The Police Department & You

[Sam2]

17 minutes ago, Medak said:

Would be nice if LEO's could implement an actual person to be a dispatcher, so you actually talk with a person when you call 911. Aids to the RP and you can always forward the call to the script we already have now if there's no one at the moment to be a dispatcher.

We tried that. It just doesn't work well, unfortunately. It's actually a very hard thing to build around because you need one to be available with regularity, you need enough people to cover everything, there's a lot to keep track of and there's minimal CAD to support you. 

 

We had it once, and it was an information and work overload for the people trying to do it and the people trying to train people to do it. Would it be cool if it could work? Yes. Does it work in the video game? Unfortunately not. 

[Luna]

There are some things that I'm concerned about. One of them if something that I've found out through several roleplay encounters on the servers.

It goes something like this:

 

Quote

"it's not about policing the server, it's about providing quality rp"

 

Sometimes it's rephrased and put out like this: (Quote from a PD HC member)

Quote

"Can you really ask us to fuck up someone's character while you get to leave and move on?"

 

They both highlight examples of a trend. It's how a lot of officers don't want to fine, detain or arrest a suspect, even when there is more then enough probable cause or evidence to do such a thing and it's honestly exhausting. It's exhausting when you're dealing with an opposing party that has caused your character trouble and it's even more frustrating when it's impacting your character development. That goes from both the suspect and the victims side of the coin. I've been in instances where my character would engage in petty 'civilian' crime/incidents where I wanted to be detained, spoken to, create some kind of (criminal) record and yet various officers always seem to find an excuse to be overly nice.

 

I understand that the faction is concerned about being viewed as too harsh or too much policing the server vs operating as a law enforcement party with it's own restrictions, but lately the 'friendliness' has become a new stereotype. It's nice not to have robotcops, but you aren't welfare workers either. Please allow those who wish to roleplay low level criminal roleplay to be included in the justice side of roleplay as well, instead of having all employees mutually exclude us. I don't know if it's a policy (as it seemed from that HC members comment) or if it's something that all members choose to do because arresting is too much work or other motivations, but it's becoming increasingly frustrating. The Sheriff's department seems to have a more solid mix of members who're on both sides of the coin, it would be good if the PD looked more closely into this issue and started to resolve and balance it out.

 

---

 

The other issue that I wanted to bring up is this. It's not something problematic for myself, as I've no intention of joining the faction at this time, but it does impact quite a lot of others. The recruitment runs in the PD are currently open for a very short period of time due to a high interest / lack of available slots ratio. This, I understand. However it doesn't help when a single member has 3 characters in the faction and thus taking up 3 slots. I understand that a HC member might want a lower ranked character, but having a HC member with 3 characters is a bit too much. It would be great if legal faction management would step in and restrict it to 2 characters for HC+ members only, because these slots are being taken from other players that now have no chance to of joining.

 

 

 

There are also HC commands with two members in command positions. For example HC and C. That doesn't sound right either. Often the argument is that having a high ranked character on the street is unrealistic. This isn't necessarily true, as can be seen in the photo below of the Chief of Police from Los Angeles being part of the riot control team:

 

 

Having said that, I think that those in HC+ with an alternative character should be restricted to non-command positions, to ensure an equal balance in the command+ leadership team of the PD/SD and to guarantee that they aren't unfairly taking in room for promotion from other faction members. (Also one can question how unique all the separate characters are if they are all in such similar positions within the same work-field. Which brings along a whole range of other questions around the danger of unaware metagaming and other concerns, that I won't go into here.)

Edited June 7, 2020 by BinaryRun

[SpartanofSparta]

2 hours ago, BinaryRun said:

The other issue that I wanted to bring up is this. It's not something problematic for myself, as I've no intention of joining the faction at this time, but it does impact quite a lot of others. The recruitment runs in the PD are currently open for a very short period of time due to a high interest / lack of available slots ratio. This, I understand. However it doesn't help when a single member has 3 characters in the faction and thus taking up 3 slots. I understand that a HC member might want a lower ranked character, but having a HC member with 3 characters is a bit too much. It would be great if legal faction management would step in and restrict it to 2 characters for HC+ members only, because these slots are being taken from other players that now have no chance to of joining.

