Realism - thoughts.

[Jedai]

The standards of realism are objective, at least to most people it seems to be. The problem is that people are generally selective in what's objective to them. There is a reason we have things like a Roleplay Quality Team or Faction Management in place. It's the reason why faction leaders whether it be legal or illegal ensure people follow a certain mindset and standard of realism expected. Where that falls short can be with in the civilian sector of roleplay. For example, if you own 4 establishments and you work them yourself at all of them in order to keep the money to yourself rather than hiring employees and creating a brand to represent what most people would consider an Enterprise or a corporation at that point, the yes, at that point objectively you're not really being realistic and while you may be roleplaying fine towards your customers, the portrayal is still considered poor. If you have the money for multiple establishments which considering most businesses unless they are sure fire hits USUALLY spend years trying to recoup losses or pay off their business loans, why on earth would you not hire people and pay wages? 

 

These are the types of things I know people usually take exception to because it doesn't make sense. As @SaintBatemanofWallStreet said earlier in this thread. If you're ONLY roleplaying your status based off of the number in the top right corner of your screen, you're doing it wrong. 

[Vhah]

Look at your finances. Look at what your character actually does. Look at your character's association. Look at what they mean to be.

Does your character live in a relatively decent part of town, keep with a number of likeminded business folk, maintain good business ethics, and realistically make the money from his various jobs and investments to maintain multiple businesses? If so? Then cool, guess what, you're golden. We have people living in the ghetto with helicopters and high-end sports cars that they shouldn't realistically have the means to keep. Multiple people laugh off the insurance, which is the closest to a realistic representation of being able to afford your vehicle, and don't pay it because most of the time nothing comes from not having it so why be realistic about it.

 

Not namedropping, but I've seen people who just work a garage who have bragged about their MULTIPLE high end vehicles that you shouldn't be able to afford on a mechanic's salary, that no one has bat an eye at. If we're calling that acceptable, I have no idea why you owning two businesses when your character has been visibly seen ESTABLISHED in the working field. You work a RIDICULOUS amount of places, and I don't mean ridiculous in an RP sense I mean your character busts his ass to keep himself working. I see that as him doing all he can to maintain his lifestyle. I've only ever seen one of those places have a poor opening, and that was Shiraz. But that was ONE night.

TLDR: People usually complain because they have half the story, not the full story, otherwise a lot of characters on the server would be put under review because a LOT of us push 'realism' every day.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Vhah

[KV]

 

 

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, Tsarna said:

- If someone spends IG daily 10-12 hours, and someone 2-4 hours. Are they the same? Or if someone is 10 hours online a day, works for 8, and socializes 2 hours. Is that not good enough and not realistic RP, since he works too much? 

We can't spend all day every day in-game.  What we can do is convey to people what our characters do in their off time.  And so while you don't have to work for a solid 8 hours a day, it's safe to say if a character touts having a full-time job, they at the very least can RP the satisfaction, stress, exhaustion from such work.  If they work two jobs, they can add to that the mental juggling of schedules as well.  
 

 

4 hours ago, Tsarna said:

- Background story: I have given the impression, if I write my background story that I have a rich mommy and daddy, I can be rich, but if you come from a poor background and work your ass off in the server - it is not realistic for you to get a house/property...

Hate to break this to you but having a rich mommy and daddy background story isn't going to get someone a house any faster than being a hard-working individual who made something out of themselves from nothing.  What does matter is the overall portrayal of the character being played, quality of roleplay.  There's more at play here than just the numbers you see in the top right corner of your screen.

 

 

4 hours ago, Tsarna said:

- Is it realistic, that PD people "kill off their characters" by NC´ing (if they do something which usually ends with firing from the PD) and get the same rank afterwards with their new character name?

- Is it realistic, that PD people get injured, FD drives them into hospital, and they are seen one hour in the next scene?
- Is it realistic, that people can NC and keep their assets, and yet, they later are forbidden to claim something new, because "you character just started". Please delete the possibility to NC then and don´t let people use real life money to buy it?

I'm not going to touch on the PD issues with returning to the next scene here.  Keeping assets after a character dies and name-changes, what I will say on this is that while we allow it, the player does need to come up with a way to explain these.  I advise people if they're cking, they should try to get rid of player-specific assets such as cars.  At this point in time, we don't have any rule in place for assets post name change beyond the rule stating characters should be unique and not like your other characters.

 

 

4 hours ago, WolfieLULZ said:

I was stopped by KV once when I saw three massacro's (their owners were fishing). Me, myself was interested n' thought (Why not give it a try?) I was immediately stopped by KV for less charcter portraya but what about those people? They own the sea?

You stinker!  And at the end of the day, admins have a lot going on for them.  We try to juggle enforcing server rules, standards while also being players ourselves.  We can't watch over everything at once and so we have to go by what's reported to us on some matters.  I don't spend my off time when no reports are coming in to cruise around looking for sports-car fishermen.  I like to RP too. 

