Why do you cover up graffiti CIMs?

[Whoopty]

Like bro, i've fist fighted an opposing gang member, theyve dissed us via graffiti in some shitty alley in the middle of nowere at 2am, and now I can't take it IC because someone walked up to it and did /cim 7 le black paint covor it. 

Like come on bruh. We try to keep the shootings low (even if we have an IC reason to shoot), and do harmless passive RP like graffiti, but killing the graffiti RP is like you don't want that.

[Powley]

9 minutes ago, Whoopty said:

I agree, the only issue in this IMO is really the speed and scale of the removals which gets unrealistic and annoying OOCly, glad you can understand instead of taking it as a personal attack or being defensive. 

 

Oh nah I get it man, it's all chill. We're all here to have fun at the end of the day

[Trupiano]

1 minute ago, Whoopty said:

 

 

^ 

Id find that cool too, but in most cases it's people doing a /cim of "black paint covers the tags" and sometimes literally with no RP. And it happens in MINUTES of me putting it up, like come on man? How are you telling me to keep it IC? Bro? bRo???? brOo???????

Then brother you just gotta report it. This doesn't sound like a major issue on the server and seems like it's probably one person or a small group doing it. I agree with you, if people are doing it with like 0 RP right after you do yours? That's a problem but from my personal experience it's not something being dealt with everywhere by everyone.

[lux]

People spray my roof top all the time with shit that I typically pay people to clean up because it's a business and I don't want "White Pride" covering half of my shit. I don't see any issue with people blacking out a spray so long as it's their own property or community. But blacking out a spray makes little sense rather than removing it completely (if you're a rival gang just crossing it out, that's fine).

 

Another of my characters is a graffiti artist, and I have a few rules that I try to stick to as I find CIMs annoying.

Don't place CIMs in areas that people may cross multiple times (skatepark ramps, narrow passages, business entrances) as it can spam your chat.

 

The issue is everyone seems to be able to magically spawn a spraycan. I've been at Vespucci skatepark where someone has gone, "Yo, I'm going to spray this shit" followed by them coincidentally finding a spray can sitting in the sand. If spraycans were a physical item you had to purchase before being allowed to tag, I don't think we'd see anywhere near as much CIM spam as we currently do.

 

[Mór-Ríoghain]

7 minutes ago, Henning said:

That's such a tedious thing to be upset about though, don't you think? Like it's idiotic yes but is it outside of reason? Not really. 

I mean... it's about as tedious as portrayal gets. Don't RP something if you're not willing to put the effort in, it's as simple as that. I put the effort in to understand how graffiti works before I do that, the least I can ask if that someone return the courtesy by putting their own research in if they are going to portray someone who removes tags.. otherwise it's powergaming.

 

7 minutes ago, Powley said:

 

I'm simply working with what I've got. Currently, in real life Koreatown isn't even ranked as one of the most dangerous neighbourhoods within LA. I understand that there are indeed gangs in the area, most prominently being MS13. I've never claimed it was a suburb, infact, it's a massive area of Nightclubs and convenience stores. I think it's unfair to cry about the community just trying to keep themselves busy and have fun. I think you're being unfair, Sio.

 

 

Please, report away. If it's that much of an issue for you Sio, please report away any issues. I think we both know it's such a petty subject that it doesn't need to go to forum reports.

 

 

All due respect I've been actively trying to improve things for the longest time and I'm aware of who cares to actually improve the area and who complains for the sake of complaining at this point.

LA is also a city of 10 million people with many neighborhoods, the fact you say it doesn't rank up there is irrelevant. It may not be the biggest fish, but that's only because it's in an overpopulated pond.

 

I mean you're just being disingenous at this point. If you think I'm simply complaining for the sake of complaining so be it, I have rarely said anything about this type of thing in the past. At the end of the day, you don't know me at all. So I don't know how you could even begin to presume what my motivations regarding this are; but if you want to victimize yourself go ahead. All I was doing was makign the very valid point that you should not powergame an activity that can take up to 10-30 minutes to do IRL, if that's too much for you I don't know what to say.

