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Thoughts on Yakuza roleplay?


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1 hour ago, DLimit said:

What's the relevance? I clearly stated that if Yakuza is accepted, then The Shower Posse should be accepted.

 

Your map makes up about 25% of cali and yakuza takes up the botto m half so i wouldnt say they are more prevelant

Edited by Juicebox.
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1 hour ago, Juicebox. said:

 

Your map makes up about 25% of cali and yakuza takes up the botto m half so i wouldnt say they are more prevelant

In the context of densely populated? More than likely. We're referencing to L.A., alone, not the entire U.S.

Yakuza's competitors are Triads and other OCs. For The Shower Posse? It's only the B.G.F., in L.A., which aren't as powerful outside of prison simply because the black sets don't have an organized structure like La Eme or your average mafia.

B.G.F. opposes The Shower Posse's presence as The Shower Posse poisons the Black Community while B.G.F. desires to "uplift them". Thus, they're the primary competitors in the market. Shower Posse, on the other hand, works with Triads and other O.C.G.s for capital gain. Asian and European O.C.G.s aren't concerned with selling crack to a black man. Thus, the Shower Posse works with them to monopolize on the African-American community, some thing that the B.G.F. would never do.

EDIT: The notion that the Yakuza have powerful competitors that overpower them is the reason as to why they wouldn't be "more prevalent". Shower Posse, on the other hand, works hand-in-hand with all OCGs, M.C.s, and street gangs that aren't white supremacist, radical Muslims, or radical Rastafaris. Less competitors means easier survivability. They're the main suppliers of marijuana, cocaine, and firearms for black street gangs in the U.S... The Yakuza, on the other hand, would be competing with every other supplier to provide for their own, which is why most of their work, in L.A., simply involves laundering and other low-key work. Else, they'd be removed by their opposition.

Shower Posse would prefer to "split the wealth" with other OCGs than to wage war with them. Their entire system is based on funneling wealth to the Jamaican Labour Party... they want money, more than any thing.

Their motto is "Make it rain on 'em" or "Let it Shower"... if it brings profits? Then, they'll do it, regardless as to whether it's "immoral". They even openly claim that they'll hang with any one that makes it rain. They don't have a strict Code, like Yakuza, which is why their survivability and presence is stronger in L.A. than the Yakuza. Yakuza simply has too many enemies if it actually involved conducting work on the same level as other dominant OCGs... they'd be destroyed, overnight.

The only reason as to why people don't HEAR the name "Shower Posse" is because they disguise themselves as Bloods and Crips in L.A., usually sending 1-2 members to work hand-in-hand with each set under their flag. They'd be arrested, on the spot, if they claimed "Shower Posse" in public simply because they're targeted by both the C.I.A. and F.B.I.... they're borderline terrorists in Jamaica that smuggle narcotics into the U.S.
 

 

Edited by DLimit
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2 hours ago, Juicebox. said:

Your map makes up about 25% of cali and yakuza takes up the botto m half so i wouldnt say they are more prevelant

I mean, they're definitely more prevalent in Cali than the Yakuza. Yes, the Yakuza does things in Cali, but it's mainly money laundering and white collar shit, there's 0 presence on the streets and they're relatively unheard of in the criminal underworld of LA, which is mainly ruled by Latino and Black gangs.

Edited by Garras Up
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4 hours ago, Garras Up said:

I mean, they're definitely more prevalent in Cali than the Yakuza. Yes, the Yakuza does things in Cali, but it's mainly money laundering and white collar shit, there's 0 presence on the streets and they're relatively unheard of in the criminal underworld of LA, which is mainly ruled by Latino and Black gangs.

You could easily say this about anything remotely LCN. How far are we to take this, exactly? That's always been the problem with this sort of mentality - if you're afraid to let people spread their wings a little, you have no license to complain that nothing original ever happens.

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5 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

You could easily say this about anything remotely LCN.

I mean, pretty much yeah, and I have said that about LCN groups. 

6 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

How far are we to take this, exactly?

if it was up to me, much of the city would be dominated by black, hispanic and asian street gangs, along with a few small criminal organizations such as the Korean Kkangpae and some Chinese groups because their presence in LS actually makes sense and their presence in Los Angeles' Koreatown and Chinatown areas is pretty much indisputable. But it's not up to me, so I guess that's up to the admins to answer, cause even if i wanted to see a Yakuza faction, ultimately it's up to FM whether or not they get accepted.

 

8 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

That's always been the problem with this sort of mentality - if you're afraid to let people spread their wings a little, you have no license to complain that nothing original ever happens.

Personally? I don't mind people spreading their wings, I was happy to see something atleast remotely Norteno related on the server (Paleto Bulldogs) and I was even happier to see that they kept their roleplay in Los Santos to a minimum, instead keeping to the countryside and outskirts of the city. Although, I've never complained about nothing original ever happening, in fact, I prefer to see factions that most people consider 'unoriginal', such as Sureno, Crip or Blood gangs that nobody's ever heard of, or 18th Street/MS-13 groups in various parts of the city. That kind of roleplay is more appealing to me than anything organized crime related.