 

 

3 hours ago, eTaylor said:

Effect how people actually play the game, rather than focusing on controlling how people should play the game. You can’t put people in boxes, with over 300 players and thousands of sessions every week you can’t control and monitor every decision people make. If you don’t want people to roleplay rich don’t give them things to be rich with. You get somebody working their ass off for assets they can obtain only to go around and tell them they can’t buy it. It’s inconsistent enforcement and creates conflict that is entirely avoidable.

Enforcing quality and realism isn't just about money and assets, but the overall portrayal that comes with these, and the process by which people obtain their wealth.  Yes, a person can work two jobs.  But how much physical and mental stress comes along with that?  Owning a small business can be lucrative.  But in owning a business that runs and operates full time, it's going to be a 40-60 hour workweek in and of itself.  Obviously we don't expect people to actually work this.  We want people to portray it though in how it affects their characters emotionally, physically.  And yes, everyone can handle this differently, it is subjective to an extent.  But if a person doesn't show this at all?  Doesn't incorporate it into their character's demeanor and the story, then isn't it at that point just grinding for money at the top right of your screen?

[Tsarna]

3 minutes ago, Jedai said:

The standards of realism are objective, at least to most people it seems to be. The problem is that people are generally selective in what's objective to them. There is a reason we have things like a Roleplay Quality Team or Faction Management in place. It's the reason why faction leaders whether it be legal or illegal ensure people follow a certain mindset and standard of realism expected. Where that falls short can be with in the civilian sector of roleplay. For example, if you own 4 establishments and you work them yourself at all of them in order to keep the money to yourself rather than hiring employees and creating a brand to represent what most people would consider an Enterprise or a corporation at that point, the yes, at that point objectively you're not really being realistic and while you may be roleplaying fine towards your customers, the portrayal is still considered poor. If you have the money for multiple establishments which considering most businesses unless they are sure fire hits USUALLY spend years trying to recoup losses or pay off their business loans, why on earth would you not hire people and pay wages? 

 

These are the types of things I know people usually take exception to because it doesn't make sense. As @SaintBatemanofWallStreet said earlier in this thread. If you're ONLY roleplaying your status based off of the number in the top right corner of your screen, you're doing it wrong. 

Why are we talking only about the number on the right corner - where has this been an issue. Like I said - the number can be easily manipulated by just adding some rich parents into your background story. That is that number - dont care about it. 

I am talking about the subjectivity. How much people spend in this server of their life, how long will they even play one character, etc. We can not bend everything into the realm on Real Life. It is not.

Like Gambler said in his/hers thread: She applied for a house in Paleto and is working in Los Santos. They declined the request because Paleto is "realistically" hours and hundreds of miles away. But yet, then a cop needs to travel from Los Santos to Paleto, it will be there in five minutes. This is poor quality, isnt it?

[Memozzy]

I'll never understand why someone cares SO much about someone elses RP if it doesn't even involve you. I'm sorry but I don't care what some of you say about heavy RP server or w/e but yall need to chill and maybe take a break for a day or two if it tickles your pickle the wrong way so much.

 

At the end of the day if someone breaches a rule and / or has overly bad portrayal  then report them. Otherwise live and let live and have fun. 

 

As Donald Trump would say - "SAD!"

[Ministry]

If people took a step away from watching others, found them self a group to RP with and actually played the server for what it's intended for they would have a much better time.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Ministry

[Vhah]

Just now, Ministry said:

If people took a step away from watching others, found them self a group to RP with and actually played the server for what it's intended for. Much more people would have a good time.

/thread, 200% agree with this.

[Tsarna]

3 minutes ago, KV said:

Hate to break this to you but having a rich mommy and daddy background story isn't going to get someone a house any faster than being a hard-working individual who made something out of themselves from nothing.  What does matter is the overall portrayal of the character being played, quality of roleplay.  There's more at play here than just the numbers you see in the top right corner of your screen.

It was not about a house per say. It is more about acquiring assets, not only house. Someone with a rich background can always say, that he has four cars, because he has a well-off family background, and how is the Quality Team going to deny it? Alter his/hers background? 
If it came out as only about the new property applications, it was not meant only for that.

[SaintBatemanofWallStreet]

Just now, Ministry said:

If people took a step away from watching others, found them self a group to RP with and actually played the server for what it's intended for. Much more people would have a good time.

Very novel idea. I'll report back with the results.

[MasterChief]

I have to agree with people talking about focusing on your own RP and portrayal. If you focus on having a strong, detailed and realistic backstory for your character then you shouldn’t have an issue when someone feels the need to report you. They may not understand your backstory and only take things at face value from what they can see. If you have a realistic, justifiable reason for doing the things you do, you have nothing to worry about.

 

Working multiple owned businesses in the span of an 8-12 hour work day? No. Realistically you would have hired managers, owners or business partners to help manage this. You wouldn’t be a one man army running all your businesses. This is an example of a situation where you aren’t portraying your character correctly. 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Kestalas