The State of Gang Beef

[baechi]

Personally (as a filthy civilian RPer who sometimes RPs as a civilian in South LS) I believe that there should be some consideration about making block wipe events an admin requested thing, similar to how you cannot disturb or rob an active business without an admin's blessing.

 

I expect this will be an unpopular opinion, but there's a point where immersion/realism seems to falter when there's a block wipe every 1-2 nights, causing dead bodies to litter neighborhoods for hours or coroner's and police get called out and spend 1-2 hours dealing with the mess afterwards. Not to mention, civilians also live in these neighborhoods, so they unfortunately get put into the crossfire (which I do acknowledge happens in actual neighborhoods) but this can be frustrating and lead to South LS losing civilian characters, thus just turning it into a warzone. I can understand a drive-by with maybe one or two people dying, but gangs will often run through a block/neighborhood and massacre anybody in sight and this has little to no repercussions as it can be easy to start over a new character after either dying or getting a heavy sentence in prison.

 

This is not a perfect suggestion by any means, as requesting admin permission for anything can cause a disconnect in immersion and storytelling, such as the block wipes themselves. However I think a firm hand on these kind of events would promote better instances of gang beef, such as the suggestions offered above. 

[Goopy]

13 minutes ago, baechi said:

Personally (as a filthy civilian RPer who sometimes RPs as a civilian in South LS) I believe that there should be some consideration about making block wipe events an admin requested thing, similar to how you cannot disturb or rob an active business without an admin's blessing.

 

I expect this will be an unpopular opinion, but there's a point where immersion/realism seems to falter when there's a block wipe every 1-2 nights, causing dead bodies to litter neighborhoods for hours or coroner's and police get called out and spend 1-2 hours dealing with the mess afterwards. Not to mention, civilians also live in these neighborhoods, so they unfortunately get put into the crossfire (which I do acknowledge happens in actual neighborhoods) but this can be frustrating and lead to South LS losing civilian characters, thus just turning it into a warzone. I can understand a drive-by with maybe one or two people dying, but gangs will often run through a block/neighborhood and massacre anybody in sight and this has little to no repercussions as it can be easy to start over a new character after either dying or getting a heavy sentence in prison.

 

This is not a perfect suggestion by any means, as requesting admin permission for anything can cause a disconnect in immersion and storytelling, such as the block wipes themselves. However I think a firm hand on these kind of events would promote better instances of gang beef, such as the suggestions offered above. 

 

This would be great, but I would love for admins to more pro-actively respond to CK + Break-in requests before anything else gets sent to admin approval only.

[KinnyWynny]

block wipes should be banned

 

having mass shootings every day in your neighborhood is not that realistic. limit it to a week if you wanna go school shooter on your ops down the street.

[Stiggz]

This is why you don’t come to legal Roleplayers for advice, this thread was doomed from the very beginning to be another dick measuring contest with legal RP’ers 

[KinnyWynny]

1 minute ago, Stiggz said:

This is why you don’t come to legal Roleplayers for advice, this thread was doomed from the very beginning to be another dick measuring contest with legal RP’ers 

when the fuck did anyone mention a thing about legal rpers besides a mention about being a civilian rper bud.

 

gang rp beef’s are probably one of the most active engaging parts of the server, they just kinda suck right now since they go straight to wild west gun fights.

[i dont wanna od in LA]

10 hours ago, baechi said:

I expect this will be an unpopular opinion, but there's a point where immersion/realism seems to falter when there's a block wipe every 1-2 nights, causing dead bodies to litter neighborhoods for hours or coroner's and police get called out and spend 1-2 hours dealing with the mess afterwards. Not to mention, civilians also live in these neighborhoods, so they unfortunately get put into the crossfire (which I do acknowledge happens in actual neighborhoods) but this can be frustrating and lead to South LS losing civilian characters, thus just turning it into a warzone. I can understand a drive-by with maybe one or two people dying, but gangs will often run through a block/neighborhood and massacre anybody in sight and this has little to no repercussions as it can be easy to start over a new character after either dying or getting a heavy sentence in prison.

That's an IC problem buddy. If you haven't realized yet, "normal civilians" don't stay outside after dark whilst there's 50 gang members posted outside their house, mostly because of what was mentioned - if shit goes down it's easier to catch a stray bullet and bleed out to death there. As for the shootings being done back to back on a daily basis, address it with your local law enforcement agency, go request a gang injunction. You wanna rp a civilian - yeah, cool, but at least roleplay it accordingly and don't cry once you get hit in a crossfire. As for the blockwipe permission - complete bullshit, especially if you're trying to hit a faction led by an admin. Also, read the ROE - blockwipes are already de facto banned;

 

[Slimeball]

17 hours ago, Beholder said:

