The Police Department & You

[Jedai]

Just now, Dynamite! said:

You literally don’t have the right to search someone for no reason though, in real life you’d be fired lmao. These cops have no fucking idea how America works.

 

How does America work then. I'm curious because I've seen this argument tossed around that cops "Don't know how America works". I'm keenly interested in seeing from your point of view how America works. 

 

I would also openly like to ask people what they want cops to do in regards to these gang areas because the last few pages so far from what I've seen has been blue man bad. Tan man also bad but nowhere as bad as blue man. 

 

I have, as an American citizen living in an area that while not as dangerous as South Central Los Angeles, still is riddled with petty crime and gang violence, have seen my local Police Department, the largest American Police department in the world by the way, ACTIVELY have patrol and undercover units in areas that most of you would deem "dangerous" and "unrealistic for Police to be". 

 

So really do you want...the cops to just drive through once, wait for a 911 call > Have a 50/50 chance of actually arriving on time and rinse and repeat? Cause if people were roleplaying in the hood realistically, most people are brought in a no snitch culture and usually if someone calls 911 and people find out, that person is just going to end up dead. So it turns into a endless cycle of dead witnesses and gang members who go around killing each other looting guns off of each other's bodies like a battle royal and then proceeding to then use said gun that has 5-10 bodies on it continuously until finally the Police put it in an evidence locker and then it turns into cold case simulator where these guns never actually get matched to ANY murders. So really it's just a DM simulator under the guise of roleplay in South Central.  

[Sebz]

My reply to those who are greatly concerned about the police presence in the hood: Don't shit where you sleep. It's the cardinal rule of crime. If your faction rolls to a halt simply because of the presence of police, you probably aren't doing it right.

[why so]

10 minutes ago, Dynamite! said:

You literally don’t have the right to search someone for no reason though, in real life you’d be fired lmao. These cops have no fucking idea how America works.

You're implying police officers get away with 'randomly' searching individuals cannot be held accountable because this is a game, which is not the case. The faction has an Internal Affairs Group which you can submit personnel complaint to, although I acknowledge a gang banger isn't going to walk down to a police station to submit a complaint on a police officer. Alternatively, the server has a fully functioning judicial system where you can contest the legality of a search. But the simple truth is that reasonable suspicion is a very easy standard to satisfy and many officers can often come with one on the spot.

 

To put this into context. I find it stupid to shoot a cop because you had two grams of marijuana and an illegal firearm in your possession. This is something that you get very little jail time for (relative to other more 'serious' crimes). Notice that I said it's stupid, not unrealistic. Why? Simply because there are some especially dumb gang bangers in real life that do not think about the consequences of their actions.  They would rather much try to shoot their way out of the situation. However, you cannot blame the other parties for the decisions you decide to make. On the other hand, some gang bangers would rather choose to be arrested with the two grams of marijuana and illegal firearm, then challenge the legality of the search with the help of a lawyer (public defender, usually) at a court of law, which most of the time they don't and just end up actually pleading guilty. Gang members or suspected affiliates are more likely to get searched and/or arrested. This is true in real life as well. To no one's surprise, gang members often live in areas of poor socio-economic status riddled with violent crimes. They cannot afford to hire a good lawyer to contest charges when the need arises, so they end up pleading guilty to the charges. In that case that someone tries to contest the charge(s), there's a reason why the prison was implemented or if you're lucky enough, then you might be released on bond. All in all, I feel like this is an in-character concern at its core.

 

I'll finish this by saying that I understand getting harassed and searched by the police 24/7 is not fun and roleplay between both sides should be beyond just frisking gang members and getting into shootouts with them. Both sides should try and level with each other from an out-of-character perspective to provide enjoyable roleplay for both parties. I won't say this goes for all gang roleplayers or try to generalize this as there are some pretty decent ones, but most gang roleplayers who you try to approach or interact with will instantly hit you with "fuck off pig" classic. 

[Exploits]

1 hour ago, whowouldwin said:

Their OOC job is to play good police and good policing is preventing crime.

