My appeal to LEO Rpers.

[Koko]

Just now, nelsondx said:

My only question is, what is gained from stopping someone and frisking them for a traffic offense REGARDLESS of record. It's play to win, obviously some have disagreeing in opinions but that's just how I see it.

And also, mind you that most people who are involved in a traffic stop are not frisked. You are given your citation or ticket or warning and off you go, but you also have to understand the other side: you were searched because the police officer reasonably suspected you may be carrying an illegal firearm due to past convictions. And it turns out that they were right and it ended, from what I understand from the partial context, in getting killed by cops, aka justifying a police officer's use of deadly force. Don't you see how your actions justify the decision made?

[nelsondx]

Just now, Koko said:

And also, mind you that most people who are involved in a traffic stop are not frisked. You are given your citation or ticket or warning and off you go, but you also have to understand the other side: you were searched because the police officer reasonably suspected you may be carrying an illegal firearm due to past convictions. And it turns out that they were right and it ended, from what I understand from the partial context, in getting killed by cops, aka justifying a police officer's use of deadly force. Don't you see how your actions justify the decision made?

Think you quoted the wrong person 😄

[Koko]

Just now, nelsondx said:

Think you quoted the wrong person 😄

I did sorry!

[MickeyO]

1 minute ago, Koko said:

And also, mind you that most people who are involved in a traffic stop are not frisked. You are given your citation or ticket or warning and off you go, but you also have to understand the other side: you were searched because the police officer reasonably suspected you may be carrying an illegal firearm due to past convictions. And it turns out that they were right and it ended, from what I understand from the partial context, in getting killed by cops, aka justifying a police officer's use of deadly force. Don't you see how your actions justify the decision made?

It’s funny because when I speak to LEO rpers in DM’s about the situation they agree with me. Who exactly is having fun when you decide to randomly search people based on prior convictions? It’s so ridiculous.

[Fancy Toothpaste]

18 minutes ago, nelsondx said:

I believe you, but you have to understand it's not exactly PD's fault. Sure it is to an extent because if that is true, the officer should know when he has enough reasons and evidence to arrest someone, but as you said, it's an IC thing. If it took 1 month as you said to solve the issue, it's honestly not PD's fault, moreso the justice faction for being understaffed if anything.

Police Officers do this IRL, what your friend went through is actually something that happens IRL daily, you would actually be surprised with how much Police Officers can get away with by saying "I feared for my safety", that's how American law is designed. However, I do agree waiting 1 month and not being able to say is a bit much indeed.

 

Also, allow me to give you a fair shake of the dice, a lot of stuff criminals do destroy motivation for the LEO RPers as a whole, I won't say what because I do not wish to turn this into a LEO VS CRIMINAL thread, LEO RPers also have frustrations with criminal RPers, I can't honestly say I've had an experience that made me quit because I can take an L if it's fair and square, but waht you are saying, as much as I sympathize with you, it's not Pd's fault as a whole.

As I said, I'm not here to throw blame around. What I am trying to say is that the frustrations felt by illegal RPers when it comes to negitive interactions with police are often justified, just as LEO frustrations with illegal characters are often justified.

It's easy to say, "Just take it IC, what's the big deal" but you've just put the illegal RPer in a lose-lose situation.
They can either take the arrest on the chin, pleading guilty and get back out on the street sooner rather then later, or they can plead not guilty, fight the arrest proceeding in court and quite possibly spend the next few weeks in prison because there was a misunderstanding of what is and is not reasonable suspicion. Both of these cases can make the system seem futile, and damage the motivation of the player behind the screen.

What happened to my friend was a series of unfortunate events where blame cannot be wholey put on one party, but the first link in the chain was that PD officer over-stepping their bounds.

The entire point of what I'm trying to say is that in order for LEO and Illegal RPers to have a healthy and constructive relationship, there needs to be some give and take on both sides. Instead of turning around and immediately saying, "That's just an IC issue, take it IC", acknolowdge that IC systems and IC decisions also have OOC consequences on the motivations of the players that are affected. Just as poor extortion attempts on legal businesses can greatly hinder civilian RPer's motivation to play, faulty and ill-founded arrests can hinder Illegal RPer's motivations. Take the OOC frustrations as they are and - if you so choose - make changes that help to ensure greater OOC enjoyment for both parties.

We seem to forget that this is a game, and that everyone is simply trying to enjoy themselves. Why else would we all be here?

Edited June 21, 2021 by Fancy Toothpaste
typo

[Koko]

Just now, MickeyO said:

It’s funny because when I speak to LEO rpers in DM’s about the situation they agree with me. Who exactly is having fun when you decide to randomly search people based on prior convictions? It’s so ridiculous.

Well how is it "random" when their search proved them right and you were in fact a potential danger to them? Just be careful of when and how you carry your gun if you have past convictions.

[nelsondx]

2 minutes ago, MickeyO said:

It’s funny because when I speak to LEO rpers in DM’s about the situation they agree with me. Who exactly is having fun when you decide to randomly search people based on prior convictions? It’s so ridiculous.

But it's realistic, aren't we striving for realism? It's pretty much allowed by the US Supreme Courts. So, how can an Officer defend themselves or ensure their safety if you wish to take away every protective means? If they call more than one car, it's not RP, if they terry frisk for their safety, is not RP. So what would you say it's realistic? 

The scenario you provided is pretty much allowed by IRL Courts, and their suspicions were proven right, I would say your character should exercise more caution more than anything else.

Edited June 21, 2021 by nelsondx

[MickeyO]

2 minutes ago, Koko said:

Well how is it "random" when their search proved them right and you were in fact a potential danger to them? Just be careful of when and how you carry your gun if you have past convictions.

there is no common ground for some, all i’m hoping is for a clear established guidelines and the use of terry frisks but na, it’s too much of an issue. This shit is OD demotivating. And we always question why there is a divide between the two sets of rpers

Edited June 21, 2021 by MickeyO

[Engelbert]

Past convictions I am afraid is what gives PD mentioned, reasonable suspicion. Why do you think there is a saying, that if you go that way...it will be with you, your entire life.

 

[Jonesy]

1 minute ago, Koko said:

Well how is it "random" when their search proved them right and you were in fact a potential danger to them? Just be careful of when and how you carry your gun if you have past convictions.

This is actually an unconstitutional way of thinking. In American law searches or arrests can't be justified simply by the concept of "Well I was right and they were guilty." There needs to be a relatively realistic balance struck rooted both in American law (and the bevy of case law) yet easy enough to understand for people who don't need their associates degree in criminal justice to play a video game.