They're not useless. The large brawls are fun and fuel rivalry and create environments and backstories. They help further peoples developments without DMing and hurting other people's developments. But you're right, if somebody brings a knife to a brawl they probbaly will use it and that's kind of the shame of brawls nowadays. And you're also right, large scale brawls aren't exactly common or realistic in modern day gangs, but that doesn't meant they're not fun, or can't occur still. But the biggest thing is these brawls occur along side other forms of beef, like graffiti or social media etc. They also don't always have to be large scale, some people will pull knives in a 3v3 street fight too. And from my experience, rolling 15 deep into another turf is usually warranted by excessive, targeted beef from another faction. (Graffiti/FB/Etc.) From the outside, it can seem like people get block wiped for dumb shit, and sometimes they do, but more often than not you could probably find a trail of interactions leading up to it.

Only reason why I'm "brawl shaming" is because it is overly common in game. There seems to be players who do not know how to start beef but the old fashioned way and frankly it's gay to me how they think this style of gang roleplay is still relevant to today's modern concept of gang vs gang beef. This isn't 1982, not every gang member has confidence in their fighting, it's 2021 and niggas will pull a gun, knife or whatever to defend themselves.

 

The gangster ratio for gang factions is not in a good state right now. If you think about it from a realism standpoint, not every gang member is as tough as the next meaning you have a group of 45 gang members and out of that 45 only 15-20 will probably throw down and brawl, maybe 10-15 will actually try to kill and maybe 5-10 are actually busters (punks) who won't do a damn thing, they just do it for the fashion or to impress somebody. Now scale that number 45 down to the average # of members in an actual gang faction and draw your conclusions from that. 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Slimeball

[Slimeball]

14 hours ago, DLimit said:

100%, sets shame their own members if they jump in. They have to respect the "1v1" or even "2v2" code, unless it's a straight-up jumping.

Not the case all of the time lol. Some gangs like the Neighborhood Crips, Hoovers and Inglewood Bloods will have even more love for you if you don't let your homie lose 1v1 to the enemy. I don't know where some of you guys get this "gangster's honor" system from, but in today's climate it's not as profound as it once was in the 70s, 80s, 90s and early 00s. The streets are shiesty and unpredictable, that's what gang roleplay is basically, getting into shiesty and unpredictable situations and dealing being able to roleplay out the consequences.

 

14 hours ago, Oaks. said:

Something I'm trying to push for constantly, but everyone and their Mommas wanna pull over petty shit. 

What people don't realise is, it doesn't matter if you take the L in a fight, if it's if you got down that matter. And if you pulling after, then you a bitch.

This is relevant to my last paragraph as far as "gangster's honor" goes. Today is a different climate, look at the King Von situation in November. Certain gangsters are raised to the code while some are "renegades" and follow their own codes. It's all about what that certain group holds value in when it comes to gangster activity.

 

Like for example, the Inglewood Family Gangster Bloods promote head ups (1v1 fights) with other Bloods sets they've no tension with, however, if you are from IFGB and are fighting an NHC member and you start losing, your homies are REQUIRED to jump in. I'm not saying this is how every other Blood gang outside of IFGB operates, but different hoods have different codes & standards to live up to.

 

 

 

4 hours ago, KinnyWynny said:

block wipes should be banned

 

having mass shootings every day in your neighborhood is not that realistic. limit it to a week if you wanna go school shooter on your ops down the street.

 

14 hours ago, baechi said:

Personally (as a filthy civilian RPer who sometimes RPs as a civilian in South LS) I believe that there should be some consideration about making block wipe events an admin requested thing, similar to how you cannot disturb or rob an active business without an admin's blessing.

 

I expect this will be an unpopular opinion, but there's a point where immersion/realism seems to falter when there's a block wipe every 1-2 nights, causing dead bodies to litter neighborhoods for hours or coroner's and police get called out and spend 1-2 hours dealing with the mess afterwards. Not to mention, civilians also live in these neighborhoods, so they unfortunately get put into the crossfire (which I do acknowledge happens in actual neighborhoods) but this can be frustrating and lead to South LS losing civilian characters, thus just turning it into a warzone. I can understand a drive-by with maybe one or two people dying, but gangs will often run through a block/neighborhood and massacre anybody in sight and this has little to no repercussions as it can be easy to start over a new character after either dying or getting a heavy sentence in prison.

 

This is not a perfect suggestion by any means, as requesting admin permission for anything can cause a disconnect in immersion and storytelling, such as the block wipes themselves. However I think a firm hand on these kind of events would promote better instances of gang beef, such as the suggestions offered above. 

 

14 hours ago, Goopy said:

 

This would be great, but I would love for admins to more pro-actively respond to CK + Break-in requests before anything else gets sent to admin approval only.

Believe me, I understand the sentiment of your grievances about block wiping because I am 100% a gang roleplayer. But in my honest opinion, if you do not want to be block wiped, avoid grouping up in large crowds of gangsters when you know it's time to "play ball" with your rivals. I know it sounds deathmatchy, but hear me out. 

