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Realistic Vehicles - Pricing Points


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4 minutes ago, Joey said:

Excuse me? Hi welcome to the world we don't have any good jobs scripted

And I agree with rest of point, if we are going to change prices then make sure to add new jobs, everyone in this server is just grinding money from mining or courier. We need to add more cmds for FD, we need arms dealer job and drugs job, cocaine meth, heroine. Since the day one I haven't seen any gangs around ( we need gangs, cuz without them cops r boored )

Idk why I'm even saying this nervous came from LS-RP he knows better then me that we need these things.

All I see is alot mechanic shops, clubs and that's it. (It's booooring)

 

 

They've been working on that new trucker script for like a year(at least it was mentioned like a year ago), can't only blame GTAW because RageMP is farm from being stable. And that's the exact reason why nobody RPs anything other than Clubs/bars, Vehicle dealerships & Mechanics, nothing else brings in profit. I created a new club a year ago, back then it was much more interesting, now I'm back on the server, there's like 17 club openings per day. 

 

 
 
 
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36 minutes ago, JayO said:

Take the Schafter V12, highest speed out of all the cars and set at $180,000. Compare this to the likes of a carbonizzare which costs $275,000 and the difference is noticeable. Yes the textures and detail are a little better but if pricing was based on speed, the V12 should be not far off the Pariah.

 

Reason why you see Schafters everywhere, it's semi-affordable, very good looking and it's FAST, yeah, speed plays a giant role in what car to buy on GTAW.

 

 
 
 
37 minutes ago, JayO said:

I fully support this statement but at the same time, wonder if the staff would actually take time and set up a dedicated team to go through it. 

People have been spamming suggestions related to vehicles, pricing, need for more vehicles that are unused for whatever reason, pricing, customizations.

They're either working on something gigantic or just don't care/want to change anything, if it's the second one, no, there will be no dedicated team going through it.

 

 
 
 
39 minutes ago, JayO said:

My opinion on this is the fact that people who already have these mental priced cars will most likely complain that the value has dropped significantly. 

They will, there will be a spam of whining about the prices as well as a good amount of spam for refunds, that's what I'm afraid the most of, if they actually do something about prices they need to be smart.

 
 
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40 minutes ago, JayO said:

The fact that this is a Heavy RP server and people drive around in such flashy sport cars without any real story as to why they own one is an issue in its own. Prices should be altered to stop the new upcoming people abusing the 5k checks and buying these cars.

Not sure what's up with GTA V RP, but I don't remember having such problems back in samp. Seriously RPed on 2 servers on GTA V and both of them had people spamming supercars, GTAW is much better compared to the other one but it's still a big problem.

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Is it such a far-fetched idea to simply refund someone the difference? The prices I’m suggesting won’t be so drastic that it causes complete economic turmoil. It’s still counted in their assets whether it’s in the car or in their wallet. You’re basically setting it as if they bought the car at the new price and then earned the rest, which they would have regardless. They obviously earned it to begin with or they wouldn’t have been able to buy the vehicle in the first place. 

 

Why not encourage some spending with the difference? Nothing like jump starting an economy. I’m not an economist so that could be an awful idea, but just for the sake of discussion.... why or why not?

Edited by Pollster
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5 minutes ago, Pollster said:

They obviously earned it to begin with or they wouldn’t have been able to buy the vehicle in the first place. 

 

 

This is one of the points being brought up here, a large portion of people don't earn it. They just save up the 5k checks with no ICly reason to actually own a nice car. 

 

Business owners I get and other highly successful people I get totally but if you actually stop and ask people what they do most of them will say "Courier" or "Mechanic" which in reality arent the best paid jobs at all.

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1 minute ago, JayO said:

This is one of the points being brought up here, a large portion of people don't earn it. They just save up the 5k checks with no ICly reason to actually own a nice car. 

 

Business owners I get and other highly successful people I get totally but if you actually stop and ask people what they do most of them will say "Courier" or "Mechanic" which in reality arent the best paid jobs at all.

You forgot to add mining ?

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1 hour ago, JayO said:

This is one of the points being brought up here, a large portion of people don't earn it. They just save up the 5k checks with no ICly reason to actually own a nice car. 

