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Big_Smokes

The Police Department & You

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Midwest    11

Situational specific asides, Human Trafficking is a MAJOR crime targeted by Law Enforcement. Tens of millions of federal and state dollars in California alone go towards funding and operating Task Forces, Teams, and for Law Enforcement Agencies to bolster their ability to counter human trafficking. 

 

A off duty police officer in her situation, would be fired. Behind the scenes, we don't know if she reported it, but from what we know she possibly partook in hiding the operation, which is a crime and more than likely breaking department policy. Report em if you think this may be the case.

 

Even if it was reported, she was in no position to be gaining information from said person. Cops receive mandatory training covering a variety of topics and how to handle them if a they come across a situation, Human Trafficking is 100% one of those topics. Not to mention theres dozens of reasons a untrained cop interacting with a affiliate of the group could be a issue, both practically and legally. 

 

 

Edited by Midwest

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eTaylor    26
31 minutes ago, SULLI said:

Again, as stated before.. Did you speak to PD command or report for the role play quality? I don't see why it's being posted here. Obviously something like this would not be taken lightly within our faction but we don't watch every single members off duty role play. It's not possible. If you have a complaint regarding the role play realism and quality of an Officer, report it. As Smokey has said, his DM's are always open. I can tell you from experience, if this situation was found out ICly by command, that Officer would be severely punished unless they were a Detective performing their duties. 

 

You've got to remember, we are part of the biggest faction on this server with way too many members to keep tabs on at all times. So if you witness things like this, send it up the chain. Help them, help you. Icly or OOcly. We strive to keep role play quality levels high.

I'm sorry, but should it be the player's job to monitor and uphold the roleplay quality in PD or should your command team take care of that? It sounds like you're blaming other people for roleplay complaints on account of them not explicitly reporting it to your faction's hierarchy. If they don't explicitly report it, does that mean complaints that members in the community feel are valid are left unanswered or ignored? Of course it's not feasible to crack a whip at everyone's whim because someone is complaining on the forums, but if you're going to respond to complaints could do better than "did you report it". Because you're basically saying "yeah I sort of acknowledge your noise but take it somewhere else", it defeats the purpose of public discourse. 

 

It's not a matter of of punishing an officer IC or OOC either. I don't think anyone outside of PD genuinely cares what happens to an officer, I'd be more concerned about the roleplay culture. That every member of the faction logs on with the full realization that they have the power to completely destroy people if they neglect their roleplay. That they remain reasonably fair towards the people they interact with. And when I say fairness I don't mean that PD and criminals should be equal. But when you have officer that think it's perfectly acceptable to roleplay Narnia style gun rack systems that give them access to every single piece of equipment conceivable, you might want to look into that.

 

Members of the PD are players just as everyone else, they're not NPC's here to provide the server with roleplay. They deserve to be participants in the roleplay they enjoy, not just be the provider. But being in such a faction it's often the position you find yourself in, and if people get on with a bad attitude towards that you're going to get problems. I shouldn't have to run and file a report every time I don't agree with a member's roleplay, command should be picking these things up themselves and do everything they can to uphold a good roleplay culture. Bad cops are very easily recognized by their bad roleplay attitude, and the culture should exist where members regulate each other. That members are not afraid to confront each other bad performances or attitudes. And command should make sure people don't advance based on forum performance or OOC standing alone, but their merits as a roleplayer and what they contribute to the community as well.  

 

If you're a criminal you can't see the difference between the good cop and the bad cop unless you've roleplayed with them before, and I've had to many mixed experiences that I personally don't give PD a fair chance at all. And I agree that's hypocritical and bad on my part, but I have everything to loose if I run into the wrong member. And losing to the police isn't the part that creates the negative experience, @Mytrix can attest to that because the roleplay I had with him was great and I enjoyed it very much despite getting caught. But when I get pulled over I shouldn't have to check the member's name OOCly to gauge if I'm going to have an enjoyable roleplay experience, and decide if it's  worth sticking around for that. I should be able to expect enjoyable and fair roleplay from every member regardless of IC consequences.

