Discussion: Businesses not RP'ing realistic item price points

[Raindance]

There's a rule stating business aren't allowed to give out free items, so in my opinion it would make sense to also have a rule defining the min and max prices business are allowed to sell their products for

Edited March 14, 2020 by Raindance

[Engelbert]

Well  first of all I believe it has to do something with the economy on the server. In comparison to reality, you are just adding one zero to every price out there. So if a beer infact cost 2.5$ you are paying 25 for it, because that's how it works. But of course, businesses, like bars, clubs etc etc, they are leased, so they have to pay the rent, which is generated by the entrance fee, simply because there is no guarantee people will actually roleplay and buy drinks. Also salaries right? If you make 4000$ per hour or even 800$, 25$ for a beer is quite reasonable and logical price. well it would be reasonable if you didn't have to pay 400 to 500 at the entrance, cause then a single nightlife trek through clubs can cost you a Tornado which is several thousands $ in the dealership. So of course if businesses keep their entrance fees which are also the main income for their respective owners, the prices for beverages and food should have the additional zero removed ie 25 = 2.5$ for a beer.

Edited March 14, 2020 by Engelbert

[Nervous]

 

 

Please read the last paragraph here before writing on this thread. Let's take the following example written on it : " A drink will be around $200 instead of $10 in a bar or night club."

The initial author is right : prices must be adapted to the economy. Business owners not doing it aren't properly following our economy continuity and it's their mistake.

 

Door fees will eventually be removed and if that's what it takes for people to follow the economy in their bar and nightclubs we'll do it soon.

Edited March 14, 2020 by Nervous

[Engelbert]

That's what I said didn't I? Everything has one more zero added to it, because that's how economy is set. The main issue I see here though is, that some people might just pay the entrance fee and never touch the bar, which is not really logical. That's what I was talking about.

[Giles]

1 hour ago, Nervous said:

 

 

Please read the last paragraph here before writing on this thread. Let's take the following example written on it : " A drink will be around $200 instead of $10 in a bar or night club."

The initial author is right : prices must be adapted to the economy. Business owners not doing it aren't properly following our economy continuity and it's their mistake.

 

Door fees will eventually be removed and if that's what it takes for people to follow the economy in their bar and nightclubs we'll do it soon.

????? I would definitely vote for doing that sooner than later. It’s not just bars and nightclubs either. Right now some people approach the economy as real world and others don’t. It’s very inconsistent and that’s a major part of the problem. This should be something that’s reinforced through announcements and such more often than other topics. 
 

As for the business bonus, I am not completely against that so long as people still RP their businesses properly. The issue comes in when the business bonus causes business owners to not care about their products at all, where even selling them at $1 would still result in profit because of the bonus. If you could apply the bonus without a door fee, that would be a great compromise with the stipulation the business should still run as if your profits come from your products, not the bonus.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Giles

[jcat]

if door fees were gotten rid of and products priced according to their relative value in relation to the server's economy, people would probably get used to things.  it would be like living in a city with currency like zimbabwe dollars, but people would get used to the numbers.  If businesses were held to profitability, things would eventually stabilize as products and services would reveal their true value, like how much players were willing to pay to get them.  Something about door fees though, they could be considered a fee for service.  The bar owner provides the bar and doesn't' force people to buy drinks, but there's a cover charge.  maybe the door fee could be the price of a two drink minimum or something.  the trouble is that food and drinks are not inherently valuable, since they're really just nonessential accessories to rp and have no important ingame effect.  It would be important for most people to rp like food and drink items are important.  Here's an example.  i use the smoking anim a lot, so cigs have a real ingame value to me.  maybe do the same with anims like beerhold, wineglasshold, and so on.  require the script item to do the anim.  if people are standing around in a bar not drinking, the bartender can say hey, are you going to buy something buddy?

 

here's an idea.  how about eliminating the business bonus and requiring businesses to be profitable on their own.  if a business is unprofitable, a business owner can get a grant or something from the city.  if the business fails to turn a profit in a real time month (maybe because the business is selling items below cost), then the city won't give the business owner another grant for that business.  the business owner has to get the funding on his own, by raising prices, paying staff less, etc., or the business fails.  This would hopefully motivate businesses to turn a profit relative to the economy of the server.

 

anyway, it's just an idea, i don't think i'm an expert.  the city grant would be there just to keep businesses from failing all at once since keeping something profitable isn't easy in an rp server.  too few customers, etc.  the grant would be contingent on being profitable at least some of the time, you know?

[DLimit]

The business bonus is solely designed to pay employees and cover other maintenance fees. I simply believe that players should be reported if they are not selling items in scale with the server economy. That's the solution.

[Giles]

12 minutes ago, DLimit said:

The business bonus is solely designed to pay employees and cover other maintenance fees. I simply believe that players should be reported if they are not selling items in scale with the server economy. That's the solution.

I completely agree that's part of the solution. However, not everyone believes this is an issue. Not everyone understands the whole GTAW economy vs real world economy discussion, as you can see by some people who posted in this thread. Some people have no issue with earning $500 an hour or more and items being as cheap as $4. We can't rely solely on the players to fix the issue by reporting business owners. I'm sure that's why it's gone on so long. Not everyone seems to understand why it hurts the economy's design.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Giles

[Ketamine Kowboy]

2 hours ago, Nervous said:

 

 

Please read the last paragraph here before writing on this thread. Let's take the following example written on it : " A drink will be around $200 instead of $10 in a bar or night club."

The initial author is right : prices must be adapted to the economy. Business owners not doing it aren't properly following our economy continuity and it's their mistake.

 

Door fees will eventually be removed and if that's what it takes for people to follow the economy in their bar and nightclubs we'll do it soon.

 

1 hour ago, Giles said:

????? I would definitely vote for doing that sooner than later. It’s not just bars and nightclubs either. Right now some people approach the economy as real world and others don’t. It’s very inconsistent and that’s a major part of the problem. This should be something that’s reinforced through announcements and such more often than other topics. 
 

As for the business bonus, I am not completely against that so long as people still RP their businesses properly. The issue comes in when the business bonus causes business owners to not care about their products at all, where even selling them at $1 would still result in profit because of the bonus. If you could apply the bonus without a door fee, that would be a great compromise with the stipulation the business should still run as if your profits come from your products, not the bonus.

Upon reading I guess I'll be removing my entry fee and instead opting for a more realistic profit margin when it comes to items being sold [Alchol, Food] and see how that goes. 

But as it stands currently, I do agree that entry fees are completely unrealistic, at least in the way they are handled. If you want paid entry get a bouncer outside who will take the payment before allowing people in.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Lmao

[Giles]

10 minutes ago, Lmao said:

Upon reading I guess I'll be removing my entry fee and instead opting for a more realistic profit margin when it comes to items being sold [Alchol, Food] and see how that goes. 

But as it stands currently, I do agree that entry fees are completely unrealistic, at least in the way they are handled. If you want paid entry get a bouncer outside who will take the payment before allowing people in.

I would wait until they make an official statement about it, unless you're okay without the business bonus as well. As I understand it, the bonus is only received if your entry fee is $200 or higher right now. I doubt they will do away with the business bonus completely. I could be wrong. As I said before, I'm not against the bonus as long as business owners are RP'ing running a proper business, keeping in mind product pricing and approaching profit margin as if products were the sole point of profit.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Giles