PK and CK

[Cascade]

29 minutes ago, eyebrows said:

I’m all for it. I’ve bordered on forcing two CK wars this month alone because PK’s had ruined all development and continuity within the community/factions I was dealing with. This was then ended with people ”RK’ing” because they spawn back in and get involved all over again. 

 

Endless cycle of bullshit - that’s all PK’s are, especially where factions are concerned. I also think the tables need to be turned on LEO factions. There’s a strong attitude of forcing CK’s on criminals who force death without dying scriptwise (which I agree with) but there’s never role reversal. Come into a gang neighbourhood on your solo patrol and talk shit? Better take that CK.

 

Unfortunately I don’t see it happening any time soon. The community is so divided over what makes high standard roleplay that we could never agree a set of rules around it. This is why we have the CK applications. 

However this is not the case. There is many cops that happily take a CK if the situation allows it including myself. What I'm not going to do is take a CK, when I have been shot for a terrible reason like a getting stopped for speeding and your the passenger that has been left behind. To then shoot the cop and run off to disconnect. Straight off CKs in my opinion will ruin this server. You want heavy rp? Straight off force CKs will stop character development and push onto people the dm mentality. You will lose player base it's simple as that. The way it is now is fine, even looking at the pattern of behaviour of balls parading toward gang members getting them shot continously or character drive by cops in normal neighbourhoods for no reason other than to just dick around all the time? Then that should be a conversation to be had or which happens often, member of a faction joins in a mass murder, goes on a pursuit, shoots and gets shot at. Pulls over, rps dying and gets a pk, no jail time. I understand people not wanting the jail cell, but far too many times this is the way they get out of it. The prison is really needed for people to have that rp that actually alot will enjoy, but here we are still not with one.

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, lonex said:

If they had reasons to go on a violent killing massacre, why didn't they just apply for CKs?

Because PK's exist. Isn't that the point of what people have been getting at? People would rather PK and spawn again, rinse and repeat. You answered your own question.

 

31 minutes ago, lonex said:

 Faction management is there to handle these things.

Wrong.

 

32 minutes ago, lonex said:

The whole community should not suffer because of the select few, because every tree has a bad apple. I for sure am not losing a character with nearly 1k hours of development poured into it, to some random gang member that decided to go pull a gun and go rambo shooting at 15 armed cops that are aiming at him, because.. hey, he'll lose his character anyway to long prison time, might as well go with a bang.

The whole community wouldn't suffer. I gave an example of why PK's have become a problem in my eyes the very same way you feel CK's are problematic. I mention a solo patrol and you swoop in with 15 armed cops? Chill your LEO brain out for a minute. This is why I said I don't see it happening, there are far too many variables.

 

Anyway, I'll just re-emphasize that I don't see it happening anytime soon because we could never agree rules around it.

 

10 minutes ago, Cascade said:

There is many cops that happily take a CK if the situation allows it including myself

You're part of the rare few as some aren't accepting of punishment let alone a CK. 

 

10 minutes ago, Cascade said:

What I'm not going to do is take a CK, when I have been shot for a terrible reason like a getting stopped for speeding and your the passenger that has been left behind.

I totally agree with that.

 

Things outside the LEO bubble aren't fine. We have PD people in staff who openly try force CK's on criminals, and it can never be rules for one and not the other. I fully agree that people could have a "I'll CK him before he CK's me" mentality pushed by this, which again is why I said I can't see it happening any time soon due to no agreement on rules being able to be met because it isn't just the players who have a split in standards, it's staff too. We'd never be able to agree on a collective that suited everyone. Unfortunately it's a utilitarian mentality.

 

13 minutes ago, Cascade said:

The prison is really needed for people to have that rp that actually alot will enjoy, but here we are still not with one.

That's nothing to do with this conversation really. But I see your point.

[A_Acko]

11 hours ago, Maca said:

https://www.ajc.com/news/man-shot-death-over-xbox-sale-gone-wrong-wife-says/1M5jjWPdP6olXOrmoQqVUL/

 

 

Better have an in depth explanation of why your character would do this

 

Which I doubt most people would have

 

[Cascade]

The prison, my point of the prison is just that you might get a more structure rp for situations that end up "I'm dead just pking" instead if actually getting arrestedmight have extensive rp from it beyond just sat offline until your time is done, from prison rp likely be a role play community within it that will prevent the above. 

 

I'd never try and badger staff for a CK as I understand player attachment to the development of their character, however as a cop role player it can get annoying when these pointless pks keep happening to avoid arrest.

 

It's a strange balance of trying to find a way that's fair and enjoyable. We all get attached to our characters and a happy medium is needed to make people do not leave the server. Forced continuous Ck regardless of the situation would stop people returning after you have developed a character for months. It will only be an additional head ache for staff as well. This wouldn't work. 