 

And again, fairness doesn't mean equal playing ground in gun play or chases. A criminal should never be able to overthrow law enforcement by force alone. Fair roleplay to me just means a fair approach to the roleplay interaction, making sure it's not one sided. Making sure that I'm just as much of a participant as the other party. Because while the PD member is free to do as he or she pleases, I'm stuck with the roleplay. And if it's some stereotypical robocop brick wall with the character depth of a puddle of water, that experience can be excruciating. 

Quote

((Out of Character Improvements and Changes))
As you can read above, there have been a lot of changes from an IC perspective which shed a positive light on everyone that has worked to improve the faction so far. From an out of character perspective however, it is unfortunate that I cannot be equally positive - not because people have not been trying, but because we as a command team feel that we have to this point not done everything we could to improve our faction's image from an out of character stand point. Yes, we have done a lot, but there is always that one extra step we can take- which is what we have decided to start doing now.

 

I presume that most of you will have read or know of the GTA World forum thread ''Police Department & You''. Link for reference. As you can see, some players paint a decidedly negative picture of the faction - which is quite frankly disheartening, because none of us, from Police Officer I to Chief of Police, want to give people negative experiences when roleplaying with us, from an OOC perspective. Trust in this, however: I know that you put in the effort, I know that you try your best and I know those same challenges you face on a daily basis, because I face them too. Some people simply get upset because they've ''lost'' a situation while others have some very good points which is why we have been working on dealing with the issues brought up for the past two months now. I want to thank all of you who got involved in this thread for the amazing OOC attitude you've shown when engaging other players. It is and will always remain my intent to break the taboo of discussing the LSPD: It damn well should not be, because all of you put in the effort and work to deserve to be recognized equally part of the community as everyone else. But we will not be able to do that until we genuinely change people's minds and make them see us for what we are.

Don't just focus on an image or how to portray something, in-fact don't portray anything. Be what you want to be. People are always going to be negative,. And I'd say the majority of the PD are doing just fine by the way. As long as the core focus of the PD is to provide the best possible roleplay everything else should logically fall in line, that's just how I see it.

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Westen    147

I've seen a few comments in this thread that are saying that their cops should be roleplaying characters - they shouldn't be aggressive, hard to approach, robo-cop etc etc because they're not the mafia: "Every time you approach a cop they're very hostile. You have to remember when you're roleplaying a LEO that you're not in the mafia."

 

I've also seen a few other comments saying that these characters should also have their experiences roleplayed. Especially given recent events, these two are conflicting. Let me give you an example:

 

In the past week, whenever I have gone to Forum Drive, my character has been, or a cop has been shot at.

In the past week, whenever I have been on a traffic stop, my character has been shot at, run over or physically assaulted so the person can get out of a verbal warning for tinted windows.

In the past week, I have personally CKed two people.

 

So, given that in the past week or so my character has barely had a single positive interaction, they would not be happy nor approachable because they're thinking they're just going to get shot at or assaulted again.

 

Yesterday we had a Detective killed, an officer run over and three panic alarms:

 

My character going "step out of the car or I will arrest you" is not me being a robocop. That's my character not wanting to get brutally fucking murdered. My character not being lenient is not me being a robocop. That's my character not exercising officer discretion. My character arresting someone for something as minor as a suspended licence is not me being a robocop. That's my character being sick and fed up with people thinking they can get away with it.

 

Oh but this is rare? It's not.

https://streamable.com/p13vb

https://streamable.com/tfdy1

https://streamable.com/wd696

 

That's three I capped over the span of four days. It happens. Where do we draw the line?

 

Edited by Westen
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Tseard    30

You could always make an appointment with the department's psychologist to talk about these events. If you are literally 100 on edge and always behave like that because of these events, then that is an issue. 

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Westen    147
4 minutes ago, Invictus said:

 

Funny how all three links are a bad example of roleplay from their side. Especially the 1st one.

This happens a LOT though. In fact, I'd wager the majority of our situations end up as admin situations and then voided. Yesterday, we had three scenes in the span of 20 minutes. Of those 3 scenes, two turned into an admin sit, one person was banned and one scene was voided completely.

