Character Kills

[Davis]

CHARACTER KILLS AND ILLEGAL ROLE-PLAY

 

INTRODUCTION

 

Hey everyone, as the title states this post is going to centered around character kills. I want to open a dialogue between myself and the community to try and get a feel for what everyone thinks. This is obviously a controversial topic and opinions vary for different reasons, but regardless I think since we’re in the conception of our server it is better to bring it up now than later. I’ve already made two suggestions that include CK’s and one was forwarded, I have a few more applications in mind for CK’s and they all tie in with illegal role-play.

 

POLICE INFORMANTS

 

This is something that has always bothered me, especially during my four years in LSRP. In two of the factions I was a part of we had various people turn “rat” and spill info to the police to feed our casefile. Whatever reasons they had for it is beside the point, but one thing that bothered me was that out of five times I can recall we had killed all the rats one way or another and it stood only as a PK. This doesn’t make sense to me for a few reasons

 

First, becoming a police informant is no joke. Not only is your character instantly at risk, but you potentially can be that “nail in the coffin” of a great faction whom will shut down because of your actions. That’s a lot of power for one person to poses. People put years into factions and for someone to have a character that was around for maybe 1/8^th or less of the faction’s life bring it down makes no sense to me. Especially when you see people doing it majority of the time for OOC reasons. This leads me into my first suggested application of a CK.

 

1.      When and if your character turns witness/rat for the police or any government agency, your characters automatically eligible for a CK if the faction you are ratting on finds out and kills you. That means that, regardless if you signed an OOC CK clause or not, you are to be CK’d upon your characters death. Obviously, the faction must provide proof of how they know which will be kept between them and the FM team or handling admin.

To me, this is fair. If one player can take down a faction, then a faction should be able to permanently remove that player from the server.

 

NOTE: Proof will be required of your knowledge IC that someone is ratting.

 

MUDERING POLICE

 

This may come as a surprise to some of our PD friends but one thing that bothers me to the utmost is people going on rampages and killing cops in shootouts/busts or whatever. Regardless I think that both players in illegal role-play and police officers should be held accountable for the risks they put themselves at, so I suggest the following.

 

2.      During a shootout with police departments, if the player(s) kills an officer or federal law enforcement agent then a Character Kill Scenario is initiated. This would mean that whatever officers are killed will be CK’d and if the player is killed he will also be CK’d. If the player kills an officer and escapes, he will remain eligible to be killed by PD from that point on in any other scenario if he’s on that character. 

 

3.      Also, if you kill a police officer and surrender, the department has the right to CK jail your character for that crime instead of enacting the regular penal code.

 

My reasoning behind this is simple, I’ve seen more cops die in this game than I have in real life on the news. Criminals do not often kill police, especially not as much as in the past on LSRP or other role-play servers. It’s very serious to kill a cop and if your character is willing to take that chance, he needs a serious consequence to follow that decision.

 

INTERFACTION MURDERS

This one is the most important to me because I think that a single player needs to accept more consequence in illegal role-play. Looking back at the past most of you can probably think of a time when a member of a faction was killed by leadership and not forced to CK because there was no private message stating he accepted it. I’ve always thought that rule to be very much bullshit. Here’s what I suggest.

 

·         When a player joins any (official or unofficial) faction and role-plays with them for longer than one month they are automatically eligible per the faction leaders request to be CK’d by any other member of the faction. This means that they can order fellow faction members to CK you or they can do it themselves.

 

·         However, if the faction leaders have not explicitly OK’d this killing of your character IC, and someone murders you in the faction whom is not faction leadership, you will not be forced to CK.

NOTE: The above gives power only to the leaders to CK their members, and not vice versa.

The reason I give this power to only the faction leaders is not to protect them or anything along those lines, but to avoid players joining for a month for OOC reasons and then CKing off leaders to shut down factions. When it comes to members CKing faction leadership I do present the following suggestion.

