Responding to ads with the sole intention to set up robberies.

[Illusory]

[DLimit]

6 hours ago, Ellix said:

The measures you can take to prevent this are the same IC as IRL. Whether you're responding to an ad, or someone's responding to yours, meet by the police station, don't bring extra valuables or cash with you, bring friends, etc. It's also good to talk to the person on the phone a bit, so you can pick up their vibe. If they're just trying to rush it, balk at meeting somewhere safe, or throw up any other red flags, just pass on it.

 

For the record, I've never robbed someone from an ad, and despite selling several things, have never been robbed from posting one. I refuse to meet with people who give me a bad feeling, and make sure to take precautions. I do think it's completely manageable IC.

Most people tend to conduct deals within public areas that are heavily populated, as-well. People sell their phones and gaming consoles at McDonalds in fear that the buyer will attempt to rob them.

[Tseard]

I don't know if this is mentioned somewhere but this is something that happens in-real life as well. I have done some research into this and the LASD actually has patrol stations with a designated Safe Exchange Point in their parking lot. 

 

''The goal of the designated parking spots is to provide residents a safe, secure environment, and also reduce the number of fraudulent transactions taking place, as well as act as a level of protection against theft and other crimes.''

 

I am pretty sure there are more points like these designated in real life.

 

Why am I mentioning this? Well step number one for your own safety is to do it somewhere in the public, in front of a government building or at a police station. Will it take some more time and effort to get there? Definitely. Will it guarantee your safety? Definitely. 

 

Meeting somewhere in a shady place just because it is convenient for you as it is around the corner or if the ''buyer'' wants to do it is on you for not thinking straight and not taking your safety in proper account.

 

No you don't have to hire security or get a bodyguard to protect you. That's nonsense. Use some common sense and you'll get far but people on this server just want to sell items quick and fast to get their bucks and then it is your fault for getting robbed.

Edited December 31, 2020 by Tseard

[Entity]

Not everything should be put behind a regulation wall just so that we legal RPers can live in a utopia. This kind of thing not only happens in real life, but it's actually really common with person-to-person sales. I've had it happen to me both in-game and in real life. It's a purely IC thing. 

 

In what context could this even be OOC, as long as it's properly roleplayed? If someone wants to sell you a car for three times less than it actually costs, tells you to go in the middle of the desert with all-cash on you and you do and get robbed then that's on you, not on them.

 

If it's not properly roleplayed, than the issue is not the scenario but the execution. It has nothing to do with the circumstances.

[borhoi]

There is no reason to make this against the rules at all. It's IC and it's on you to have the smarts to figure out how to approach any situation safely. Get your CCW. Bring other people. Make sure others know where you are. There are lots of contingencies.

 

And at the end of the day you get robbed? Well, you got robbed. It happens irl and in game.

 

I have a litany of problems with criminal RP but this isn't one of them. This is just normal and acceptable criminal RP.

[symphony]

Look up that story where this woman was in the process of selling a house to a couple, and when she met them to give them a tour of the house, they brutally robbed and murdered her. It happens. 

[Alyssa McCarthy]

18 hours ago, The OG Juicebox said:

Thoughts on this? There's nothing in the advertisement rules to prevent it. People use the ad system and respond to players selling cars/houses/looking for mechanics/etc. with zero intention to actually go through with the transaction, only to rob them instead.

 

Scenarios:

1) Player makes an ad to sell their car. Robber responds to the ad and has them meet somewhere a little more private with the 100% intention to rob them and potentially steal their car.

2) Player makes an ad to buy a house/apartment. Robber responds (even if they don't own a property to sell) and sends them a location to lure them in with the intention of robbing them.

3) Player makes an ad looking for a mechanic to do some work on their vehicle. Robber responds and brings them to a closed mechanic shop or tricks them into going somewhere else under the guise of being a mechanic, but with full intention on just initiating a robbery instead once the player arrives.

 

You get the idea.  I've been the victim of one of these scenarios and twice managed to avoid it, but it was glaringly apparent that's what they were trying to do. I took the L and went on with my day. Is this an IC issue? OOC issue? Do you think its an issue at all? Should this be reported / violation of common courtesy or somehow dealt with IC'ly if possible? Discuss.

These seems like IC problems with some very simple IC solutions and imo, you're putting your character at a very unrealistic level of risk by reacting to the scenarios in the way you indicated.

 

1) Don't agree to meet someone in a 'little more private' location? Who in their right mind would do this with a stranger?

Meet them publicly, or have them come to your home, where you have CCTV, where you have the firearms, where you have a perhaps a friend or two. The mistake here is agreeing to do some backstreet deal (if that's what you meant by a 'little more private').

 

2) Again, this is another scenario where you're yielding far too much power, far too easily because of a slightly odd situation.

It's very unusual for people of low-middle income to be putting out ads to buy properties and even far less usual for people to not then do some research of a property before agreeing to go visit / check it out. In RL, this usually works the other way around, where the seller posts the ad and the potential buyer becomes aware of it via a realtor / estate agents. 

 

By just turning up to meet a stranger like the way you describe, you're putting yourself in danger. You'd not do this in the real world (I hope), why would you do it here? Even then, if you see masked people, you're free to just drive on by, if you see the people you re looking for, you're fully within your rights to video them and the property on your phone & upload it to the cloud (in the event it gets stolen). If they're not outside waiting, then call them, make them come outside to meet you. Don't forget, you can always take a friend!

The lesson to learn here? Don't walk into a building with strangers you've never seen before or checked out or have zero reason to trust - I'd hope you'd not do that RL!

 

3) This is just poor RP - no-one looks for a mechanic like this - everyone just goes to an open garage, or finds a specialist mechanic online or via friends.

 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Alyssa McCarthy

[The OG Juicebox]

@Alyssa McCarthy Just to clarify the situations were things that Ive seen, not necessarily things that happened to me lol. I just posted them for discussion purposes, as a I’ve seen and heard all three scenarios. The one that happened to me was just out of sheer curiosity on how it happened lol. 

[Exploits]

15 hours ago, Moonsong said:

So I'd encourage players encountering these types of robberies to report them (even if they haven't broken a rule in your case) so that we can observe them and make sure they're not doing shit like chain robbing, using low effort /mes and rushing roleplay which we can certainly take action on, if not it can help us build potential roleplay quality cases.

 

Not much else to the subject, sadly. Let's not pretend that these robberies aren't ultimately extremely low effort behaviour for the most part. I also guarantee that if you ask most of these people to meet you at a rules bound crime-free zone, most would buck the deal for sudden and wholly invented reasons.

 

I really don't recommend anybody folly themselves with the idea of 'handling this ICly'. Most of these players are just new or have no long-term server goals and are looking to have some easy fun. Nobody is going to put the time to investigate a robbery made by three sub-40hr player accounts in order to recoup lost goods through a month-long civil court procedure. Going to a 'public place' is pointless if they are factually empty of real players or nobody reacts or helps you in time. And I don't really reproach anybody for this on either side.

 

There is absolutely nothing preventing you from protecting yourself by playing to the server rules of no-crime zones and asking that your exchanges happen at them. Some might say you're power/metagaming intentions by presuming a robbery by doing so, but the person committing it will almost never give you the same courtesy to admit that they are also ostensibly power/metagaming their robberies by doing the exact opposite.

Edited December 31, 2020 by Exploits

[cracked]

That's fully OK. I got robbed off my own Facebook ad once, literally 20 meters from my house.