 

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SULLI    51
1 hour ago, eTaylor said:

I'm sorry, but should it be the player's job to monitor and uphold the roleplay quality in PD or should your command team take care of that? It sounds like you're blaming other people for roleplay complaints on account of them not explicitly reporting it to your faction's hierarchy. If they don't explicitly report it, does that mean complaints that members in the community feel are valid are left unanswered or ignored? Of course it's not feasible to crack a whip at everyone's whim because someone is complaining on the forums, but if you're going to respond to complaints could do better than "did you report it". Because you're basically saying "yeah I sort of acknowledge your noise but take it somewhere else", it defeats the purpose of public discourse. 

You cannot expect faction LEADERSHIP to magically know about everything, every member of the faction does. Even in regards to RP quality. It's not possible. They need to be informed. It's really, that simple. If I see a criminal, or civilian being a silly person, breaking rules or being unrealistic, I report it. You ALL have the same ability yet choose to come on here, take your little scenario and air it out to make the WHOLE of PD look bad. Because, most of the complaints aren't, "This certain person is doing this certain thing", it's mostly PD are robots and are bad role players. Take your dispute to server management, report those who are worthy of being reported. It IS a player's job to maintain their own levels or RP quality but come on.. you trust everyone on this server to do that? Have you seen some of the recent goings on? 

 

So, again, did you report it? I'm going to go ahead and take a guess that no one did. Every single faction I've dealt with has had people who's been below average in their RP. We witness bad RP and absolutely ridiculous situations every day we play the game. We also /report every, single, one. Most of which, get kicked or banned. I'm not here to disagree with you however, oh no. Myself personally, I judge RP standards in PD and even write about it in reports made for Officers, internally. There are checks in place, HOWEVER not everyone can be checked, constantly, at all times. Make an effort, bring it up to someone who can actually change it. 

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Valeriya    157

I would like to point out that LSPD is not as bad as it looks like.
I've always had a lot of interactions with the PD and they were always fair; Where nobody broke a single rule & both parties roleplayed accordingly and there was no robo-cop type of things.

Let's be honest, we are all humans and either us or the PD can slip sometimes, it's our nature, and I find totally unfair when I see someone arguing about their job when that person itself it's not doing any better.
Should I remind you guys that in before their acceptance, they have to go through a long process until they fully enroll, and even then, the time it takes for them to adjust themselves within the faction. But nobody cares about it, isn't it? They should be given their credits for all the effort they put in to become a police officer ( Hopefully we have people doing it ).
As human beings we are used to label someone when they fuck up once, yet we don't care how many times they did it right.
🤗
Keep it up, LSPD! 🙂

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pateuvasiliu    16
7 hours ago, Ronnie two poles said:

C. The worst part of the whole thing is the grammar and RP standards. I think legal roleplay in general should have a high standard of who gets in. A lot of people I've seen in LSPD especially have very very poor grammar. For example, I've seen people not use correct punctuation and just do silly /me's. I even seen someone do:

 

"Johnny_Cop says: ..." 


This is something really petty to be up in arms about. Hell it's not just petty, you're literally wrong.

 

I've been roleplaying for 7 years and ''...'' is used in plenty games with dialogue or just roleplay to show that the person is making a pause or is speechless. Yes, writing 3 paragraphs about how my character's sapphire orbs are interlocked with yours in an awkward stare would be more literary, but we're on a roleplay server that generally keeps posts short and doesn't engage in purple prose. Especially since we were in a small room with 10 other people, which makes the chat spam unbearable. So I  kept my posts short and sweet. This is a really silly thing to complain about.

 

And it is proper English. There's nothing wrong with it.