 

·         Faction members may CK the faction leader(s) if they gain the IC support of at least 80% of active members in the faction. A player is considered a member after at least three months of active role-play within that faction.

What this will do is allow for coups to happen for a reason greater than just one person seeking power. I personally don’t agree with the realism of that scenario within a role-play setting. Everyone in every faction wants to have power and claiming you want to coup for that reason alone isn’t enough in my opinion, especially to warrant a CK. Whether an illegal faction is new or old, they should be considered dangerous by any single player. But like I say above, with the support of 80% of the faction, there is more cause because clearly the leader is unfit to rule ICly and a leadership change may be warranted.

 

NOTE: Proof will be required of all IC support for the coup. Proof will be required when CKing faction members on leaderships orders (both of the order itself and that the person has role-played in your faction for over month).

 

CONCLUSION

 

Alright, so most of you are probably thinking these are radical ideas but to be very honest illegal role-play is far too easy to exist in. Which to me is the root cause of the lack of civilian and legal role-play that I think we are missing out on. This system and series of suggestions makes it more difficult to survive in illegal role-play, but still makes it easy to enter it. I think that is a very fair trade off. There should be much more risk when it comes to illegal role-play and these scenarios make people think twice about actions that have serve outcomes on other players.

 

TLDR

·         Police informants are eligible to be Character Killed from the moment they start interacting with police, by their faction.

·         Murdering police officer’s results in a permenant state of CK eligibility between yourself and the police department. Meaning that both the murdered officers will be CK’d and you as a player will be CK’d if killed, or CK jailed if captured after killing an officer.

·         Leadership has full authority to order the CKs of their faction members for any given IC reason, after that member has participated in faction role-play for over a month.

·         Members can CK out leadership of their faction with the support of 80% of their faction’s member base. A player is considered a member after a month of role-playing with the faction.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Davis

[AceS|]

Nah, I don't agree with that at all with the Police part. The rest seems fine.

 

The police part shouldn't be a thing because at the end of the day it's a videogame and namechanges cost money, also people will be putting months and even years into their character development just to lose it all? Just ajail cop DM'ers, problem solved.

[Davis]

30 minutes ago, AceS| said:

Nah, I don't agree with that at all with the Police part. The rest seems fine.

 

The police part shouldn't be a thing because at the end of the day it's a videogame and namechanges cost money, also people will be putting months and even years into their character development just to lose it all? Just ajail cop DM'ers, problem solved.

Problem has never been DMers, it's how people shoot it out with cops to avoid being jailed. It's not really breaking a rule and it's hard to determine their true intentions with actual proof. And namechanges cost three US dollars, I don't really think that's a lot of money nor should you be getting CK'd to the point where those three dollars are adding up to a lot of money, if you are something is wrong.

[MalteseWolf]

I would not, personally, implement any sort of forced server-wide CK guidelines. Just like some people put a lot of work in developing a faction, some people put a lot of work in developing their character. It would not be fair to punish everyone for the reckless behaviour of a few with any set of arbitrary rules.

 

If a particular player gets into police shootouts or life threatening situations often without fear of death because it cannot be forced on him, they can be punished by admins for poor roleplay. 

 

Some factions clearly state that all joiners are eligible for CK and that is fair enough - since you want to join that faction. But trying to apply the same set of rules to everyone, particularly to cops dying in shootouts, is too harsh and restrictive imo.

Edited November 9, 2017 by MalteseWolf
Typos

[Skillspreez]

I totally don't agree to any of this, I want to be able to put a lot of time in developing my character and for it to not get CK'ed. Also, that wouldn't be fair how everyone only gets a one time opportunity and need to pay real money to get another character.