 

[arrdef]

The slogan "it's about providing quality roleplay" is an absolutely idiotic meme taken from lsrp, and ascended into a cult used to suppress any and all minority opinions. I don't think anyone who posts on this thread needs to be educated on what "roleplay" means. It's pointless rhetoric.

 

 

This is the LAPD in South Los Angeles.

 

This scene is a LAPD crime suppression patrol searching 5 people after seeing a gun inside the vehicle they were in. Standards for searches and seizure in america are not hard to reach.  The LSPD showing conspicuous presence in South L.S is realistic, and they should not be told to "go away from South LS".

Edited April 19, 2020 by arrdef

[Dynamite!]

1 minute ago, arrdef said:

The slogan "it's about providing quality roleplay" is an absolutely idiotic meme taken from lsrp, and ascended into a cult used to suppress any and all minority opinions. I don't think anyone who posts on this thread needs to be educated on what "roleplay" means. It's pointless rhetoric.

 

 

This is the LAPD in South Los Angeles.

 

This scene is a LAPD crime suppression patrol searching 5 people after seeing a gun inside the vehicle they were in. Standards for searches and seizure in america are not hard to reach.  The LSPD showing conspicuous presence in South L.S is realistic, and they should not be told to "go away from South LS".

That’s called a gang injunction not a random search, they do that when people are grouped together with gang colors on. Shows how little you know about police work though. The only time they can search your car is if they smell drugs, booze, or you seem intoxicated or suspicious. Every time I’ve been “randomly searched” it was powergamed. 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Dynamite!

[arrdef]

No, this picture does not depict the enforcement of a gang injuction. What you said about when a car can be searched is also false.

 

 

Law enforcement being tough in high crime areas is not unrealistic. There are thousands of such testimonies about the LAPD doing this, alone.

Edited April 19, 2020 by arrdef

[eTaylor]

1 minute ago, Dynamite! said:

This is the LAPD in South Los Angeles.

 

This scene is a LAPD crime suppression patrol searching 5 people after seeing a gun inside the vehicle they were in. Standards for searches and seizure in america are not hard to reach.  The LSPD showing conspicuous presence in South L.S is realistic, and they should not be told to "go away from South LS".

That is LAPD Officer Charles Kumlander as he searches a woman’s purse after spotting a gun on the floor of a car he and his partner had pulled over in South Los Angeles. https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-lapd-searches-20190605-story.html

[eTaylor]

I think people are getting a little bit too personal and hostile in the thread. This is simply a discussion about the roleplay involving gangs and how the LSPD can improve their interactions. I really don't see the need for the immature and demeaning attitudes on display right now. Nobody here has any ill intentions, and it's not a competition about who's right. Having said that, I believe the question directed towards the LSPD in regards to the reduction of unnecessary activity in the gang areas is more than reasonable. This is purely made from a common courtesy standpoint. Furthermore, the realism argument is one that is so subjective and skewed. Realism can be adopted in any which way your opinion goes. Especially in regards to this topic. In my opinion the only thing that really matters is which supports the best roleplay. And I believe taking a cruiser and sitting in the middle of south central for no particular reason isn't helpful at all. It's not helpful to relations, roleplay or overall enjoyment. 

 

13 minutes ago, whowouldwin said:

Powergamed? Do you even know what that word means? If they decide to search your car ( illegally ) that's not powergaming. It's an entirely IC decision. You could try to cry in court that your rights were trampled upon but if they search your car and you have an AK 47 inside I don't think a judge will be moved by your woes.

Having already addressed the attitude, the only thing they're suggesting they look at is obtaining the justifiable grounds for a search and seizure through interaction and roleplay. There are thousands of tricks an officer can employ to get consent, and furthermore ways to throw the book at a person to obtain cause for a search. Getting pulled for a minor traffic infraction and using that as an entrance to a felony arrest is one thing, but I've experienced and seen the only interaction with the officer during those stops "license n registration, step out of the car". Criminal history alone is not an automatic flip to reasonable suspicion or probable cause. It ruins the experience for a lot of people.

Edited April 19, 2020 by eTaylor

[eTaylor]

Just now, whowouldwin said:

Criminal history such as weapon charges is DEFINITELY a flip for reasonable suspicion.

How?