I'm going to jump in here and address this point, as I'm the head of recruitment for the LSPD. These slots you reference here are nothing to do with the slots that we can accept new members. The Police Department has no 'maximum slots' per-say, they just have a maximum capacity on how many people we can train at once and not have people getting frustrated, left behind or our training officers overwhelmed once you enter the faction. We called them field training billets. Command members having alt characters have completely no effect on these; it would only have an effect if said alt was a Field Training Officer, which would actually increase capacity.

 

 

[Luna]

@SpartanofSpartaThanks for the clarification, that's very helpful. I guess the only issues that remain on that subject are the (possible) unbalance in the command team due to so many duel accounts as well as some other justification concerns for having a large amount of characters within a single faction.

[Cascade]

49 minutes ago, BinaryRun said:

@SpartanofSpartaThanks for the clarification, that's very helpful. I guess the only issues that remain on that subject are the (possible) unbalance in the command team due to so many duel accounts as well as some other justification concerns for having a large amount of characters within a single faction.

I think I can speak for myself in terms of why I have three characters. My top two ranking characters I barely play. McGill is a Deputy Chief and I do bring her out for community based things like the food festival the other day and the racing award ceremony which was really fun! She's done her time on the streets and though there if needed, not realistic to have her out and about as a 50 year old woman doing her thing.

 

Chang is my L-T if there is no one to jump in that position to command the watch when I want to play. Most the time there is a full time LT+ so she rarely gets played. 

 

Alvarez is my character I do play on, roleplay on and off duty on and have a good rp relationship with. She's a detective, I do my detective things on her and is the one you will see out on the field.   Being in the upper end of the PD can be really time consuming and at times can be stressful. Without an actual character like Alvarez, I would struggle. Also I have friends I love Rping with that I can't anymore without having this character because it wouldn't be realistic. 

 

 

All in all, I take up 0 slots for anyone but my Deputy Chief slot. Even so much I have left positions like the head of K9 which I love,  to make opportunities for everyone else. We make sure alts don't take slots. 

So in conclusion, McGill is my Staff character that I don't get to roleplay with as much as I would like because of her position, Chang is there in case we don't have the proper people online and a very specific role needs to be filled and Alvarez is my day to day roleplaying character. None take any slots but McGill as a Deputy Chief and head of PTB. 

Edited June 7, 2020 by Cascade

[Luna]

I can completely understand your thought process when it comes to McGill and and Alvarez, but in your specific instance, I would be in favor of removing Anna. Having been in the PD on LS:RP, I understand why having a command member overseeing the watch is important, but a high command member can do that just as well. Yes, it's perhaps not common for your character to do so, but solving an IC issue through creating an extra command character doesn't sound like the heavy RP solution.

[Cascade]

10 minutes ago, BinaryRun said:

I can completely understand your thought process when it comes to McGill and and Alvarez, but in your specific instance, I would be in favor of removing Anna. Having been in the PD on LS:RP, I understand why having a command member overseeing the watch is important, but a high command member can do that just as well. Yes, it's perhaps not common for your character to do so, but solving an IC issue through creating an extra command character doesn't sound like the heavy RP solution.

Again not something McGill should be doing. When the time comes and we have the structure and people in those positions I will at some point likely drop Hannah but she affects no one being there really. I'm also very particular about having my characters do things that make sense. I enjoy Crisis Negotiations. Something I do use Chang for, something Alvarez certainly wouldn't suit due to her nature and line of work. 

Also that photo you used, I believe Chief Michel Moore was addressing the crowd for a more of a community based political move but not actually involved in the front line policing methods of the riot lines in LA. That's expected and happens a lot, Would be no reason why a chief or Deputy Chief wouldn't do a similar sort of thing in LS.  

Edited June 7, 2020 by Cascade

[Estes]

Lol, Staff Officers/Command Officers don't patrol the streets IRL.

