The Park Rangers Discussion

[Engelbert]

As @mj2002 said above. Roleplaying has no winners or losers. It's a story, a story where nothing is written before you start telling it. 

[Koko]

52 minutes ago, Adm said:

Something I would be really passionate about once I start playing again. Albeit in Australia, I've worked in regulation and currently studying postgrad ag science primarily around land management. I don't mind the idea of LE per se but from what I can really see is a lot of the RP is limited within the parks, the counties, and those players in it. I've noted earlier comments about Fish and Wildlife and it appears to have been well received.

• Approaching legal factions to discuss emergency spill or cleanup procedures. I could see a lot of RP coming out of Aurum for example in ensuring they have correct environmental protection plans in place. Can not be a "show us your plan or we'll shut you down", more like working together to devise the plan.
• Flora/fauna surveys. Consulting with SAPR prior to any major developments, etc. Along the lines of planning approval, but having SAPR ecologists surveying areas to ensure it seems appropriate to bulldoze. Creating publications on animals in urban areas (eg: racoons?)
• Contracting. Assume for some reason there is a sudden growth in wild boar population. In real life, these animals can cause major damage to farmland, etc. Go through all the RP of contracting hunters, going through legal channels to allow for a hunt in a prohibited area, then conducting a hunt with a lot of hunters simultaneously, and the issues and tribulations that can obviously cause.
• Wildfires. Not sure on how possible this is, but discussions and subsequent RP working with FD/State on wildfire zones. Follow up RP - managing fuel reduction burns, burning off. Lot of work with FD with S&R as well I imagine. California is huge for wildfires obviously. Firebans, etc also a possibility. 
• Big fishing update coming obviously. However would be cool to see more in the way of RP surround SCUBA. It's cool underwater. Random events like shark sightings at a beach or two. Going through process of shoot v catch. 
• RP surround planes. Link to above point on wildfires. Use planes to release fish (look it up, its cool as fuck). S&R
• Farming. RPing random site checks (with players if anyone RPs farming) ensuring chemical application rates etc are all above board. Working with State on legislation re: when you can/cannot spray herbicides/fertilizers, etc. 

Forgive my ignorance if any of this is already done. Limited personal experience with the faction.

I started several things in this vein but found little interest from the faction at the time to engage with it. I was more on the recreational side of it creating a guide on local plants, as well as landmarks.

 

On the ecology side, before leaving the faction I was working on a guide on pest control, tree diseases and tree surgery etc. but never finalized it because it generated little reaction beyond "that's cool that you're doing that".

 

Would love to see someone knowledgeable taking a big faction-wide focus on it as a mark of identity for the faction.

[knppel]

Fiiiiiine, I'll elaborate.

 

Quote

"New opinions are always suspected, and usually opposed, without any other reason but because they are not already common"

-John Locke

 

Some of the oldtimers here will still remember when in an old version of gta rp someone came up with the incredibly controversial idea to "undermine the PD's monopoly on Law Enforcement" (so one possible point of view).

 

Needless to point out, eventually things calmed down and nowadays SD is lore for anybody same as never finding a mayor that doesn't get themselves booted immediately for something, and while we still have the rethorical arguments about whether or not they should rp in the city as that's realistically not their jurisdiction, we won't make a big fuzz over it.

Why? For the simple reason we're all used to the existence of SD, so we don't spot it as systematic flaw even if it situationally might bother us ic (as anything might depending on where we stand).

 

28 minutes ago, eTaylor said:

The LSPD and LSSD both have the means and the cause to cut, choke and subject criminal roleplay - yet they don’t. They mind the massive machine that is modern law enforcement and yield breathing room where appropriate. For some reason the SAPR hasn’t figured out that tech tree yet. 

13 minutes ago, mj2002 said:

There is never a concern that criminal roleplay is being choked out

 

There is a constant concern criminal roleplay gets choked out- by criminal roleplayers, unironically (and while some of them have established factions and long standing characters or activity here, others in that scene just as much do what we discussed on the other thread yesterday to simulate success in criminal endeveaours opposed to like, actually trying ic ).

 

 

To understand where this is coming from one has to take lsrp's history in account (WHY?!), where a big bad PD with 300 members was patrolling the streets and while ultimately it all worked exactly the same and you could pack people in a trunk at gunpoint at any corner if no one was watching, of course it made for a vastly different setting than our ghost-town does.

Furthermore, back then there was an at times unhealthy direct competition on ooc goals when criminal factions aimed to achieve the desired "official" status, coming along with some supply in guns and drugs, and on the other hand the Detectives who were effectively charged of trying to bring these down again.

 

Now while I can't comment on how it evolved on gtaw from 2018-20, not having observed that here, the base principle is simply correct:
Law Enforcement, if consequently acting out its role, can have the means to literally shut down any criminal roleplay (because it's illegal, d'oh).

 

 

3 minutes ago, Engelbert said:

As @mj2002 said above. Roleplaying has no winners or losers. It's a story, a story where nothing is written before you start telling it. 

Exceptions stating the rule though, the usual role model are Tony Montana- types, not that buddy of Jesse Pinkman who wears the funny hat and gets beaten up all the time.

 

Now while I'll be the first one to go ahead and say people should roleplay more losers (it's hilarious lol, try it), it's also not hard to guess that obviously this is not a particular popular concept- winning, as a matter of fact, is enjoyable, and I just as much also let my character succeed situationally when she can because roleplaying depression over constant failure is also no really motivating concept, no matter what profession one follows ic.