 

I mean, if you want me to be helpful here is some sources on it? All I'm saying is that people should just try and RP it accurately? You can't remove graffiti in a minute with soap and water, it's a complex process involving chemicals and elbow grease - or you can simply paint over it, but even that has it's drawbacks.

 

https://team-clean.com/bag-the-tags-why-removing-graffiti-is-so-hard/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graffiti_removal

 

You can claim that caring about how graffiti is portrayed is not a big deal, and in the grand scheme of things (with a cynical eye on the universe) you'd be right. But we are here to roleplay, are we not? Graffiti RP is a big part of gang RP, so you should not be surprised when people who RP in gangs care about how it's portrayed.

 

I'm not saying that there aren't people who will pre-type a /me and just drop it down, it of course does happen. But I think it's slightly less egregious than someone RPing suddenly knowing how to remove paint off of walls and ass-pulling a ton of chemicals to do so.

 

Regardless, those aforementioned people who powergame their graffiti? They aren't look kindly upon in gang RP circles.

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by sio

[Powley]

2 minutes ago, sio said:

LA is also a city of 10 million people with many neighborhoods, the fact you say it doesn't rank up there is irrelevant. It may not be the biggest fish, but that's only because it's in an overpopulated pond.

 

Sure, that's fair, but Koreatown isn't as dangerous as it once was and I think people need to accept that this isn't 15-30 years ago. I'm not saying it's squeaky clean, but it's a lot safer then it use to be.

 

3 minutes ago, sio said:

I mean you're just being disingenous at this point. If you think I'm simply complaining for the sake of complaining so be it, I have rarely said anything about this type of thing in the past. At the end of the day, you don't know me at all. So I don't know how you could even begin to presume what my motivations regarding this are; but if you want to victimize yourself go ahead. All I was doing was makign the very valid point that you should not powergame an activity that can take up to 10-30 minutes to do IRL, if that's too much for you I don't know what to say.

 

I don't know you, but I don't have to because this is an online community. It's not that deep sio. Report it if you see it, live life and move on.

 

4 minutes ago, sio said:

I mean, if you want me to be helpful here is some sources on it? All I'm saying is that people should just try and RP it accurately? You can't remove graffiti in a minute with soap and water, it's a complex process involving chemicals and elbow grease - or you can simply paint over it, but even that has it's drawbacks.

 

https://team-clean.com/bag-the-tags-why-removing-graffiti-is-so-hard/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graffiti_removal

 

Thanks! I'll take a look at it!

[Trupiano]

Just now, sio said:

I mean... it's about as tedious as portrayal gets. Don't RP something if you're not willing to put the effort in, it's as simple as that. I put the effort in to understand how graffiti works before I do that, the least I can ask if that someone return the courtesy by putting their own research in if they are going to portray someone who removes tags.. otherwise it's powergaming.

So let me get this straight. 

 

If someone spray paints a swastika on my businesses front window and I choose to paint over it to immediately get rid of the issue, for whatever reason (I don't have a power washer, I don't have the time before we open, I'm an idiot who panics, etc) instead of choosing the most effective and proper method; I'm powergaming? 

 

 

I don't really think you understand what exactly powergaming is.

[Mór-Ríoghain]

13 minutes ago, Powley said:

 

Sure, that's fair, but Koreatown isn't as dangerous as it once was and I think people need to accept that this isn't 15-30 years ago. I'm not saying it's squeaky clean, but it's a lot safer then it use to be.

I mean I'm not saying it's San Salvador but Koreatown has an above average violent crime rate. Gangs are very much a thing there and the entire place is caked with graffiti. Having a spotless, squeaky clean neighborhood just isn't a realistic expectation. Of course IC is IC, but I'm just saying to keep some things in mind. Personally for me it helps with the atmosphere to have both a community vibe as well as the presence of grime.

 

9 minutes ago, Henning said:

So let me get this straight. 

