen a new systemic issue evolve here:

 

Reports are made on the normal section over rulebreaks , often things that seem petty, but are (so usually the consensus on discord general and quite often the verdict on reports too) without question bad roleplay.

However, often involved players get let off with a warning despite clearly breaking a rule, and reporters are thanked and told to please also submit a rpqm report if they also feel bothered by the roleplay quality and not just the nit-picky rules bad roleplayers tend to constantly break.

 

Obviously, this is an individually comfortable solution for the handling staff members as they can be lenient and file reports off, even when the issue isn't solved at all (see reports on repeated rulebreakers for examples).

However it's not really encouraging for players bothering to report rule breaks to be sent from Pontius to Pilate over what in a typical case was a short, unpleasant and unremarkable encounter where someone broke rules (general disregard is also covered by IG 1, it doesn't need to flag it as rpqm handled imho).

 

And of course creating a more of work for the staff team as a whole (by requiring players to file additional reports over already handled incidents) is mid and long term not achieving the goal of less work (demonstrated by rpqm reports piling up, but not only them).

 

As mentioned that's my observation, I don't have actual insight, but in comparison, where lsrp looked like bad internal communication to me, here I am quite sure this runs better, however the amount of micromanaging and different responsibilities in staff is what prevents efficient handling , and internal communication has established borders further preventing this (such as splitting roleplay quality from rule reports. As if good roleplay allowed me to break rules to my liking and upholding them wasn't like, a base to begin with anyone should uphold as a bare minimum... 🙄

 

You know, when your bag can only carry 5 books but you insist that you must carry 10. 

 

That is how it feels. You know you have a short team, but you add more weight on their shoulders.

They should deffo work to fasten the process instead of creating one and another new division.

Most things appeal for common knowledge... Cant be rocket science. 

When your workload is heavy, find more hands to help you instead of working extra.

[Trupiano]

17 minutes ago, mj2002 said:

You should care about the volunteer work being done by the staff. They, in part, make your experience here possible and prevent the server's environment from descending (further) into complete chaos. Essentially, that chaos, is what you can expect on every single other server currently in existence. Administrators put their free time into helping the community keep itself together, and I believe they deserve a little more respect. Remember, you are donating money, not paying for a service where support staff are at your beck and call. 

 

Firstly, there barely are any other RP servers given GTAW was able to effectively corner the market while everyone clung to a decade old game. Lets not pretend that the staff here is providing some type of world class service because they have practically 0 competition. The reality is, the areas in which GTAW's staff fail aren't even exclusive to GTA RP servers. normal ass reports are something every single RP server across every game type has to handle and many of them do it better then GTAW with less staff members and more players. 

 

Secondly, the only reason it's a donation is because calling it a donation is a legal loophole, everybody knows this. I brought it up not to say that staff needs to be at my beck and call (Because I know they aren't seeing any of that money) but because I wanted to highlight that This server generates revenue for it's owner, therefor there's an incentive to fix broken systems. 

 

28 minutes ago, mj2002 said:

Bullshit excuses for poor performance.

 

It should have not taken 61 days, 2 staff reports and threatening to management that I was going to quit the server for them to look at my CK appeal.

 

Factions shouldn't be losing properties during wars because one admin team forgot to tell the players that they need to fill out an obscure property form for another admin team. 

 

The admin team shouldn't be insisting players submit RPQM reports if they are going to sit open for 6+ months. 

 

Reports shouldn't be sitting open so fucking long that all involved parties have quit the server. 

 

You say it's all to make things fair or for even checks and balances, I see an insurmountable amount of hoops players either have to spend months jumping through to even get an answer on their idea or spend their entire lives no lifing this community until they have enough friends in staff that they can just side step the process.

 

As I said in my original reply, the issues plaguing this server are systemic and they've been there since breaking 300 players on a Friday night was exciting. There's a reason that the issue has grown alongside our player numbers even though we've expanded the staff team the entire time. The system that they are working within doesn't fucking work. 

