Suggestion to address /createdrink abuse within bars and clubs.

[The OG Juicebox]

5 minutes ago, Briutas said:

 

Not bad idea I suppose. As long as that allows alcohol manufacturing companies to still make their own brands and not get called out for it being 'named' moonshine at the end of the drink name. 
 

Can you not just use the "Craft Liquor" item for any of the spirits? Tequila, Vodka, etc. It's more universal.

[Entity]

I'm not much of an alcohol person but I am 99.99% sure that the technology you're suggestion we implement is straight up science fiction. There can't be a small device that you carry around and it tells you what a drink is. How would that work? Based on what?

 

Either way, we have to think about the real life scenarios. Does this happen in real life? I don't know but I've never heard of anyone going around with an alcohol testing kit and checking out every single drink they buy. In-game, going to bars after this suggestion is implemented will either get everyone to pull out their testing kits and look for a chance to sue or get no one to do that. We have breathalyzers in 24/7s but really, how many people use them?

[Paenymion]

You can just force the base item to be in brackets after the "new" name is given, like:  "Champagne [Moonshine]".  THEN if people are actually bothered by that, they can report it.

[knppel]

16 hours ago, Henning said:

+1 to the suggestion. There's a lot of fun RP in liquor distribution and it's basically being snubbed out so people can earn a few extra bucks.

This is why this was brought up indeed. It's about standards, simple as.

 

16 hours ago, Ellix said:

I think it's definitely OOC rulebreaking and powergaming. If you order champaign and are given a glass of moonshine, you're going to know without needing some drink tester lol

 

The current standard I meet ingame is, I go to a club, order champagne, get wine, complain and am told in /b "Sorry, forgot to rename it".

I then receive me "champagne".

 

I personally feel also that, as indicated in the op, this is not a singled out issue where a few people work around a system for personal gains.

At the current state, it's the normal and obvious thing to do for bar/club operators- even I can't tell in detail wherefrom all alcohol stock in the club I operate from stems, as I also was forced to aquire some on short notice, did profitable deals to safe money and so on.

 

I'm not necessarily in favour of testkits (Reminds me of a good old Louis de Funes-film, ha), but I agree to the op and others voiced here that a "Culture change" in liquor distribution rp could not hurt.

 

As we all know culture's bs and prentention first hand, let's speak about what forms culture: money.

And this is the core issue club operators face.

 

In comparison, the margins are simply too large.

Even if I roleplay my booze proper rather than to relabel stuff random, I can organize a craft beer for under 50 dollar and put it on the tab for 100.

In comparison, a bottle of beer purchased through a qualified producer (Namely, Mount Gordos who has a destillery and brewery you can also tour ic for instance), costs roughly 80-90 dollar depending on how many you order.

 

Now, the average bar or nightclub is a profit orientated business in character, not the hobby of a wealthy sponsor.

As such, it is obliged to make some money.

Evidently, marketing and promotion is possible to also make a venue operating on more than minimal cost profitable- but this is a very complicated, risky and expensive strategy.

As such, most business operators rather go the other way and try to reduce cost first to increase profits.

For this, it's the obvious choice to pick the script product that comes cheapest and serves the purpose, regardless the origin or how often an item was relabeled.

[Ink]

If anything, the type of alcohol should show up when you drink it. A drink tasting kit is just kind of a silly idea, and more importantly, I would rather not see the space in the item name wasted with anything from {Beer] to [Champagne] or [Craft Beer] and [Craft Liquor] -- that's wasting space in the name that we could instead be using to name those items and provide detail.

 

It's a shame we should be making a rule about this. In my time, I've definitely seen my share of blatant abuse of the food/drink script to maximize profits. Gusset Restaurant, for instance, was using /createfood to create bottles of wine and champagne because they were a restaurant. Considering wine's like $150 from liquor stores and champagne's in the $400s, this can save tremendous amounts of money for the business when the /createfood only costs a few bucks. A business selling units of champagne by renaming "food" or "beers" can be saving literally upwards of $4,000 per 10 sold. It's pretty much powergaming, and in my mind, it's no different from using "/createfood" to create "Brick of Cocaine - Food (150g)" 

 

I don't know if this is something players should be tasked with investigating and enforcing. Maybe this is just part of a regular admin audit on businesses to check that it's ensuring that its employees do not abuse the system. The only problem I see is that there is a personal incentive for individual employees to abuse the script on the business's behalf. The business might not even be complicit; the employee might potentially be /createfood'ing a drink to grift some extra cash. The business itself doesn't have the power to enforce this. Maybe it's something which can be included in the purchase logs? "So-and-so created "X" named drink with "Y" product"

[Briutas]

13 minutes ago, Ink said:

If anything, the type of alcohol should show up when you drink it. A drink tasting kit is just kind of a silly idea, and more importantly, I would rather not see the space in the item name wasted with anything from {Beer] to [Champagne] or [Craft Beer] and [Craft Liquor] -- that's wasting space in the name that we could instead be using to name those items and provide detail.