 

An ellipsis (plural ellipses; from the Ancient Greek: ἔλλειψις, élleipsis, 'omission' or 'falling short') is a series of dots (typically three, such as "…") that usually indicates an intentional omission of a word, sentence, or whole section from a text without altering its original meaning

 

In reported speech, the ellipsis is sometimes used to represent an intentional silence, perhaps indicating irritation, dismay, shock or disgust. This usage is more common amongst younger, Internet-savvy generations.[citation needed]

 

https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/50559/using-ellipsis-to-indicate-a-pause-in-conversation

Edited by pateuvasiliu

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eTaylor    26
7 hours ago, SULLI said:

You cannot expect faction LEADERSHIP to magically know about everything, every member of the faction does. Even in regards to RP quality. It's not possible. They need to be informed. It's really, that simple. If I see a criminal, or civilian being a silly person, breaking rules or being unrealistic, I report it. You ALL have the same ability yet choose to come on here, take your little scenario and air it out to make the WHOLE of PD look bad. Because, most of the complaints aren't, "This certain person is doing this certain thing", it's mostly PD are robots and are bad role players. Take your dispute to server management, report those who are worthy of being reported. It IS a player's job to maintain their own levels or RP quality but come on.. you trust everyone on this server to do that? Have you seen some of the recent goings on? 

 

So, again, did you report it? I'm going to go ahead and take a guess that no one did. Every single faction I've dealt with has had people who's been below average in their RP. We witness bad RP and absolutely ridiculous situations every day we play the game. We also /report every, single, one. Most of which, get kicked or banned. I'm not here to disagree with you however, oh no. Myself personally, I judge RP standards in PD and even write about it in reports made for Officers, internally. There are checks in place, HOWEVER not everyone can be checked, constantly, at all times. Make an effort, bring it up to someone who can actually change it. 

It's disappointing to see that you decided to respond to only an excerpt of everything I've posted. I whole-fully disagree with you on most of your standpoints. I'll reiterate for clarity, it isn't our job to regulate your faction. Of course I'm not suggestion leadership to be some Nihilanth knowing everything that happens, that's just not feasible. But just as real officers encounter people at their worst, typically during the most unpleasant scenarios, your members in-game encounter roleplayers of all types. Being in a law enforcement faction it's much easier for you to file reports on things you encounter because it's part of your routine, be it an In-Character report or an Out-Of-Character report. The majority of players don't. They don't log in to file a bunch of paperwork at the end of their roleplay, they're just here for the roleplay. 

 

I shouldn't be expected to police every roleplay encounter I have with the LSPD, I shouldn't have to monitor them or report everything I don't agree with. It's your faction leadership's job to guide, lead and properly teach their members how they should perform based on their own standards. Those standards should be standards they've created based on what is reasonable and expected for the server. Of course they can't micromanage everyone's roleplay, nor should they. But they should do everything they can to create systems that are efficiently used to not just promote but mandate what they consider proper roleplay. Whether this is during the training phases of new members, or throughout internal accountability and the ability to freely confront people on their roleplay. I fully believe the LSPD is more than capable to do this themselves, while maintaining open lines with the community. 

 

I don't consider it a significant issue, it's just something that should always be kept in mind since it's a huge responsibility for the LSPD. Law Enforcement factions for any server are typically the first thing people see, so they represent GTAW as well. It should be a topic for discussion on an open forum, and those participating shouldn't be told to be quiet and take it to reports held behind closed doors. And keep in mind that I am not painting PD in a bad light. But simply saying "if you don't file specific reports you don't count" is counteractive to @Big_Smokes's original post and the purpose of this thread. Which is to look for avenues to improve on the LSPD's faction core values, the interaction amongst it's members and it's interaction with the public in game. I feel like the following excerpt is pretty clear on my standpoint:

8 hours ago, eTaylor said:

It's not a matter of of punishing an officer IC or OOC either. I don't think anyone outside of PD genuinely cares what happens to an officer, I'd be more concerned about the roleplay culture. That every member of the faction logs on with the full realization that they have the power to completely destroy people if they neglect their roleplay. That they remain reasonably fair towards the people they interact with. And when I say fairness I don't mean that PD and criminals should be equal. But when you have officer that think it's perfectly acceptable to roleplay Narnia style gun rack systems that give them access to every single piece of equipment conceivable, you might want to look into that.

 

Members of the PD are players just as everyone else, they're not NPC's here to provide the server with roleplay. They deserve to be participants in the roleplay they enjoy, not just be the provider. But being in such a faction it's often the position you find yourself in, and if people get on with a bad attitude towards that you're going to get problems. I shouldn't have to run and file a report every time I don't agree with a member's roleplay, command should be picking these things up themselves and do everything they can to uphold a good roleplay culture. Bad cops are very easily recognized by their bad roleplay attitude, and the culture should exist where members regulate each other. That members are not afraid to confront each other bad performances or attitudes. And command should make sure people don't advance based on forum performance or OOC standing alone, but their merits as a roleplayer and what they contribute to the community as well.  