 

If someone spray paints a swastika on my businesses front window and I choose to paint over it to immediately get rid of the issue, for whatever reason (I don't have a power washer, I don't have the time before we open, I'm an idiot who panics, etc) instead of choosing the most effective and proper method; I'm powergaming? 

 

 

I don't really think you understand what exactly powergaming is.

I didn't say that was powergaming, I said it was silly. Would a store owner realistically paint over their window? Of course they wouldn't, at that point they are also damaging their property. But that is your perview and a decision you can make IC, I feel at this point you're simply playing devil's advocate. The city government has a service for removing graffiti, you can contact them and give them RP or you can simply put effort into the RP of removing it yourself. At the end of the day as long as you actually do a /me and don't just plant down a thoughtless, lazy /cim and actually RP the consequence of vandalizing your own window with paint I don't really care.

 

Also there are other solutions; I think someone would be more willing to cover a window with cardboard before painting the whole thing black. If in your theoretical scenario you were rushed for time would you really have enough time to paint a window? That takes time. You would also have to go fetch a bucket of paint unless you conveniently had one on you; going down this rabbit hole that you have created.

 

As I've mentioned multiple times in this thread (As have others in my corner) nobody expects you not to get rid of graffiti if it is on your property or vandalizing your business.

 

I don't think you understand what my point was, if you want to be snarky.

Edited June 7, 2021 by sio

[Powley]

Just now, sio said:

I mean I'm not saying it's San Salvador but Koreatown has an above average violent crime rate. Gangs are very much a thing there and the entire place is caked with graffiti. Having a spotless, squeaky clean neighborhood just isn't a realistic expectation. Of course IC is IC, but I'm just saying to keep some things in mind. Personally for me it helps with the atmosphere to have both a community vibe as well as the presence of grime.

 

While I appreciate your input nobody is saying it's a squeaky clean neighborhood, and like you said, IC is IC. 

 

You and I are both aware we can't control every community aspect but we can guide them with things like the Business Association and various extra-curricular activities to keep locals busy and happy. If some of them want to clean up the streets? You /cant/ stop them unless you do it In-Character. Just look at Little Tokyo and @Calamity's boys work. They mirror us in a sense that they tend to keep a clean area to a degree.

[Mór-Ríoghain]

5 minutes ago, Powley said:

 

While I appreciate your input nobody is saying it's a squeaky clean neighborhood, and like you said, IC is IC. 

 

You and I are both aware we can't control every community aspect but we can guide them with things like the Business Association and various extra-curricular activities to keep locals busy and happy. If some of them want to clean up the streets? You /cant/ stop them unless you do it In-Character. Just look at Little Tokyo and @Calamity's boys work. They mirror us in a sense that they tend to keep a clean area to a degree.

I'm not going to argue further, you can do you; at the end of the day my intention on this thread wasn't to cast judgement or to create drama only to post my perspective on a certain type of RP that could perhaps be done with a little more effort. I think everyone on the server has moments like that, and the only way we'll learn to better reflect something is if there's someone there to help us out with it. I know certainly that I've been in a position where I've needed someone to give their perspective on a certain thing so that I can portray it better. I will say to just take a look at the guides provided and try (the next time you put locals onto something) to take the sources I posted in mind. Personally I think a lot of cool RP could come out of approaching the task of graffiti removal in a realistic manner as it's very interesting and complicated process - and since it's such a long process the RP could be stretched out with all the different facets of it. Think about it:

 

You could get a couple and RP driving to the tool store to RP picking up some tools, go pick up some jumpsuits, secure a power washer, etc.

 

At the end of the day I understand the need to keep people busy, maybe this will help.

 

Also my intention wasn't to stop people from doing that kind of RP, only to understand their motivations for doing so and to shed some light on why it's important for people to put thought into it. Like if you want to be someone who removes graffiti? I say go ahead, that's dope - but with any other hobby, job, or certain character concept you might want to play out a little research goes a long way.

Edited June 7, 2021 by sio