[imi]

1 hour ago, Trupiano said:

GTAW is the only server where I've seen the staff team grow and grow yet the amount of work that gets done seems to be less and less. 

[Swag]

14 minutes ago, imi said:

1 hour ago, Trupiano said:

GTAW is the only server where I've seen the staff team grow and grow yet the amount of work that gets done seems to be less and less. 

This is unfortunately true.

[Moe]

join the staff team and come put an end to this blasphemy🙂

Edited October 3, 2021 by Moe

[Brian3898]

We are taking volunteers to please assist these unacceptable waiting times, please guys we need all the help we can get!!!!!!!!!  🥺

[Wuhtah]

Hey guys!

 

I get where your frustrations are coming from, believe me. I do not know the IFM/LFM stand point at all, nor the CK appeals and staff reports themselves. I can't comment on these things. 

 

I do know about forum reports, reports in game, and refund requests. I can touch up on those.

 

For refund requests: These tended to take a little longer in the past, but I can verify now that on average - 85% of them are done within 24 hours. I know you can't take my word for it as they are now hidden to stop inciting metagame, but I promise you - most do. There are some refund requests that do sit for a bit because the logs cannot verify them 100% and we need to dive more into it. This is for the player's benefit, not for ours. We take time out of our day to dig for hours sometimes to get you guys what you need and sometimes get management/Nervous involved. 

 

For forum reports: These do take time sometimes and whether that's on administrator's or player's its a bit of a mixture. I do understand it's completely frustrating seeing a report sit there for weeks on end and not having the administrator respond to it. I highly suggest that if all parties have answered and it's been a couple of days (5-7), to tag the handling administrator. If this does not help - go to the head of administrative team @Odin or the assistant head of of the administrative team @Wally. If neither of these people get back to you, go to the head of the staff team @Pillsbury. There are steps in place to get the ball rolling, and I do apologize for any lack of response time you guys get. There are tons of player reports on the forums, and it is hard to keep up with them most days whilst doing other administrative duties such as subteam work as well. 

 

And then there are reports in game: Roleplay reports take awhile sometimes, while some of you are frustrated at each other and the administrator on scene. I will not lie to you - I hate taking roleplay reports (I still do anyways). There's always going to be an angry player that comes out of it, and I truly hate making you guys upset. I try, personally, to teach first before punishing. If the player is not receptive, well - you can only lead a horse to water. You cannot make them drink. Sometimes, these reports take ages to get picked up, and by the time an administrator picks it up - it's already done and over with and you'll have to make a player report on the forums. Please understand where we do volunteer to do this job, we also try very hard to do it correctly and not everyone will agree with us. That is why staff reports are more than welcomed. We take each staff report, and we do learn and grow as a staff team - but this is probably why it takes longer. Rules are reformed because of you guys shedding light on a different perspective and we appreciate you guys for that.

 

However, this thread does seem to be attacking from both sides. Let's go ahead and twist this thread around, so we can hopefully gain some insight from you guys (the players) on how us (administrators) could handle reports better. What advice do you guys have for us? 

Edited October 3, 2021 by Wuhtah

[GambloTwitch]

I'm sad about this. My character who leads a faction is in prison, facing a trial with life imprisonment request. I am trying to get in touch with Faction Management (I would just need to ask a few question taking 5 minutes of their time) but I get ignored on Discord and, through private messages, it takes 24 hours or more MAYBE to get a reply. I know you are admins and all, but I just want to ask a couple of questions which is IMPOSSIBLE for me to find answers if not from YOU from Faction Management.

[Bandit.]

1 hour ago, Moe said:

join the staff team and come put an end to this blasphemy🙂

 

59 minutes ago, Brian3898 said:

We are taking volunteers to please assist these unacceptable waiting times, please guys we need all the help we can get!!!!!!!!!  🥺

 

This doesn't seem to be answer as many have pointed out in the posts above. Its not like /we/ asked y'all to become admins on this server. /YOU/ chose to apply and do it knowing the responsibility. With that being said- I've seen multiple people (including myself) apply for admin/support and get turned away because we weren't "active" on the forums.