 

It's a shame we should be making a rule about this. In my time, I've definitely seen my share of blatant abuse of the food/drink script to maximize profits. Gusset Restaurant, for instance, was using /createfood to create bottles of wine and champagne because they were a restaurant. Considering wine's like $150 from liquor stores and champagne's in the $400s, this can save tremendous amounts of money for the business when the /createfood only costs a few bucks. A business selling units of champagne by renaming "food" or "beers" can be saving literally upwards of $4,000 per 10 sold. It's pretty much powergaming, and in my mind, it's no different from using "/createfood" to create "Brick of Cocaine - Food (150g)" 

 

I don't know if this is something players should be tasked with investigating and enforcing. Maybe this is just part of a regular admin audit on businesses to check that it's ensuring that its employees do not abuse the system. The only problem I see is that there is a personal incentive for individual employees to abuse the script on the business's behalf. The business might not even be complicit; the employee might potentially be /createfood'ing a drink to grift some extra cash. The business itself doesn't have the power to enforce this. Maybe it's something which can be included in the purchase logs? "So-and-so created "X" named drink with "Y" product"

I think If you receive alcohol which says (FOOD) at the end It can easily be reported as it is clear it's neither from liquor store nor from other alcohol distributor that sells craft beer and moonshine. It's really a shame though' because running a business should generate roleplay and not be used for pure profit.

 

@The OG Juicebox @Ink @knppel @Entity @roymar Following your feedback I edited the suggestion. Changed testing kit idea to leaving name of base item drink at the end of drink name after it's renamed to help people notice and report abuse of the script. Hope the discussion continues and we save our alcohol economy. 😄 

Edited January 1, 2021 by Briutas

[Entity]

1 hour ago, Briutas said:

I think If you receive alcohol which says (FOOD) at the end It can easily be reported as it is clear it's neither from liquor store nor from other alcohol distributor that sells craft beer and moonshine. It's really a shame though' because running a business should generate roleplay and not be used for pure profit.

 

@The OG Juicebox @Ink @knppel @Entity @roymar Following your feedback I edited the suggestion. Changed testing kit idea to leaving name of base item drink at the end of drink name after it's renamed to help people notice and report abuse of the script. Hope the discussion continues and we save our alcohol economy. 😄 

I'm personally on board with that idea, of having the base item either in parenthesis or accessible via a command (like /examineitem, I don't know). That'd be pretty cool and would definitely help improve this issue.

[Chipsdose]

On 12/31/2020 at 3:26 PM, Briutas said:

There are businesses who abuse /createdrink in bars and clubs. Renaming moonshine to Whiskey, Rum, Champagne.

Really? Never noticed that inside any club so far. Would be also pretty easy to figure it out since they would have a bunch of base alcohol laying around in the property which are tagged with (drink) and aren't connected to any brewery drinks. Like if there are for example 10 Whiskey(drink) inside the property then it's pretty obvious that someone abused something. Don't know about bars but inside clubs I don't really see this happening. Wouldn't mind if there's an extra feature added where you can check the base item name before it got renamed with /createdrink.

[zaXer.]

There's people who roleplay creating fake alcohol (cheap low quality club-style alcohol), so what happens with them? There's lots of places that roleplay putting artificial sweeteners, flavours, etc, into cheap moonshine/liquor to transform them into other shit replica style drinks.

Edited January 1, 2021 by zaXer.

[Ink]

7 minutes ago, zaXer. said:

There's people who roleplay creating fake alcohol (cheap low quality club-style alcohol), so what happens with them? There's lots of places that roleplay putting artificial sweeteners, flavours, etc, into cheap moonshine/liquor to transform them into other shit replica style drinks.

 

If clubs/bars are actually engaging in the roleplay of watering down their drinks or selling gutrot with sweeteners, it's pretty powergame-y for them not to make that roleplay apparent to the customers. For all the clubs/bars I've gone to, I've never had anyone /createdrink me a "Shitty Vodka" or a "Disgusting Cheap Whiskey." I've never had anyone do an emote of pouring me a drink and saying /do "It would be really watered down and unpleasant to drink." My character is a whiskey snob, so if she went to a bar and someone poured her a watered down Jameson, she'd be able to tell pretty much instantly--or if a place was serving fake whiskey which was just colored and sweetened moonshine.

 

I think it's awesome that people are seeking this roleplay and I think it's really valid, but if you're roleplaying it our system allows you to make that a collaborative RP experience (by including details in the /createdrink or by emoting clearly) rather than just a way for the club to pocket some extra e-monies with each sale.