[Andy.]

Absolutely not. Though CKs should be enforced and handed out more liberally, what about the people who put hours on hours into a character for the sake of development and enjoyment. 

 

There are several killings that are justified by the community currently that just aren't acceptable. If you enforce a mandatory CK policy you're hurting more than you're doing good. 

 

Furthermore. The economy dosent support this, you're forcing people to purchase name changes to keep their assets. People should be able to enjoy the server without an obligatory pressure to donate. 

 

To avoid a lengthy response, I reiterate. Absolutely not. I think that instead of moving towards removing PKs it should fall on staff to do a better job of enforcing against offenders. As Eyebrows mentioned, why shouldn't a faction going into a PK war for the umpteenth time this month be forced into a CK war? 

[SupSupreme]

I can see how CKs could benefit the server, fear roleplay reports would almost disappear out of the reports section and that would actually give a meaningful environment to your character, although the amount of drawbacks that this idea has is almost uncountable, admins will be spammed with reports on stupid reasons for CK and a lot of rules are needed to keep a CK system organized, on top of that, I don't see a way that a proper character can be developed with this system, and think about the players that have developed their character for almost 1k hours, they would absolutely suffer from this system. If the system can be organized in a proper way with very specific rules and would also give a way to develop a character for a reasonable amount of time, then I would be all for it.

Edited May 23, 2019 by SupSupreme

[lonex]

42 minutes ago, eyebrows said:

1 hour ago, lonex said:

If they had reasons to go on a violent killing massacre, why didn't they just apply for CKs?

Because PK's exist. Isn't that the point of what people have been getting at? People would rather PK and spawn again, rinse and repeat. You answered your own question.

 

1 hour ago, lonex said:

 Faction management is there to handle these things.

Wrong.

 

But you as Faction Management are there to guide these people away from doing senseless things.

 

You can always intervene, make people apply for CKs if they so wish to cause a massive bloodshed, because apparently they have a good reason to.

 

48 minutes ago, eyebrows said:

1 hour ago, lonex said:

The whole community should not suffer because of the select few, because every tree has a bad apple. I for sure am not losing a character with nearly 1k hours of development poured into it, to some random gang member that decided to go pull a gun and go rambo shooting at 15 armed cops that are aiming at him, because.. hey, he'll lose his character anyway to long prison time, might as well go with a bang.

The whole community wouldn't suffer. I gave an example of why PK's have become a problem in my eyes the very same way you feel CK's are problematic. I mention a solo patrol and you swoop in with 15 armed cops? Chill your LEO brain out for a minute. This is why I said I don't see it happening, there are far too many variables.

 

Anyway, I'll just re-emphasize that I don't see it happening anytime soon because we could never agree rules around it.

 

 I was just making an example, same way you did about a solo LEO in a gang neighbourhood. 

 

And the community would suffer because there are far too many variables as you said yourself. I shouldn't lose something I worked so hard for just to some random dumb scene. If I got killed by someone I roleplayed with for a very long time and the person was part of my character story or progression, I would have no problem CKing. But I should still have a choice in that. People shouldn't be forced to spend money on this game in order to play.

[Jauss]

As much as I can see what is ment by this, putting this into effect will have fatal consequences for the servers playerbase. 

As I totally agree that PK is too easy to use in a lot of situations, I still think going full CK will strangle the life out of GTA:W and here is why.

 

As much as I appreciate the realism here and how far this server has come, when it comes to certain changes, CK will most likely kill the joy of a LOT of players. New as old, due to the fact that most of us got real lives, outside this great universe. 
If I had to let go of months upon months of character development and over 500 hours of gametime on that character alone over a single kill, because someone felt that I deserved it. I'd quit. Simple as that. 

I love investing my sparetime in GTA:W. But as much as we are trying to portray real life, this is not real life... I have plenty of things to do IRL as of now, which limits my time on GTA:W and I don't even have kids yet..

 

Imagine a player, who not only have a fulltime job. But who also needs to take care of his property, family, other hobbies etc. - A player like this would lose all progress if he ever got in trouble ig, which you cannot always back out of. 

 

 

There must be better ways to get around this, than just eliminating PK and just go pure CK.

I know we need a change, as the PK card is very easily pulled when it comes to many situations and I think that's where we should start. Many people don't RP fear correctly. Maybe people fire their weapons over the smallest reasons. We DEFINITELY need a change on that subject. But CK only is not the answer.

 

Thats my opinion at least.

[lonex]

6 minutes ago, Jauss said:

 

 There must be better ways to get around this,

Simple. Take away what people care most for on this server.

 

In game Money. Lots of it. 

 

Effective way to combat people not rping fear of losing something and another way of dealing with the inflation.

[Mitch]

1 minute ago, lonex said:

In game Money. Lots of it. 

 

What exactly would that achieve?