 

If you're a criminal you can't see the difference between the good cop and the bad cop unless you've roleplayed with them before, and I've had to many mixed experiences that I personally don't give PD a fair chance at all. And I agree that's hypocritical and bad on my part, but I have everything to loose if I run into the wrong member. And losing to the police isn't the part that creates the negative experience, @Mytrix can attest to that because the roleplay I had with him was great and I enjoyed it very much despite getting caught. But when I get pulled over I shouldn't have to check the member's name OOCly to gauge if I'm going to have an enjoyable roleplay experience, and decide if it's  worth sticking around for that. I should be able to expect enjoyable and fair roleplay from every member regardless of IC consequences.

 

And again, fairness doesn't mean equal playing ground in gun play or chases. A criminal should never be able to overthrow law enforcement by force alone. Fair roleplay to me just means a fair approach to the roleplay interaction, making sure it's not one sided. Making sure that I'm just as much of a participant as the other party. Because while the PD member is free to do as he or she pleases, I'm stuck with the roleplay. And if it's some stereotypical robocop brick wall with the character depth of a puddle of water, that experience can be excruciating. 

 

Moving on...

 

8 hours ago, Westen said:

I've seen a few comments in this thread that are saying that their cops should be roleplaying characters - they shouldn't be aggressive, hard to approach, robo-cop etc etc because they're not the mafia: "Every time you approach a cop they're very hostile. You have to remember when you're roleplaying a LEO that you're not in the mafia."

 

I've also seen a few other comments saying that these characters should also have their experiences roleplayed. Especially given recent events, these two are conflicting. Let me give you an example:

  

In the past week, whenever I have gone to Forum Drive, my character has been, or a cop has been shot at.

In the past week, whenever I have been on a traffic stop, my character has been shot at, run over or physically assaulted so the person can get out of a verbal warning for tinted windows.

 In the past week, I have personally CKed two people.

 

So, given that in the past week or so my character has barely had a single positive interaction, they would not be happy nor approachable because they're thinking they're just going to get shot at or assaulted again.

 

Yesterday we had a Detective killed, an officer run over and three panic alarms:

 

My character going "step out of the car or I will arrest you" is not me being a robocop. That's my character not wanting to get brutally fucking murdered. My character not being lenient is not me being a robocop. That's my character not exercising officer discretion. My character arresting someone for something as minor as a suspended licence is not me being a robocop. That's my character being sick and fed up with people thinking they can get away with it.

 

Oh but this is rare? It's not.

https://streamable.com/p13vb

https://streamable.com/tfdy1

https://streamable.com/wd696

 

That's three I capped over the span of four days. It happens. Where do we draw the line?

 

People telling you how you should roleplay as a character is just stupid. You have your character, and he or she is an officer with the LSPD. Being a cop doesn't necessarily define your character, nor should it. What defines your character is the way you've decided to develop it, and subsequently express that development to the outside through roleplay. Your character is your character, and you're the one who decides what you do with it. Being a cop doesn't mean you're a "yes sir, yes ma'am" and operate with a customer service attitude. Most cops I know are bitter unapproachable assholes to everyone that doesn't belong to their group, especially in their line of work.

 

Not every officer is the ideal public relations poster boy, it's dirty gritty work and the people who work it reflect that. If you fuck around and act all stupid you're not gonna get a pat on the back, you're gonna get told to fuck off real quick. That's how that works. Of course that's not a license to go overboard with it, but even then it's entirely In-Character and up to the person behind the roleplay. So what if a cop is a complete asshole. There are plenty of other cops who roleplay anything from a sweet and puppy-eyed boot to a hardened veteran who doesn't waste their time with bullshit. Cops shouldn't be carbon copies of the handbook, nobody wants that. They should always be free to develop their character how they please, and continue to develop it through their IC career in their department.

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