Business licensing and it's current state

[Gambler]

Just a suggestion:
I think the licenses should be considered to come along with the image below. That's 50 grands right there.

This just an unique store shop. But like with any kind of shop people apply for and with whatever different prices they have.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Gambler

[knppel]

As it was mentioned, even just from hearsay I can tell the most recent introduction was badly communicated.

Fees aside, the system was introduced to take effect immediately, without any adaption phase (i.e. announcing introduction of business regulation and giving business operators X days to meet demands to keep operating legally).

 

That's why this topic comes up now - and I hate to be that guy but @Pogis, there is nothing here that an interactive government crew could not have found out ic by consulting business operators, investigating their revenues and so on.

I get things are being discussed in closed groups (same as other closed groups discuss how ridiculous it is, lol).

 

I'm not trying to throw shade here (unlike some others above I share Ink's opinion that licensing can add a great facette to business rp- it's the execution I criticize, not the idea behind it), but it's a simple fact that if you want matters of public relevance to be handled in a way that the public is fine with, a public debate is necessary-

right now once again the gov manages to try hard (really, I mean I can see the effort obviously!), only to again come off as know-it-alls in ivory towers that seem to have no idea how businesses run in practice, how much money they make and so on (except for the meta where one owner-operator actually makes money for the money).

 

[Macarroncito]

I've always focused my business in creating RP for others, never on profit. These prices are gonna kill that mindset, making the business owner to focus on profit (You are simply leaving them no choice) so they can keep their business and considering businesses are the barebones of RP I hope the people behind these new licensing system can see how terrible it is.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Macarroncito

[ThatDutchPerson]

These prices directly promote this kind of advertisements @mj2002

 

[Tsarna]

@Pogis - of course it happened. I have been running Out of Towners eighteen months now, and the licensing officer came and whined every time if I forgot the license payment. Shut the place down with police as well. Oh - and not to mention the favors they asked, so that you license will be taken care before anyone else 😛

I agree with everyone, who says, that the rp-aspect with those kind of prices will be the last thing the people will care about. Simple as that. They will hire nobody at the nightclubs, bars, restaurants, instead doing it all by themselves. People, who can not afford OOCly to open their place 2-3 times a week, can not afford any business at all. And people, who co-own businesses, they will get nothing in return. People can say all about "it is about the rp" and it is - I open OOT also in the morning or daytime, so the people, who are online on those timezones have some place to come and rp - but it also to make profit, since, ya know, in the real world, people make businesses to make profit for themselves. 

[vrb]

On a side note, unrelated to the business licenses and the current problem being discussed, political parties can address many government issues through our lawmakers. Discussions around improving businesses have been discussed as a major policy ticket for the upcoming elections. We've been actively working with party business owners to take on many concerns and figure out the smartest way to solve them. 

 

I recommend getting in touch with your party or push towards change through a political candidate. In most cases, we won't be able to make changes directly. For example, we can't change things imposed by FM/PM or interfere with the LSGOV laws and departments. But we can formulate plans of action and talk to the associated parties for change. In most cases, such as with LSGOV and FM, we have good rapport and can at the very least make proposals for change. 

[Smilesville]

7 hours ago, Pogis said:

I don't remember a single case where a Licensing Official would waltz into an open business and shout that everyone had to leave. That simply never happened.

 

Licensing did not 'disappear' because of any of the reasons you mentioned, actually. It disappeared because when Rockford resigned, they took the City Services Platform down with them, so we had no registries of businesses and no ways of making businesses register / apply for licenses. We've decided to resort to forum for that now, as a replacement CSP is still in the works by the GTA:W Web Devs.

 

Licensing is going to be a thing, we'll adjust the prices heavily and then reinstate the system.

As many others have attested, it's happened several times under the previous system - nor are these examples difficult to find. I would suggest that being unable to remember a case of one of the most common interactions between licensing officials and business owners is fairly telling. Wouldn't it be prudent to speak with players on the receiving end of the previous licensing ordeal before crafting a new one?

 

You are similarly mistaken about the reason for licensing disappearing, but putting aside that argument and focusing wholly on your own, are we then to believe that server management (at the time) gave immense power over City Services to an individual with the sole capability to shut everything down without the possibility of recovery? That seems unwise, to put it gently.

 

Moving the licensing system to the forums would have been an easy solution - a lack of information would mean that every current business could consider itself registered through a grace period. Easy fix. However, Rockford's resignation isn't exactly recent history; if the system were working as well as you claim, why did it take so long for this to come up again?

 

At best, licensing is a pedantic and needlessly script-focused segment of play that addresses none of the problems it alleges to fix.

At worst, licensing actively discourages creativity and punishes those businesses who break even, but have a neat RP concept.

 

Licensing was a bad idea before, and it's a bad idea now.

[Phased]

Business licensing for businesses which sell alcohol, sure. Tobacco Stores?   Other than high class cigar vendors is that not entirely a European thing?  I'd rather go to the gas station lol.

 

 

In regards to the rest, registering business' makes absolute sense, but a "general conduct" license is just a money sink, that makes very little sense.  I could buy health and safety stuff but that shouldn't cost in the tens of thousands.   This is just going to make people not license businesses and the licensing officials will do what happened on LS-RP - rolling around in black sedans in suits and demanding police respond to unlicensed gyms and retail outlets to "shut them down!!!"

[shareef2]

8 hours ago, DLimit said:

It's happened. They'd shut down the business until the business was licensed. Otherwise, they'd threaten to contact the authorities for legal infracitons.

Shutting down a business due to multiple infractions is not the same as strolling into a business and shouting "Out! Out I say!" 

 

There's a legal process on both ends for such penalties to occur. We never got to just shut business down, at least not when I was a member, there was a whole process including evidence gathering and requests, etc, and then at the end it's all up to whether law enforcement assists or not. 

[Smilesville]

13 minutes ago, shareef2 said:

Shutting down a business due to multiple infractions is not the same as strolling into a business and shouting "Out! Out I say!" 

 

There's a legal process on both ends for such penalties to occur. We never got to just shut business down, at least not when I was a member, there was a whole process including evidence gathering and requests, etc, and then at the end it's all up to whether law enforcement assists or not. 

It's definitely happened - we even have proof.

 

Not only did they close the business immediately and blockade the parking lot with police cars - they went as far as to order the police to bust the door down and seize all the alcohol inside the building. This isn't the fault of the police either; many of them refused to comply with the outlandish demands of the licensing officials until Rockford himself strolled down to the front of the business and started threatening pensions of the officers in charge. It was an e-peen swinging shitshow heralded as an example of what business licensing should be. There were plenty more problems with Rockford and Co than "they left and wouldn't let us use the things."

 

Business licensing should never come back.