 

Gang roleplay is designed to bring you all of the obstacles, trials and tribulations of portraying a gang member or living in a gang controlled environment. It isn't uncommon for large crowds to get shot up in real life especially during a war. However, it is very rare that you'll get four dudes jumping out literally hawking down 6 out of 6 individuals and killing them all individually. 

 

 

I believe groups can be shot up, but the unrealistic hawk down system attached to large group shootings should be outlawed. One shouldn't be able to PK 10 out of 10 gang members in one go round if they're not able to from the initial shooting scene. I mean, maybe you'd catch a straggler or two on your way out of the neighborhood, but literally trying to hawk down your opponents to their place of escape is a time consuming thing and can lead to your character being arrested.

 

I, as a gang roleplayer can say that if you truly want to survive in a gang beef then you'd have to realistically think and act like a gang member, make decisions based on your character's state of mind and determine what he or she may do when gang vs gang beefs set off. Some gang members run & hide from beef with other gangs while some do not.

 

And this brings me to another point about the current state of gang roleplay. Not every single gang member is going to fight, shoot or go to jail. Which brings me to my point of saying this, if you are in a gang faction right now and 10 out of 10 characters in your gang faction have slid and killed someone then there is a problem.

 

The deathmatch mentality is a recycled and misunderstood mentality in the gang community, it doesn't take for a person to kill someone to get initiated into a gang and it doesn't take for one situation to lead into an all out blockwipe. And just because someone attempted a block wipe doesn't mean that it should be outlawed totally, just move wiser with your decisions as a gang character.

[EffPee]

10 minutes ago, Slimeball said:

I believe groups can be shot up, but the unrealistic hawk down system attached to large group shootings should be outlawed. One shouldn't be able to PK 10 out of 10 gang members in one go round if they're not able to from the initial shooting scene. I mean, maybe you'd catch a straggler or two on your way out of the neighborhood, but literally trying to hawk down your opponents to their place of escape is a time consuming thing and can lead to your character being arrested.

I think shooting up groups is a great way to do it (once the war has reached that point), genuinely. But as you say, hopping out four deep with compact rifles gunning down every single person on the block is just ridiculous; it gives no opportunity for a retaliation and it's blatantly just so that people can catch more bodies for their scoreboard. There's a difficult line to draw between well roleplayed hits on rival gangs and straight up body-catching PK operations.

10 minutes ago, Slimeball said:

And this brings me to another point about the current state of gang roleplay. Not every single gang member is going to fight, shoot or go to jail. Which brings me to my point of saying this, if you are in a gang faction right now and 10 out of 10 characters in your gang faction have slid and killed someone then there is a problem.

You could argue every character in a gang is forced to be a killer due to how the state of gang rp is right now. Very few people are ready to accept that they're just going to keep dying, all it takes is a few more times of getting shot up for little reason and the roleplayer will throw away their development and decide to hop out with a gun. 

 

I'd actually love to see more diverse gangs on the server, where not everyone has dozens of bodies; Making a community-like atmosphere where even members put-on in the gang aren't willing to go that far unless they ABSOLUTELY have to, and the aftermath of that decision is really what we should be striving for. Unfortunately, and through no fault of their own, not everyone is willing to pursue a line of character development that doesn't follow the status quo; we just can't force them to do so, only educate them that it may be another exciting way to roleplay.

10 minutes ago, Slimeball said:

The deathmatch mentality is a recycled and misunderstood mentality in the gang community, it doesn't take for a person to kill someone to get initiated into a gang and it doesn't take for one situation to lead into an all out blockwipe. And just because someone attempted a block wipe doesn't mean that it should be outlawed totally, just move wiser with your decisions as a gang character.

Bottom line here - Deathmatching is an outdated standard and unfortunately it makes gang roleplay as a whole look bad. Factions, including mine, are being shamed for doing 'too much passive RP' when simply put, it's just not 90% shootouts going on in our day-to-day. I will say that over time it feels like gang roleplay is getting closer to more realistic wars, but as OP put it; we need faction leaders to come together and educate themselves and their members on how to realistically approach a gang conflict, this isn't as hard as it sounds. 

[Troopstah]

18 hours ago, Playboii said:

They pulled out guns immediately.

False. As someone who was there on DWBs side, one guy pulled a gun because there were 30 random crips who pulled up going SCOOP SCOOP AAAH SCOOP. And even though this one guy tried to scare ppl off they still started to punch scriptly. Think it’s really funny to see an unofficial group pulling up and instantly picking fights with official groups that have established themselves in the area. 

 

Besides, if GUNS were pulled (guns, not gun), then we’d be talking in the report section because of deathmatching. I don’t remember a single shot being fired either. 🤔