 

Not "playing to win" is an honourable approach, however one needs to take in account regardless that our playmode here first of all lives of conflict between players - conflict creates roleplay, and this counts double as much in the criminal scene where people effectively fight over stuff, with guns in case.

This reaches from small random encounters like that robbery at the corner up to big scale wars- and is by no means limited to open violence as sole tool.

 

Why do I pick this point out: Because there's often a vital misunderstanding when it comes to the mentioned story-telling, and people plan that step too far ahead (i.e. calculating in to get away unseen with whatever, despite failing to take precautious matters actually ensuring so).

 

As soon as then something happens that doesn't fit their story- such as a law enforcement officer of no matter which faction interfering, to name a prominent common example- the storytelling approach overwrites common sense and forces the storyteller to play to win to continue their story (unless they're flexible enough, but not everyone is), and they'll for example have to try evade the police unreasonably because in their next chapter they sit at home already and roleplay the heavy trauma from the dirty deed they just committed and got away with.

[Adm]

16 minutes ago, Koko said:

I started several things in this vein but found little interest from the faction at the time to engage with it. I was more on the recreational side of it creating a guide on local plants, as well as landmarks.

 

On the ecology side, before leaving the faction I was working on a guide on pest control, tree diseases and tree surgery etc. but never finalized it because it generated little reaction beyond "that's cool that you're doing that".

 

Would love to see someone knowledgeable taking a big faction-wide focus on it as a mark of identity for the faction.

 

Definitely think it would be something that needed to come from top-down. Like I said in my original post (and mainly due to lack of interaction with the faction, wouldn't be right to comment on), wouldn't necessarily need to replace the LE function, but compliment it.

 

Big props for trying.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Adm

[goddessoflife]

10 hours ago, Akali said:

I also got word that this:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdQmskETefp6yQ8fU2o-mWUWE3ysIqZJeN6p-nxQQr6j3Zf9g/viewform

A survey for SAPR was posted in their OWN SAPR discord. 

So I'm just here  to debunk this statement really. I understand that when you don't like a certain thing you won't go look at their page. But to state false things, is kinda a lowblow really.

The moment pillsbury posted the form.. he also posted it on the faction thread, for everyone to see; 

 

Edited September 30, 2021 by goddessoflife

[Swag]

As one who has been at SAPR in the past, my general feeling is that things did not go as planned at all.  It used to be a faction based on educating the public and protecting the state parks but it soon became the LSSD junior faction, which I personally, am very disappointed with.

 

True, Park Rangers are LEOs in reality, but was that the faction's intention in the first place?  Replace the sheriffs in the county?  I do not think so...
 

Do not get me wrong, the people at SAPR present roleplay at a high level, I just think their goal in the first place was one thing, and at the end, it is something completely different.

[Zach..]

I'll start by saying I have a lot of friends in the faction and such and I think Park Rangers create some great RP, however, I believe that they've strayed from the original purpose of the faction, which isn't surprising considering other LEO factions do the same.

 

When Park Rangers was created I thought it was a cool niche idea for a small group of players to do and was in full support. More and more I see it turning into another faction to the police the server, and I believe it is only going to get worse.

 

From my understanding, and correct me if I'm wrong, but there's new protocols in effect from Sheriff's that can be activated and give Park Rangers jurisdiction over the entire county, making them the sole law enforcement there. I've even heard talks about Park Rangers tactical teams..

 

Regardless, I think the idea of Park Rangers is a super cool thing, I just hope it sticks to its original purpose.

 

Edit: To clarify, there is no tactical team being made.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Zach..
no tactical team

[Engelbert]

@knppel

This is where roleplaying differs from acting. In acting, the story is written already. At roleplaying, literally everyone is allowed to chip in with their part and it's on the character's player how will they implement other's episodes into their story. You cannot write next chapter if your current one isn't finished. Roleplaying is situational improvised acting. And because the story is being written on the fly, by literally everyone, it needs rules.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Engelbert

[eTaylor]

1 hour ago, mj2002 said:

 

But there is no shortage of opportunities for criminal roleplay at all. There is never a concern that criminal roleplay is being choked out. Its entirely the opposite, and it goes way further in that direction. If anything, poor criminal roleplay suffers from law enforcement presence. If your character doesn't wish to be spotted by law enforcement, then the default reaction shouldn't be "there is too much law enforcement present", but "perhaps my character wasn't careful enough and got caught". The reaction towards law enforcement presence also assumes that you are taking some sort of OOC loss by having a character arrested or a plan that's being thwarted. Why is this? Your character's story doesn't stop, it continues (assuming they survive) but perhaps in a different direction than the character had wished for, so what? Its not roleplaying to win, its roleplaying to tell a story.

It’s counterintuitive to attack a straw man but it’s still a game and there’s a stark difference between being a dumb criminal, getting caught. And police literally camping your spawn, lab, compound and home. This being a complex game with complex people, my situation is only representative of my own. And I can personally say that I stopped roleplaying front end crime all together because of the significant growth of county law enforcement, the fact that jail times are now mandatory (meaning that I’d have to spend IRL months in jail), and the manner in which law is being enforced period. I know of others who do the same thing. Is that a problem in itself? Probably, but not big enough since there’s always going to be dumb criminals. But it effectively alienated and removed a number of players from a particular field who would otherwise (or previously) participate in it.  

[Leoardo Marks]

6 hours ago, Rod17 said:

 

Watch this before you apply and get inspired my friend.

 

SAPR awaits you, the forests are calling.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eB_j5-UY7A

 

I'm inspired and ready to serve SIR *SALUTE*