Small change to avoid bar script abuse.

[Raisin]

Short description: Add main ingredient (ex. vodka) that was used to make a specific drink/cocktail in brackets behind the custom name you made.

Detailed description: So as I've heard there are places that use cider (Because its way cheaper)  to rename drinks into everything (It's been reported)  I think this is the easiest way to avoid it happening.

Commands to add:-

Items to add:-

How would your suggestion improve the server? - Avoids script abuse.

Additional information:

Edited April 27, 2021 by Roza.

[Sixty]

Pretty sure this was brought up before and never really addressed, so I'm okay with it being brought up again. There's no real way to report it either so I don't want to hear, "report them lol".

[Ink]

Against this mostly because I feel the createitem "name" field is already too small. Further shrinking it by adding more data to the item's line is not the move.

 

I feel the enforcement should be through more robust business logging. Currently, /bmanager logs all createdrinks, but it doesn't log who was the one who created the drink, and what they created it out of--at least not for the businesses. If this logging is improved, then businesses will be responsible for policing their own staff. And if they fail to do so, they stand to be punished. Auditing our server's businesses every now and then to see how the business scripts are used (or potentially abused) is valuable. 

[Sixty]

38 minutes ago, Ink said:

Against this mostly because I feel the createitem "name" field is already too small. Further shrinking it by adding more data to the item's line is not the move.

 

I feel the enforcement should be through more robust business logging. Currently, /bmanager logs all createdrinks, but it doesn't log who was the one who created the drink, and what they created it out of--at least not for the businesses. If this logging is improved, then businesses will be responsible for policing their own staff. And if they fail to do so, they stand to be punished. Auditing our server's businesses every now and then to see how the business scripts are used (or potentially abused) is valuable. 

Pretty sure /bmanager only logs a certain number of items created, 40 I think? So that won't help if it goes past that. Certainly can't run an audit on just 40 items. Asking the logging to be more robust means more data logging and more space being taken up by the hundreds if not thousands of items being created by bars and businesses in general. This isn't an easy answer to the problem.

 

Also, this is if they get audited by property management or RPQM, which they probably don't very often (please someone correct me if I'm wrong). They always say they have enough on their plate, which they probably do. Leaving this up to the business owners to manage also can lead to abuse that goes unchecked. This is a simple addition that really doesn't add that many characters to the drink name. It's not a huge issue. This keeps business owners accountable on more than one front, especially since staff is big on telling us to report problems when we see them. Work smarter, not harder. Adding a few characters to the front is easier than expanding server hosting and data logging to put all the work on the plate of the admin team.

Edited April 27, 2021 by Sixty

[Ink]

1 hour ago, Sixty said:

Pretty sure /bmanager only logs a certain number of items created, 40 I think? So that won't help if it goes past that. Certainly can't run an audit on just 40 items. Asking the logging to be more robust means more data logging and more space being taken up by the hundreds if not thousands of items being created by bars and businesses in general. This isn't an easy answer to the problem.

 

Also, this is if they get audited by property management or RPQM, which they probably don't very often (please someone correct me if I'm wrong). They always say they have enough on their plate, which they probably do. Leaving this up to the business owners to manage also can lead to abuse that goes unchecked. This is a simple addition that really doesn't add that many characters to the drink name. It's not a huge issue. This keeps business owners accountable on more than one front, especially since staff is big on telling us to report problems when we see them. Work smarter, not harder. Adding a few characters to the front is easier than expanding server hosting and data logging to put all the work on the plate of the admin team.

 

All of this data is already logged. On the UCP you can access your business's entire createitem logs. Admins have access to all of this as well. The only difference is that the player-visible version does not include such info as who did the /createitem/drink/food, and what they made it out of. And PM should be checking in on businesses and seeing what they're making, even if that's only once a month.

[effion]

+1

[Kaxo]

On 4/26/2021 at 11:55 PM, Ink said:

Against this mostly because I feel the createitem "name" field is already too small. Further shrinking it by adding more data to the item's line is not the move.

It does it with renamed drugs, no reason why renamed drinks shouldn't be the same. 

[knppel]

The sign limit is indeed the one thing I'd beworried about (A drink based on "Beer" or "Wine" might not make much of a difference but "Champagne" for instance is much longer). I'm not quite sure how this works (i.e. wether adding a base product name like with drugswill affects this).

 

All in all such a change would be a good idea regardless.

To begin with, "Report it" can't be the solution as I as single customer-player have no way to determine wether my cocktail is based on vodka or cider. As such it's impossible to spot rule breaks ingame here (if one isn't involved in them, but just consuming and experiencing it).

Reports based solely on suspicions are typically of the weaker sort- and leave the burden to investigate fully onthe staff (who'd have to check every drink the reported party created over the past weeks to be able to issue a fair verdict).

 

Furthermore not everyone who mis-uses the script does so malevolently:

Players who engage in end distribution of alcohol and have no contact with the supply chains- i.e., your average bartender- often tend to use the script as a supplement to roleplay being able to serve whatever drink a customer asks for.

 

More than the idea to squeeze out some peanuts (typically it's business managers thinking that way as they have to cover the operations, not the bartenders) this is typically based on that one simply wants to supply what the customer wants (being ranted at for honestly stating there's no champagne when that's not even your fault as you're just employed as bartender for the hour, I get that's not funny!).

 

Having this said, from my observation it's more an awareness-problem than dedicated cheating to make some money ingame (and having THAT said, of course, if you know cider-pushers report them please).

Spreading awareness will help to improve people roleplaying about alcoholic ingredients.

 

To illustatre how high the hurden here is: I only learned of liquor shop mechanics, business supplying (bar or inventory, regardless) and cocktail-mixing through /createdrink, as I got to manage a club and had to dig in these topics in character, liaised with brewers etc.

 

For a freshly employed bartender, this information was usually cut down to "Be sure to rp mixing drinks and use a fitting core ingredient" (something that arguably common sense should indicate to do anyway).

From their point of view, what matters is to deal with customers demanding drinks- and unless they've actually digged into the mechanics and ingame industry, they'll simply not be aware that on the other end of the chain there's a guy (or girl) roleplaying a destillery and losing out on rp whenever someone makes own drinks at a bar.

[Ink]

2 hours ago, Kaxo said:

It does it with renamed drugs, no reason why renamed drinks shouldn't be the same. 

 

There's a bit of a difference. Drugs don't need elaborate, descriptive names, and there's also an existing script mechanism which allows you to determine how strong drugs are. A properly named drink will tell you exactly what's in it, but drug names require the drug tag because they're often given really random and whacky names. 

 

Losing even 10 characters from being able to rename drinks would be massively detrimental to our creativity.

Edited April 28, 2021 by Ink