The unacceptable time of CK appeals handling

[aughh capybara]

What seriously bothers me about a CK appeal, and I'm sure it has very much bothered @Falrock and his ability to continue his character is that so long spent not playing them would easily burn out your ability to play the character. If your character's life has been on the balance for the past month due to an OOC thing, it MUST be hard to return to it after a longer period of time. 

 

I'm sure us as players won't exactly know the workload of staff members and how much shit they have to put up with, but in the same vein, if any of my characters were to be CKed and I'd have to wait more than two weeks for that? I'd see it as a bit of a problem. 

 

Not from an impatient standpoint, but when your name pops up that your character has died, I can assume memorials will take place, facebrowser posts etc and development of many characters that have a sudden change. If everyone surrounded by my character was hit hard by the news of her death, then suddenly it all gets reversed?

 

How do we go forward?

 

As an example, say a few people that know my character have mourned her death. She's a high ranking character in some criminal organisation and she gets replaced by somebody else because she has died. A month later, all the development of the character that took her place IC would eventually become undone because of this; leading onto a greater domino effect how a CK reversal can shift character development in the wrong direction.

Edited April 13, 2021 by Akali

[Fancy Toothpaste]

Transparency would immediately improve community outlook on CK appeals. When an admin picks up a report they usually start by saying, "Handling" and/or asking questions. I see this on some CK appeals, but it should be basic practice. At least that way people know that their CK appeal has been acknolwdged.

Another idea would be to expand the CK guidelines of what is, and what isn't CK worthy. Some people feel as though all actions that would warrent a PK may also warrent a CK. Alot of people seem to underestimate their ability to be CKed. There might not be any hard-lines as to what will or won't get you CKed, but knowing where to aproximate the line might be helpful.
 

Spoiler

Examples

 

• A player is a known scammer and is scamming you for $30 000, it was a one time event and you just lost a trade : this is PK worthy and not CK worthy.
• A player is robbing a victim, the victim manages to run away and call the cops while running, the cops arrive and arrest the robber. Submitting a CK appeal on the victim because you were sent to jail will be denied as this is a direct result of the robber's actions, and it's a common sense response from the victim.
• A player joined a faction as outsider with his best friend, becomes associate after a few weeks and fully involve himself in the criminal faction to become a made man. After a few months, his best friend is murdered by the faction leader for an unknown or known reason in front of him, he decides to revenge him : The CK will be denied as killing the faction leader following the death of your best friend makes no sense for your development within this faction and the value of your life as a person : you're attacking yourself to a criminal leader and you'll die few days if not minutes after you attack him. Your friend being dead is also be a direct result of his involvement in the faction.
• A criminal faction leader is well known among the criminal world, decides to rape and kill a little girl after following her home. The father catches him on the act and takes revenge : the criminal faction leader's action was unrelated to his duties as faction leader, and the father doesn't have any fear to have as he doesn't know his real involvement within the criminal world and he could ignore it as he would have no reason to value safety for his life after such action. CK application would be accepted.
• Two players start a criminal group together, after a few years one decides to betray the other by snitching to the cops about their activities : CK application would be accepted on the snitch.

 

[DasFroggy]

One aspect that needs to absolutely change is the time limit factor. If CK appeals cannot be reliably answered with haste, the issue of it being "too long ago" should no longer be a factor. 

 

...and as the Fancy Toothpaste has pointed out, some more strict guidelines on CK rules and allowances would help considerably. When it comes to permanently taking someone's roleplay off the table, there needs to be as little room for bias as possible.

[Kappaurel]

2 hours ago, HaveADream said:

CK appeals are handled by Management/IFM I believe, LFM haven't ever handled them. I do hear what you guys are saying about the length of time it takes to turn these around so I'll bring it up with the HoF 🙂 

 

Jacqueline Keating CK "IFM and LFM"

 

The user below has mentioned that you don't take appeals, but CK requests... I mean, if you take part in one side of the process one would think you also take part on the other... but well, I do not know what happens under the hood!

Edited April 13, 2021 by Kappaurel

[Martyn]

1 minute ago, Kappaurel said:

 

Jacqueline Keating CK "IFM and LFM"

 

He's talking about handling the CK appeal, not about the CK request itself.

[Florida]

1 hour ago, Kaxo said:

The problem is most of the time they sit there for a month + and don't even get viewed, then as someone else said, they often get denied solely on the fact it's "been too long to void now."

I mean, a basic report can sometimes take up to a month depending on how fast it gets picked up by an admin, and they have far more staff working on these and they are bound to be less complicated in general than your average CK appeal. 

Ideas to improve? I honestly don't see any way other than letting the CKd party view the CK application before the CK is carried out, perhaps they could only be shown a redacted version, or someone from IFM could simply ask them to summarize as best they can their interaction/relationship with the party applying for the CK. 

 

I understand that example better now thank you. 

 

For management who handles CK appeals, how do you ask the party who carried out the CK for information? Do you present them the entire appeal or just ask a general open-ended question to find out what their side of the story is?

 

Also, just so I can understand the process, what does the party doing the CK have to provide? I'm thinking we as a community can speed up this process if CK's are documented better. If both parties have screenshots/videos it would prevent such problems. If factions/groups performing CK's document the why of their decision, it would speed up the entire process. If we're just using peoples conflicting stories it will go on forever.

[Legate]

I only read the title and I completely agree, it's pretty ridiculous lol.

[DeadPlaya]

What about sending the CK'd party a copy of the CK request after it's been completed? That way the party knows the reasoning and either does not appeal or knows exactly which claims to dispute and how.

[Kappaurel]

33 minutes ago, DeadPlaya said:

What about sending the CK'd party a copy of the CK request after it's been completed? That way the party knows the reasoning and either does not appeal or knows exactly which claims to dispute and how.

Admins will say that metagaming would happen.

[Garras Up]

neither of the fixes will work, admins just needa try to handle ck appeals quicker.