 

Business owners I get and other highly successful people I get totally but if you actually stop and ask people what they do most of them will say "Courier" or "Mechanic" which in reality arent the best paid jobs at all.

I totally didn’t proofread what I wrote in my last reply and totally contradicted my original point with that ?? Yeah I agree with you. I was just deep in thought with how this could be done and went off the deep end lol. Just would love to find a solution. 

 

Still waiting on any sort of admin response, just to add to discussion. Doesn’t have to be an official statement lol. 

Edited by Pollster
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Cars and their portrayal have been an ongoing issue for a while. People clearly have no knowledge of what they're talking about and get caught up using game terms such as "maxed out" and vague "upgraded transmission, brakes and engine" when speaking of their cars to others. These aren't phrases anybody in the real world would usually say, regardless of their knowledge of cars. Real life experience of even owning a car will make anybody realize the massive gap in dissonance the average person has in portraying their vehicle ownership in-game. 

 

And this is where the pricing comes in. I believe the prices were influenced too much by their IG performance as opposed to their actual relative value (as people had to be discouraged to avoid buying high speed vehicles to start off a chain of cop baiters). Current trends slap the Elegy Retro Custom, Schafter V12 and the Pariah as the vehicles that are abused the most. 

 

When people say they can fish for a Comet SR or mine for a Bestia GTS, you know that's where it gets messy. People don't consider that payments don't work that way, that their characters have bills to pay, then you add vehicle ownership and maintenance on top of that and you're looking at the reason why some bank accounts IRL are a sad sight at the end of the month. How many working class people have had to scrape by in the last week before their payday because of expenses?

 

Cropped because I don't intend to shame the poster, only use their listing as an example:

 

image.png.95311c0d147c234ea7ed3fe2dac0a411.png

 

The Schafter V12 is popular because its price-to-performance ratio is frankly amazing, like it always has been since it was added into GTA Online. Just like its real life influence it was pitched as a counterpart to the W212 E-Class Mercedes (specifically the AMG and/or the Brabus V12). The Pariah has the highest top speed of any car in-game (and beats out MANY supercars in the GTA V meta) and the Elegy has both the handling and acceleration to put it above most others despite a lower top speed. 

 

Changing or adding vehicles won't be an easy task or welcomed easily by the staff because of how many people already improperly portray wealth and assets, with cars being the #1 notorious asset poorly represented by certain players. Any changes proposed will need solid backing behind them while also considering where compromises HAVE to be made between reality and the game world. Insurance and registration doesn't carry over either, which highlights the people that believe it does based solely on the script. It's like many things that don't need a script change, just a different approach to the RP. 

 

It comes down to the people more in the know to help shape a better car scene by leading by example to break this gamey-culture around the car scene. They could give pointers to people they frequently interact with and share their knowledge or experience, and it's worth it as these people find immense satisfaction in the RP. They also stand out as genuine as you can see with any vehicle-orientated RP done by @Conway, the people at Octane Automotive, and the people at Autohaven. 

 

I worked together with Conway and @JustAnM43; both of whom are more knowledgeable about cars than I am to try and make a proper start on this issue. Together we took a look at every single vehicle available in-game to suggest prices, along with our reasoning for each where applicable. We also looked at vehicles that should be added, vehicles that could be added (such as the lower end super cars that match many of the current sports cars in terms of value and performance) and what values could apply to vehicles if a player were to request them from staff.  I've also had the idea of collaborating with other people versed in vehicles to create a proper guide on portraying vehicles.