Edited June 7, 2020 by Estes

[Canadian]

38 minutes ago, BinaryRun said:

I can completely understand your thought process when it comes to McGill and and Alvarez, but in your specific instance, I would be in favor of removing Anna. Having been in the PD on LS:RP, I understand why having a command member overseeing the watch is important, but a high command member can do that just as well. Yes, it's perhaps not common for your character to do so, but solving an IC issue through creating an extra command character doesn't sound like the heavy RP solution.

PD on LSRP is not the same as PD on GTAW. In fact, the roleplay standards in general on LSRP are much lower than here. We do things differently so your past experience isn't relevant frankly.

 

Unfortunately, this isn't real life so we have to make OOC sacrifices. As for the alts situation, let's look at the possibilities:

• Have STAFF Officers out on patrol not responding to any calls and doing nothing for the roleplay of the server. (Doesn't help anything, driving in circles does nothing to contribute to the server, the department. Useless.)
• Have STAFF Officers out on patrol and acting as a Watch Lieutenant/Captain overseeing the supervisors and patrol. (Unrealistic. Was done in the past, see Dakota Eastwood being kidnapped on a weekly basis out on patrol as Chief.)
• Have STAFF Officers not out on patrol at all with no alternate characters. (The higher you advance in the department the less you get to actually contribute?)
• Allow STAFF Officers alternate characters for patrol. (I don't see any downsides other than having multiple characters to maintain.)

 

I've seen no reason to change our alts system. I've not seen you provide any reason to change it other than you don't like it despite never having any experience with it. Having realistic ranks out on patrol isn't an IC issue, it's a portrayal issue. The Heavy RP solution isn't to have 50-60 year old men out on patrol because we can't have alts and still like to enjoy our time on the server just as much as any other faction member. Realistically, my character would have paperwork to do and is almost simply a political character. There isn't that type of work to do in-game. 

Edited June 7, 2020 by FullyCanadian

[Big_Smokes]

4 hours ago, BinaryRun said:

There are some things that I'm concerned about. One of them if something that I've found out through several roleplay encounters on the servers.

It goes something like this:

 

 

Sometimes it's rephrased and put out like this: (Quote from a PD HC member)

 

They both highlight examples of a trend. It's how a lot of officers don't want to fine, detain or arrest a suspect, even when there is more then enough probable cause or evidence to do such a thing and it's honestly exhausting. It's exhausting when you're dealing with an opposing party that has caused your character trouble and it's even more frustrating when it's impacting your character development. That goes from both the suspect and the victims side of the coin. I've been in instances where my character would engage in petty 'civilian' crime/incidents where I wanted to be detained, spoken to, create some kind of (criminal) record and yet various officers always seem to find an excuse to be overly nice.

 

I understand that the faction is concerned about being viewed as too harsh or too much policing the server vs operating as a law enforcement party with it's own restrictions, but lately the 'friendliness' has become a new stereotype. It's nice not to have robotcops, but you aren't welfare workers either. Please allow those who wish to roleplay low level criminal roleplay to be included in the justice side of roleplay as well, instead of having all employees mutually exclude us. I don't know if it's a policy (as it seemed from that HC members comment) or if it's something that all members choose to do because arresting is too much work or other motivations, but it's becoming increasingly frustrating. The Sheriff's department seems to have a more solid mix of members who're on both sides of the coin, it would be good if the PD looked more closely into this issue and started to resolve and balance it out.

 

---

 

The other issue that I wanted to bring up is this. It's not something problematic for myself, as I've no intention of joining the faction at this time, but it does impact quite a lot of others. The recruitment runs in the PD are currently open for a very short period of time due to a high interest / lack of available slots ratio. This, I understand. However it doesn't help when a single member has 3 characters in the faction and thus taking up 3 slots. I understand that a HC member might want a lower ranked character, but having a HC member with 3 characters is a bit too much. It would be great if legal faction management would step in and restrict it to 2 characters for HC+ members only, because these slots are being taken from other players that now have no chance to of joining.

 

 

 

There are also HC commands with two members in command positions. For example HC and C. That doesn't sound right either. Often the argument is that having a high ranked character on the street is unrealistic. This isn't necessarily true, as can be seen in the photo below of the Chief of Police from Los Angeles being part of the riot control team:

 

 

Having said that, I think that those in HC+ with an alternative character should be restricted to non-command positions, to ensure an equal balance in the command+ leadership team of the PD/SD and to guarantee that they aren't unfairly taking in room for promotion from other faction members. (Also one can question how unique all the separate characters are if they are all in such similar positions within the same work-field. Which brings along a whole range of other questions around the danger of unaware metagaming and other concerns, that I won't go into here.)