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1 minute ago, Garras Up said:

Although, I've never complained about nothing original ever happening, in fact, I prefer to see factions that most people consider 'unoriginal', such as Sureno, Crip or Blood gangs that nobody's ever heard of, or 18th Street/MS-13 groups in various parts of the city. That kind of roleplay is more appealing to me than anything organized crime related.

You're an outlier in that regard, in my experience - most of the criticism I see of illegal organizations is that it tends to all be the same. You could easily substitute the name and ethnicity of one gang in for another without noticing much else different. I understand an argument for attempting to keep the illegal orgs on the server adhering to similar real-life counterparts, but my criticism of that argument is that filtering through which orgs to accept based on that criteria tends to result in functionally identical groups.

 

Even if we accept the argument that the yakuza doesn't have a street presence in California, I fail to see why players working to participate in a historically feasible concept have zero agency in the sorts of factions that exist on the server. We're not talking about a Batman-esque gang of face-painted clowns driving around in Speedos, here.

 

I think LCN is overdone, and poorly at that, but at the same time I wouldn't begrudge the faction of its right to exist. IFM has historically had a selective enforcement of that particular standard, to my great annoyance - but again, maybe that's changed. I'm just not going to put in the work to find out after having attempted to do so once before.

 

I suppose the core of my disagreement with IFM is that they look for a real life analog, whereas I believe players who work to build something that could plausibly exist should be permitted to continue.

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21 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

You're an outlier in that regard, in my experience - most of the criticism I see of illegal organizations is that it tends to all be the same. You could easily substitute the name and ethnicity of one gang in for another without noticing much else different. I understand an argument for attempting to keep the illegal orgs on the server adhering to similar real-life counterparts, but my criticism of that argument is that filtering through which orgs to accept based on that criteria tends to result in functionally identical groups.

 

I agree and disagree with that. Yeah, alot of SUR/Crip/MS/18/Blood gangs on this server act the same, that's what I agree with, but what I'll put out there aswell is that when portrayed properly, SUR gangs can be alot different to eachother, same with blood and crip gangs, the only thing they really have in common is their race. The reality is that most of those gangs are worlds different to eachother, but that's only reflected IC in some circumstances and some people don't really see the differences in Hispanic gangs & their various cultures.

 

21 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

Even if we accept the argument that the yakuza doesn't have a street presence in California, I fail to see why players working to participate in a historically feasible concept have zero agency in the sorts of factions that exist on the server. We're not talking about a Batman-esque gang of face-painted clowns driving around in Speedos, here.

 

ion think they shouldn't have agency to do it tbh. If a Yakuza fac popped up where they were doing Yakuza in the states related shit such as credit card fraud, identity fraud and other white collar type things, that'd be cool and i'd support that shit. Imagine running into a bunch of Jap dudes IC as an underage char and then finding out that they can get you fake ID's, passports and all kinds of shit, or another example would be a gang leader who wants to launder his or her money, the Yakuza could help with that aswell. It'd open shitloads of doors for roleplay, not only for the Yakuza faction, but for every faction they came into contact with.

 

But i wouldn't support it if they popped up trying to act like the Yakuza groups in Japan do. if they did that in LA? They simply wouldn't survive very long.  Especially if they tried to establish a street presence in K-Town for example, the issue I'd see with that is that Koreans despise the Japanese, infact when alot of Korean criminals spell the word 'Korea' in tattoos, writing or graffiti, they write 'Corea' instead, because the 'K' comes after J, and Koreans don't want to be below the Japanese. So if the Yakuza tried operating like they do in their homeland? pretty much be very easily messed over by either Hispanic gangs or by the Kkangpae and the Korean gangs that work under them.

 

It'd be the same if MS-13 started acting like the Mara gangs in El Salvador and stopped paying taxes to La eMe, they'd get destroyed. Bit of a shitty comparison but hey, it's the point im tryna make.

21 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

I think LCN is overdone, and poorly at that, but at the same time I wouldn't begrudge the faction of its right to exist. IFM has historically had a selective enforcement of that particular standard, to my great annoyance - but again, maybe that's changed. I'm just not going to put in the work to find out after having attempted to do so once before.

yeah i think it's overdone and poorly done most of the time aswell, but i still have nothing against them doing what they wanna do.

 

21 minutes ago, Smilesville said:

I suppose the core of my disagreement with IFM is that they look for a real life analog, whereas I believe players who work to build something that could plausibly exist should be permitted to continue.

I mean yeah I can see what ur saying, there's good and bad shit about the whole real-life california groups thing, but tbh i have such strong feelings about the matter because this was a serious issue on previous servers that I've played, you'd have a bunch of players for example portraying Southern California gangs, such as F13 or MS, then all of a sudden a random Norteno faction would pop up on the block next to them and try to start a war simply because 'Yall are SUR and we're NORTE', and half the times those groups not only don't fit in the environment they're rping in, but they ruined the vibes for all the other factions around them, that's mainly why I'm glad that IFM chooses to go off of real life when they accept factions, even though it means that certain concepts that might actually be cool to see would either be harder to get approved, or flat out denied.

 

Edited by Garras Up
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