[Portz]

The first server I ever RPed on forced CK were a thing. You had to get permission from a Lead Admin and also had to had screenshots of the reasons you deemed this player CK worthy. These were mostly only for characters not part of your own faction, as you could CK your own as you pleased. No one had a problem with this being in place. I think in my whole career on that server I participated in the CK of one character. Forced CKs are not a big deal. If you think about it, it forces the players behind the character to think before they do. Knowing that there is a chance that their actions could lead them to their characters permanent death. This isn't that big of a deal when you consider on that same server I was talking about... A CK meant that character was gone. You couldn't name-change it... It was gone for good. They also had a cool thing at the Temple cemetery where it listed the names of all the characters that had been CKed. I think one of my characters may have been on that list.

 

I am for this. Even if I'm a victim of a CK. As long as after I get CKed I get to see the reasons why, how it was planned and how I slipped up and came to my demise.

 

Almost forgot... The people that were attempted to CK you, if killed by you or anybody associated with you were also automatically CKed. Actually created some intense moments.

[Nervous]

Right now the rules are the following (just so this suggestion debate does not lose time on it):

-Your faction leaders can CK you as soon as they have your permission, forum PM, or a message in your faction thread that states that any member who posts a screenshot on the thread gives his CK permission, etc..

That means you can already CK any player that might go to the police. We'll also make sure that the player has IC reasons to turn against your faction, and not OOC ones.

 

-The police can permanently arrest your character If you're jailed for an important amount of major charges, or multiple times with major charges. Specific rules still need to be written for this, we didn't need it yet and It can still wait a bit.

 

-The faction leader can be CK'd If 70% of the insiders approves it

[Orcaninja]

9 hours ago, Davis said:

Problem has never been DMers, it's how people shoot it out with cops to avoid being jailed. It's not really breaking a rule and it's hard to determine their true intentions with actual proof. And namechanges cost three US dollars, I don't really think that's a lot of money nor should you be getting CK'd to the point where those three dollars are adding up to a lot of money, if you are something is wrong.

To be fair, some cops (like irl) will shoot you first without cause. It's screwed up in that situation that you would need to CK for real self defense. 

[Davis]

57 minutes ago, Orcaninja said:

To be fair, some cops (like irl) will shoot you first without cause. It's screwed up in that situation that you would need to CK for real self defense. 

You're right and I agree, but you misunderstood my suggestion. The CK would only apply if the assailant engaged in shooting at police officers first, and only if he actually kills an officer. 

[Davis]

11 hours ago, Skillspreez said:

I totally don't agree to any of this, I want to be able to put a lot of time in developing my character and for it to not get CK'ed. Also, that wouldn't be fair how everyone only gets a one time opportunity and need to pay real money to get another character.

 

If money is a real issue, maybe concessions could made, that if your character is forced CK'd because of rules, then you are awarded a free name change for that that character to use at your discretion.

 

Couple people have mentioned above that it's not fair if they put work into developing a character, just to be CK'd. Well, I'd like to ask all of you who share that opinion; Why is it not fair? The actions that would lead to a forced CK like I suggested above would be dangerous and very risky actions. You should all be afraid to rat and lose your character, you should all be afraid to shoot at the police because they're the law and you should all be afraid of illegal organizations because they are dangerous. It's impossible to invoke a real sense of fear in this game without taking something away from the player, something valuable. That something is a character. If you don't want to lose it, don't take unnecessary or stupid risks. Think things out more clearly and don't be hasty.

 

I'm not trying to bash anyone with this reasoning for disagreeing, but to be honest, I think the reply of "Well we worked hard on our characters and it's not fair" is a childish response to a consequence that is deserved. 

 

Someone also mentioned it's just a game, and it is. It's a game that is rather competitive and definitely serious. As such, serious IC actions should have serious IC consequences. I'm not suggesting every time you die you will be CKing. This shouldn't be a regular thing for a player, it should be something he avoids getting himself into. That's the point of the rule change, to make a player seriously consider his actions before he acts. These rule changes leave plenty of room for players to PVP with each other over IC reasons and not lose a character. But it deters players from constantly taking extremely rash actions and then using a PK to get out of any serious consequence. 

Edited November 9, 2017 by Davis