Thoughts on the Senate?

[averycoolguy]

5 hours ago, Trupiano said:

t's 2021 not 1961

Is it? Cause our homicide rate is like Normandy Beach in 1944. Our city is literally deadlier than some WW2 battles dude.

Who the hell is going to care about your rights when we have 1000 homicides to a population of thousands a year?

 

6 hours ago, Trupiano said:

 

If we're complaining that the server has devolved into anarchy, how the fuck is that a solution?

Laws should be cracked down until there is no longer anarchy.

Quite frankly the LSPD/LSSD are the most incapable departments in the world ( I am not saying they are incapable OOC, but from a citizen's point of view the city is a deathtrap and they can't do jackshit to make things better ) so you would expect them to be far more aggressive than they are.

 

You can't play LAPD make believe when your city is 100 times deadlier than LA.

[Trupiano]

1 minute ago, averycoolguy said:

Is it? Cause our homicide rate is like Normandy Beach in 1944. Our city is literally deadlier than some WW2 battles dude.

Who the hell is going to care about your rights when we have 1000 homicides to a population of thousands a year?

 

Laws should be cracked down until there is no longer anarchy.

Quite frankly the LSPD/LSSD are the most incapable departments in the world ( I am not saying they are incapable OOC, but from a citizen's point of view the city is a deathtrap and they can't do jackshit to make things better ) so you would expect them to be far more aggressive than they are.

 

You can't play LAPD make believe when your city is 100 times deadlier than LA.

 

Relax, this is a video game.

 

 

[averycoolguy]

Just now, Trupiano said:

 

Relax, this is a video game.

 

 

I agree, that's an amazing argument. So since it's a video game the police should be able to frisk and search anyone, any car, any building, at any time. Civilians should also be able to bear weapons without a permit.

 

Glad we agree.

[HaveADream]

Some strange takes here.

 

1) OOC intervention is born out faction reports usually that are considered valid - it's used as a last resort but it's difficult to be proactive and read every bill for issues before it goes to a full vote just simply out of time constraints and priorities within LFM, and perhaps the knowledge that there is that final safeguard makes it easier to intervene only when we have to. I think we have only ever veto'd three or four bills.

 

2) The second election system was designed literally because the script was broken and unfixable in a short period of time leading up to the first election, wasn't anyones intention to maintain people as senators. That's the fault of LFM and wasn't a system we intended to repeat.

 

3) I liked the district system and wanted to go back to it, perhaps we can.

 

4) Someone mentioned that FLD and the SHAFT code are misaligned - we don't have a stake in it as LFM and if it goes to a lawsuit, then so be it. Nobody has ever tried and just assumed what we'd do - I've never even been asked about it.

 

5) A lot of assumptions in this thread are based around server management or myself and my team having a deep stake in politics - we don't, if there was a bill that banned flying spaghetti, it wouldn't affect me, it wouldn't change my life and wouldn't change what my team did, we react and respond in several occasions:

 

a) The bill will negatively impact illegal factions or legal factions to a significant degree without prior consultation with stakeholders (e.g. this was the weed bill and the RICO bill).

b) The bill will require script support that we cannot spare.

c) As a result of a faction report.

d) A change that'll impact a legal faction that wasn't pre-discussed with that factions handler e.g. giving LSNN a billion dollars every month.

 

 

LFM isn't here to micromanage the senate, nor do we want to, but when you have 5 people who are able to make server-wide decisions that are perhaps either not communicated with LFM or the stakeholders that the bill will affect, that does require action. I'm not saying I or anyone else needs to be briefed on every single bill, but when huge server-wide bills that have far-reaching and dramatic consequences, perhaps even not immediate ones, aren't consulted with LFM or even discussed prior OOCly with stakeholders, it does force a small panic. 

 

We're going to be creating guidance for when the senate is back up and running detailing what each party would like to see from each other to make communication a little smoother.

 

All I ever wanted, and the whole reason I created an election system in the first place was to provide that player-elected, player-chosen decision-making force, and I do want them to make key decisions and have huge impacts and do super cool amazing legal stuff, but the reality changed for me when I saw how wide these bills affect people, their roleplay and their factions. I fought for this when I joined LFM and pushed for it and made sure it happened, I organised the whole first election by myself because everybody shrugged it off as something that wouldn't last - well, it has, fortunately! I love how this has developed but there are still critical and institutional issues with this that have grown and adapted over time through different handlers and faction leaders. We have a responsibility, not only as a sub-team, but as a community, to make sure we're looking out for each other, and making sure everyone has the best experience they can. Sometimes we disagree on what that is, but hey...