 

Here are the raw numbers:

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hQCs6_R21qH86Dy3BQs_jJqYP2ZHXnkj2h3rsTxTGhU/edit?usp=sharing

Edited by Ribsey
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An issue that's always plagued GTA roleplay has always been people wanting to be the best. People often don't opt into a sensible option that suits their characters needs and income, instead preferring to go for something faster and more stylish that would normally only really suit a wealthier character. The pricing list I helped Ribsey and M43 with is a start however at the end of the day people are still going to buy faster cooler cars to boost their own e-peen despite only being lower/middle class. It would also appear that quite a lot of wealthier characters are not really portrayed that well. (e.g. millionaires visiting clubs in rancho, and not really having a good background story to them, just wealth without a cause) which overlaps with this. I do have quite a wealthy character, however I've put some effort into planning her back story so it makes sense for her to actually be wealthy. She has a hobby and a passion which she has turned into a method of earning income and I try to accurately portray everything I do with her, car related or not, as realistically as possible. My main point is if you character has Dewbauchee, Comet or Grotti money, be able to explain how. I have another car character that I would class as middle class at best. His enthusiast car is a clapped out Futo that regularly has problems with it. It's nowhere near the greatest car in the world but it works for him.

 

Sure we can chuck a bunch of taxes onto the vehicles however the issue here is many of the jobs and business opportunities available on the server do not favour wealthy roleplayers. I recall it was once said by multiple members of staff even, that wealth is something that is portrayed, not necessarily held in actual IG income. The closest high income business move supported by the script is probably the hospitality scene (esp bars/nightclubs) which is already over saturated, and not for everyone. Quite frankly trying to roleplay a wealthy character on this server is rather difficult, there are steps in place to prevent widespread wealth, but the only real ways to earn currency are majorly through middle class jobs or illegal business (arms trade etc). Instead of focusing on the pricing and taxes we need to look more at the people. It's something tricky that no GTA RP server to my knowledge has ever perfected. There will always be morons who drive Schafter V12s without really having a reason to own one. If we tax out of the anus however we'll just end up making a sort of socialist simulator where everyone is poor unless you work for the government or you're a criminal mastermind. 

 

 

TLDR of it is basically repricing cars is a good start but at the end of the day it doesn't matter what we do to the script. It comes down to peoples roleplay quality and the choices they make. It sucks but it is what it is at this point. 

Edited by Conway
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Wow, that is some incredibly in-depth insight. That spreadsheet is bonkers, in a good way lol. Maybe it can be tweaked from both ends? Fix the pricing and then have rules in place for quality role play. Basically, if someone wants to play a wealthy character, there needs to be a proper character story, or there can be repercussions. I see people get kicked by admins for poor quality RP. I feel there should be individuals that are strictly in charge of ensuring proper RP in that aspect. Admins can spectate, so I feel it would be a possible task given the right staffing. Send a message that if you're going to RP a specific niche of a character you will be expected to properly RP it, backstory included. Imagine getting stopped by an Admin in-game, "You're driving a rich car, playing a rich character. How did you happen to do that? What's your job? What's your story?" Think of it as a surprise audit lol. 

Edited by Pollster
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Another issue with the valuation of cars, specifically in GTA, is the lack of distinct features one offers over another, aside from obvious characteristics such as top speed, acceleration and handling. For example, the lack of differentiation in sound systems, whether it has an AC and such. All these elements are something I consider before purchasing a car in real life. Does it feature automated AC or has a sunroof, etc. There are millions of features cars from reputed manufacturers offer, that are simply not as relevant in GTA as they are in real life.

 

As Conway said too, the general player may never had their own car or went out and bought one for themselves. When I bought a second hand vehicle IG, I think the person I bought it from was rather surprised when asked, whether the brakes where from reputable brand such as Brembo and whether they were carbon or not. Same with the engine, I specifically talked about whether the car was chipped or whether the engine software was modified to achieve the potential it has.

 

My character specifically opted for a Schafter (not the V12) because it was affordable and fit within the constraints given, and because I drew the comparison to real life. It features characteristics found on newer C-class models as well as the all new A-class of Mercedes which are affordable cars in their respective variants.

 

In order to valuate cars properly on GTA:W you have to consider the average wealth the player base has, compare it to what a vehicle of similar kind costs in real life, and adjust the inflation accordingly. As well as seed out vehicles that are relatively affordable when looking at the real world counterparts, but have much better performance stats in the game. Though overall, yes some of the newer vehicles should have their prices lowered for the sake of availability and some of the older vehicles such as the classic versions of the Sentinel, based on older BMW M3 models should have theirs increased respectively since they are rare to come by, or if you are lucky enough with a hefty price tag for pristine conditions.

Edited by Marcus.
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