Amendment to Property Rules & Regulations (4.0 Inactivity)

[Jura]

1 minute ago, Lewis. said:

But in many cases they're not requesting the property.. they're bought off of other players. 

Either way, they have the property because they wanted to roleplay a business of some sort. Whether they requested it through the UCP or bought it from a player is besides the point.

[Sixty]

1 minute ago, Lewis. said:

But in many cases they're not requesting the property.. they're bought off of other players. 

Point still stands. If they bought it off another player, then they spent a lot of money to acquire said property. They obviously should have plans on using the property. If it's important enough to them after all that money, a single PM to a property management admin shouldn't be a big deal.

[mala]

On 3/26/2021 at 2:23 PM, Lewis. said:

I believe the rule needs to be changed where the owner is notified by a member of PM to either push activity hard on the business or sell before it's taken away manually by the team. This gives a fair chance for the owner to make a decision if they can truly invest the time on continuing to manage and open the business or have it passed on to better hands. 

 

The current system demotivates people in terms of their time and energy when something they've built up is ultimately taken away and destroyed at the click of a button. 

Absolutely necessary.
 

I've seen plenty of people get completely demotivated and lose tons of hard work they put into their characters because of this. More recently, an active business that was opening, but some of the previous were employees kicked as it was handed to a different owner.
And someone who was active and rp'd on their property but not specifically inside the house. In both cases, it was yanked without prior notice, and they did not get it back after reaching out. Another case, someone who was renting the property to ic friends, so the property was active but not by the owner. Again, yanked without prior notice.

You need to push for activity or request an explanation before just yanking it. That's just decency.

I'm not against the 2 week to 1 month inactivity timer, if you don't log in at all you're kind of accepting that. But the recent questionable property removals have all been manually done.

Edited March 27, 2021 by Havana

[Frezemis]

There's another way to go about this and it's already listed in the property rules. If you aren't going to use the property or business you can notify us and we can hold it for you to avoid losing it. Common Courtesy works both ways, you can come to us as well and let us know. There are players that will hold properties without using them, we have to go through an extensive search and check whether they are using it or not as it is. The workload of property management has already been brought up, I agree that a forum PM is not that hard to do but it adds more work and more time every time we take a property for being inactive or a player not using it.

 

A notification is sent to appeal the revocation. We are not here to babysit you and what you do with your property, you took it, we expect you to use it. You can be the most active person on the server and not step foot in your house, that's grounds for removal and adding in a timer to see whether or not you use your property seems like a hassle. Don't buy it if you aren't going to use it, someone else can put it to better use.

 

I see all of this common courtesy mentions but we don't give anyone any issues when they need to go inactive and they let us know about it. We want people to come to us and tell us "Hey I'm going to be inactive a little bit just so you guys know that way I can return and continue with my business.". For all I know, you could be setting foot in your property and still not using it at all. Communication is a two way path not a one way path where you expect a system to do it for you. Leases have a time span on them because you have to pay monthly, houses do not, businesses that are bought separately do not.

 

I try to encourage people to come to me if their business is failing. If you're having issues and you let any of us know, no one will bat an eye. If you can't find a purpose for a property, I'll give you ideas if I can think of them I will try and give you the resources to make sure your property is being used to your liking. We should not have to babysit and notify everyone to use their properties in-game when there are rules and alternatives to go around it. 

[Flow]

The reason for the rule I believe is so that you're held responsible to make use of the property you're entrusted with, for the sake of using it to create RP on the server, and so that you're not holding out on the same opportunity for others, which I understand, but if the ownership is harmless I don't see the issue. Besides someone may be busy IRL due to whatsoever reasons.

As a baseline, I do agree that the auto-sweep should be upped a bit for all players. However to add to what's mentioned in the above post -

12 hours ago, Havana said:

I've seen plenty of people get completely demotivated and lose tons of hard work they put into their characters because of this. More recently, an active business that was opening, but some of the previous were employees kicked as it was handed to a different owner.
And someone who was active and rp'd on their property but not specifically inside the house. In both cases, it was yanked without prior notice, and they did not get it back after reaching out. Another case, someone who was renting the property to ic friends, so the property was active but not by the owner. Again, yanked without prior notice.

You need to push for activity or request an explanation before just yanking it. That's just decency.

I'm not against the 2 week to 1 month inactivity timer, if you don't log in at all you're kind of accepting that. But the recent questionable property removals have all been manually done.

This is something I've experienced too & I thus want to add that the rule is simply the tip of the iceberg. Recently I came to realize, say for a business, even if you actively play and there are people trying to hire staff at the property, even though there is a lot of roleplay going on at the place, people frequenting it for meetings and such, your property may potentially get stripped if you're not doing 'public openings' once every 14 days, which I don't see much reason in.

Be it the automatic sweep if you don't log on or a manual admin sweep if they don't see the place opening 'publicly' , I think the questions that should be raised, considered & set for the PM are -

Did the owner have legitimate reasons for their inactivity / being unable to open their business or use their house?
Although though the property didn't open publicly, was there roleplay going on at the place by others? In the case of a house or an apartment, was it being rented out, still used for RP even when the owners weren't actively frequenting?
Did they have any plans during the 2 weeks to bring back activity to their owned properties?  Was an effort being made passively?

I feel like all these things aren't being considered in the current state & the guidelines are a bit too harsh to be reasonable. Not to mention, certain businesses require a lot of OOC planning and involvement of characters that roleplay very specific roles, who might be difficult to bring about and could take some time.

Just to make it clear, I do understand properties being taken if you're not logging on at all, perhaps there could be a strike system as suggested and the 2 weeks upped to 3 or 4, my emphasis here lies in the fact that we're also seeing this pattern where even if people are logging on, properties are being stripped for way sillier reasons one of them being this 'public-openings'. 

You see businesses shut IRL for more than a couple weeks due to whatsoever reasons. There could be IC reasons as to why it doesn't open, and there still may be RP going on at the property even if its not open to the public, which happened in my case. In such instances, there should definitely be some headway.

Edited March 28, 2021 by Flow

[Mahiko]

I agree with this, the level of bureaucracy here is starting to make it a second job for some. I understand everything has to be documented, but how hard is it to add a button that warns the owner that they have 14 days to get straight else they risk loss of the business. 

[Spartan]

Yes.

[arkan]

agreed. system needs a heavy revise and this is a step in the right direction 

[Exquisite]

Agree, more time for someone instead of revoking it after 14 days. What if you land in hospital for 1 month? Oh wait... all your hard work into a game that you enjoy playing will just be gone and vanished, so is your money and investments. This wouldn’t be fair. We should not even be discussing this, short span of 2 weeks is way too short, people go on holiday for 1/2 months, if you let Property Mangemwnt know it should be allowed whatsoever real life reason. If you do not let property management know about your situation, length the issue from sending a reminder after 14 days that you got 14 more days left to actively use/log in.

[MadSpecter]

I agree with this, because sometimes, you could get some irl situation which land up to not being able log in for a month and then you lost house and business, maybe you spend 1m in to assets and getting that money back is truly hard.