 

That's politics 😉

 

 

Edited August 24, 2021 by HaveADream

[Devastante]

More red tape, just what the server needs. GTA:W - The red tape simulator. 

[Tseard]

can you address why the election that was about to start was suspended? @HaveADream, from my understanding everything was already cleared by LFM.

 

and from personal experience communicating with LFM is just really really hard, easier said than done. wouldn't be surprised if the same happened with people reaching out about the senate. 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Tseard

[Vash Baldeus]

9 hours ago, HaveADream said:

1) OOC intervention is born out faction reports usually that are considered valid - it's used as a last resort but it's difficult to be proactive and read every bill for issues before it goes to a full vote just simply out of time constraints and priorities within LFM, and perhaps the knowledge that there is that final safeguard makes it easier to intervene only when we have to. I think we have only ever veto'd three or four bills.

Legalizing Marijuana was one and from what I heard the reasoning was "Destroy the drug market" which with all honesty does not exist, majority of the drug dealers don't even sell it or try to build their client base, they just either rob you / sell to you then rob you these are the only 2 options on majority of dealers. So yes, as long as there are admin involvement in bills such as legalizing Marijuana that do not require script changes should not be veto'd.

[Tickle]

I am very eager to start roleplaying in the senate to be honest. It's my whole goal of an arc for Peter Gambino and I'd love to pursue it but was informed the elections are delayed for now. I think theirs a lot that can be done from a script perspective to make it a whole lot more interesting. First of all, any amount of Government should be way more transparent to people. Galas, fundraisers, musuem openings, cultural opportunities, this is all stuff that should be done and should be done frequently and yet most always I see and endless, beautiful slide, of people going in and out of clubs. I want to go on Peter to a museum opening and awe at painting made by actual people who roleplay as painters on the server or something. The bills people write in the senate are cool, but theirs a lot more "little things" we could introduce that make the Government aspect of the server more noticeable and allow people to notice like little changes that are occurring on a more frequent basis. Examples may include:

 

Work programs for cleaning up aspects of the city like graffiti that might come and go based on a bill for a month in the server.

Incentives to encourage the opening of a new cultural sight, such as a grant to someone to open a homeless shelter.

Frequent parades

Frequent block parties

 

All of this can be pushed by a super active, very transparent government in general. Right now it seems like a bunch of pencil pushing on forums and 9000 page documents that no one reads. We can do much better and we should.

 

My thoughts.

 

Edit: just wanted to add, that I did look at the forums and see that such things have occurred but since my time here I have never heard the government really refenced in any way by people, in ads, in any way. It's just been.. kind of.. there. Like I just learned who the Mayor was and that there was actually a Mayor.

Edited August 25, 2021 by Tickle

[Lurleen]

15 hours ago, averycoolguy said:

Is it? Cause our homicide rate is like Normandy Beach in 1944. Our city is literally deadlier than some WW2 battles dude.

Who the hell is going to care about your rights when we have 1000 homicides to a population of thousands a year?

 

Laws should be cracked down until there is no longer anarchy.

Quite frankly the LSPD/LSSD are the most incapable departments in the world ( I am not saying they are incapable OOC, but from a citizen's point of view the city is a deathtrap and they can't do jackshit to make things better ) so you would expect them to be far more aggressive than they are.

 

You can't play LAPD make believe when your city is 100 times deadlier than LA.

If we had longer sentences for crimes, then crime rate would be realistic. If you kill or rob someone and you are out from prison in a week, they are going to keep making crimes. Give longer sentences, have good and immersive RP in prision, have an in game court system and not only illegal rp will improve, but there would be less crime.

[eTaylor]

4 minutes ago, Lurleen said:

If we had longer sentences for crimes, then crime rate would be realistic. If you kill or rob someone and you are out from prison in a week, they are going to keep making crimes. Give longer sentences, have good and immersive RP in prision, have an in game court system and not only illegal rp will improve, but there would be less crime.

This theory has been debunked repeatedly over the course of a decade across multiple GTA (urban) roleplay communities. For reference, use the search function. Interesting history all around.