 

You quoted me, because I said that it was unfair to expect someone else's character to be ruined when you're not willing to CK yourself. That was me explaining the fact that there are rules here (as I told you, that you can find in the penal code) that we are not allowed to use certain charges if you do not CK. The penal code is not maintained by the LSPD, it is maintained by the JSA. There is nothing I can do about that and quite frankly I don't want to, because I (personally) like the way it has been set up and as I believe so does the rest of the community. Or well, at least the part of it that I represent.

 

My faction the LSPD has community policing as it's main focus, therefore officers are trained and encouraged to be courteous and professional to their peers. Roozles, the rest of my staff team, the entire faction and myself have only recently changed into our current form. It's a new chapter for law enforcement factions in general and a positive change. I don't know how my faction members giving people the common courtesy OOC makes you believe that there is some sort of exclusion for petty criminals and that they are no longer being targeted just like anyone else, that couldn't be further from the truth.

 

''Having said that, I think that those in HC+ with an alternative character should be restricted to non-command positions, to ensure an equal balance in the command+ leadership team of the PD/SD and to guarantee that they aren't unfairly taking in room for promotion from other faction members. (Also one can question how unique all the separate characters are if they are all in such similar positions within the same work-field. Which brings along a whole range of other questions around the danger of unaware metagaming and other concerns, that I won't go into here.)''

 

Once more, as already explained, my faction doesn't have a finite number of slots. My staff officers can have two alt characters, command officers and select supervisors in specific divisions such as IAG get an alt character as well. The dangers of ''metagaming'' and all the aforementioned were discussed thoroughly and dealt with a long time ago. We've had these alt characters for the better part of two years now.

 

The main reason for that is though yes, it may be that my character the chief of police can turn up at situations every now and then, there is no reason for him to turn up everywhere like he's some sort of patrol cop. Why should I be restricted from roleplaying a law enforcement officer at the ground level because I'm the faction leader? There is absolutely no logic in that. I joined this faction because I want to enjoy roleplaying a law enforcement officer at the ground level, not to be some guy who gets to make all the decisions but have none of the fun. It makes no sense from a realistic standpoint for any of my deputy chiefs to start rolling around davis with M4's and join SWAT teams like what happened on a certain other community some of us played on.

 

Further more, we create billets specifically for alt characters and have platoons/divisions/patrols dedicated to housing alt characters to ensure exactly that there is no opportunity for an alt character anywhere to block the progression of somebody's main character. Our system was well thought out to include those alt characters because the last thing we want is to hold people back because someone at the very top has that position. My staff officers, and by that I mean literally all of them including myself, have had to sacrifice teams/divisions/bureaus of which they had been in command for a long time and liked doing just because they were making the step up to Staff Officer. My faction does not run on nepotism nor do we allow people to hold multiple high ranking billets (unless necessary), regardless of their highest ranking character, because we want (newer) people to be able to progress into those positions.

 

''The recruitment runs in the PD are currently open for a very short period of time due to a high interest / lack of available slots ratio.''

 

As was stated before, this isn't the case. We are just recruiting people in waves because we don't want to over saturate the faction with new people while we don't have the capacity to properly train them and give them a good starting experience as a law enforcement officer. Every step of the way when it comes to making these decisions such as getting multiple alts, it has been cleared with legal FM. Me and my handler @Selena and the head of Legal FM @SpawnMatrix are in constant contact about major changes that have an affect on my faction or on the wider community and have been so for the last 2 years in Spawn's case.

 

Your view on our faction seems like you think we're a 1:1 copy from that other community. I promise you that many things here are different, the community, the script, you name it. Considering we have spoken on discord before, you are more then welcome to message me if you actually have questions about the inner workings of my faction, because I am more then happy to answer any questions you have.

 

 

Edited June 7, 2020 by Big_Smokes