Poll Set #1: Deathmatching (LEO); 911 hoax calls; masks in public

[Red Reika]

5 minutes ago, Frakkennewguy said:

3) While I don't think more OOC restrictions will be beneficial, I do think that the amount of mask use is absurd and should be curtailed ICly if possible. Including but not limited to mask use being counted as suspicious behaviour in and of its self, enough to justify a stop. Make it a calculated risk, avoid the opps but attract the cops.

This, basically. If we are going to waive the realism of masks off, at least we need to stop pretending that people posted up in all masks isn't suspicious. Because it is. A lot. 

[Howen]

I get the concern about turning this into a DM fest, but at the same time, this is a risk that should be considered IC by LEO. If cops know that a traffic stop could escalate, it forces them to be more strategic about when and where they pull people over, rather than blindly stopping cars anywhere on the map. It adds tension and fear to their roleplay, which is something that realistically exists. In real life, officers also have to evaluate risk before engaging, and if they suspect that the person they’re stopping might open fire, they have the option to call for backup.
 

Criminals should have more freedom in deciding how their characters react. If someone chooses to shoot in a clearly outnumbered situation and gets killed, a CK should apply as per the existing rules. That alone would prevent people from abusing this, since throwing your life away over a minor charge isn’t a good play unless it makes sense for the character.
 

Personally, I’ve seen how the current rule limits roleplay. A few months ago, I was involved in a traffic stop for an expired insurance and tinted windows. We expected some fines, but instead, the cop escalated by calling two extra units, including K9. We were armed due to an ongoing faction war, but we couldn’t react because shooting would’ve been considered poor escalation. As a result, we lost three people and important weapons, despite the fact that the situation could’ve gone differently if we had the option to act freely.
 

The argument that "every traffic stop will turn into a shootout" is a weak one. If someone plays unrealistically and engages in shootouts with no reason, they will be CK’d or even banned. That’s already a strong deterrent. What’s unfair is limiting every player just because some might abuse it. Let people have the option, and punish only those who fail to roleplay proper fear or escalate poorly.

[Red Reika]

Just now, Howen said:

I get the concern about turning this into a DM fest, but at the same time, this is a risk that should be considered IC by LEO. If cops know that a traffic stop could escalate, it forces them to be more strategic about when and where they pull people over, rather than blindly stopping cars anywhere on the map. It adds tension and fear to their roleplay, which is something that realistically exists. In real life, officers also have to evaluate risk before engaging, and if they suspect that the person they’re stopping might open fire, they have the option to call for backup.

See, I agree with that but at the same time, we'll go back to 10 cop cars lining up behind someone because you never know when a gun will be pulled. "Never enough backup" as well as "I'm just being safe". 

Comparing to real life is kind of bad, though. In game you are way more likely to be pulling over someone with a gun, ready to shoot you because they know they can than in real life. And the response to that will be cops crowding over every traffic stop and treating everyone like a Most Wanted. We've been there before and it was exactly like that.

[Frakkennewguy]

2 minutes ago, Red Reika said:

This, basically. If we are going to waive the realism of masks off, at least we need to stop pretending that people posted up in all masks isn't suspicious. Because it is. A lot. 

 

Exactly this. If I see a dude in rockford dressed like a crip with a mask on, that's RS for a stop.

 

3 minutes ago, Traveler said:

Let's keep in mind that according to the LFM directive that was posted like 2 months ago, cops can't terry frisk you during a traffic stop and that is considered as corruption, which prevents cops from doing it. So if a cop pulls over a gang member and does that while not having corrupt perms then he should be forum reported.

 

That's not actually how that works. You need RS to Terry somebody on any stop, if a cop has it they can do it, it's not corruption.
 

[NOTAGOON]

16 minutes ago, Stevefish said:

#3 - absolutely shouldn't be a rule against this, but at the same time I don't want to see an IFM/LFM directive saying we can't Terry frisks someone who is simply masked either if they're in the area near a crime

No reason why I can't wear a mask without having /maskname on, the rule shouldn't have had been made. I also believe that LEO's should be able to terry frisk people who are masked when near a crime. In reality, that's how it works.

[LAGhost]

I don't think we should be restricting the freedom of choice here.

But I will say a soft rule on the maskname thing could be helpful.

But in the end, it won't change much.

 

I'm indifferent about the DMing LEOs rule.

Naturally you're gonna have less fear on the game but decisions you make irl are on the spot or preplanned. Not everyone has to preplan shooting a cop, some people just do it on the spot cos they plainly don't give a f*ck.

 

Obviously less people do it because they dont want to face the death penalty.

But again we ain't that afraid since it's still a game

Edited April 2 by LAGhost

[Stevefish]

1 minute ago, NOTAGOON said:

No reason why I can't wear a mask without having /maskname on, the rule shouldn't have had been made. I also believe that LEO's should be able to terry frisk people who are masked when near a crime. In reality, that's how it works.

@Frakkennewguyexplained this concept the best IMO. If you're making up you're going to draw attention of police, but of course you'll be able to avoid the ops. Choose your poison, especially if you're in a public or "wealthier" area

[once upon a time in reality]

1) Will result in more cops getting shot for no reason, they already do, but this? Well, people already complain and cry about us being overpowered and abusing stuff. Well I hate to break this to you guys, but cops are going to react to the situation and environment they're in. That? That will be heavier militarization of police tactics and heavier presence for smaller stuff. People already cry about traffic stops having more than 1 cop car (2-3), well now there'll be 5+ showing up to a simple traffic stop. This is an example. You can introduce a rule change like this, but you can't cry wolf when LEOs react accordingly to the fact LS will go from Mexico crime rate to Baghdad Route Irish type warfare. 

 

2) Sure, IC is IC. Let hoax prank calls happen.

 

3) Not really in agreeance with this, sure there's a lot of mask wearers that are (M)s, but that's cuz there's a lot of Ms. And a lot of them are in gangs. IRL this happens. If anything? This takes RP away from me and others in the Senate, because we could do mask law - funny enough I am working on a bill to combat masks. This rule makes no sense.

[Boco]

"Yes, there should be a rule preventing people from sitting posted up masked for no reason whatsoever."

+1111111111111

[Airwalk]

1 minute ago, once upon a time in reality said:

3) Not really in agreeance with this, sure there's a lot of mask wearers that are (M)s, but that's cuz there's a lot of Ms. And a lot of them are in gangs. IRL this happens. If anything? This takes RP away from me and others in the Senate, because we could do mask law - funny enough I am working on a bill to combat masks. This rule makes no sense.

 

See, a mask law wouldn't be applicable in the game here. If you pull up to John McGangbanger who's running through Mirror Park at 3 PM broad daylight and do something about him wearing a mask, he's gonna kill you because you might find the gun he killed 16 people with and never bothered switching out. It opens a can of worms that's best kept closed.