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Basically, I would like to see some good suggestions regarding a "revamp" or a good addition regarding the server's economy at its current state, I want to see your problems with the economy and possibly some ideas on how it could get improved. Lets keep it civil as usual :)

I'd say a lot of people already know what I'm talking about. I'll make this short and sum it up: You've got people making 10k, 6k, 4k offa hour jobs in bars n clubs. RPing that ICly and actually talking about it "I'm doing night shifts, yeah, I get around six grand." is nothing other than borderline cringy. See, I'm all up for flexibility and all that, but talking about US dollars like that is just weird as fuck. It's not exclusive to paychecks. It's cars too and small things like event purchases, like food at a diner, beer at a bar. I'm not a club/bar guy but the one or two times I've visited them, I was asked to pay 100 dollars for a drink completely ICly and you get the point. You can't take yourself seriously typing a /me pulls out his wallet and pays John 100 for his beer. What can you do? Look into simple price labels on products around restaurants and clubs, enforce a rule or two about it so the whatever-it-is team doesn't end up going around every single business n its owner on the map for this. Simply educate the owners on it via a forum rule and a discord tag...That also involves paychecks for part-time workers, instead of paying them whatever they're getting rn, decrease it by 40 60 percent and following that, a change in car prices, weapon prices and entry fees, if entry fees do exist, I've not paid attention to that. Some things are pretty much on point and some aren't at all, makes it unbalanced.

Let's discuss inflation! In economics (in real-life and in games too), if you consistently pump money in the system you will eventually inflate the value of the currency. The amount of the currency circulating in the system will grow, everybody will hold a bigger amount of assets and a single piece of currency will slowly start to lose its value. This can lead to a bigger cap between old and new players, which can make people unmotivated about working, which can lead to asset stacking rather than caring about the quality of their roleplay. There are several factors in game-economics but if we want to simplify it down, we can say imagine this process as a scale. The scale: assets vs. liabilities To make it easily understandable I will insert a relatively simple illustration to make it easier to understand the difference between assets and liabilities. Assets: everything you own; Liabilities: everything you owe. Equity: we don't care about this now. The current problem with our economy Right now the biggest problem with our in-game economy is the unbalanced scale between assets and liabilities, meaning you can gather an ungodly amount of assets without also gaining liabilities. This is not just highly unrealistic but also leads to an unbalanced, unsustainable economy. In a good, sustainable economy if you can earn money extremely fast then the money will inflate eventually. To solve this, we need to create ways to force people into spending money to slow down the increase of the overall assets on the server. This can and will lead to a more stable economy which will benefit everybody. The solution: money sinks Right now our goal should be to create ways to drain money out from the system. If you earn money, you should be forced to spend a certain amount to pay the expenses of your assets. A few ideas: utility bills for homes (the higher the property + furniture value, the higher the bill), replaceable parts on cars (tires, oil, et cetera, the car guys can probably say a thousand more), and so on. What is a good money sink? Consistent -- you need to pay it weekly/monthly/yearly. Scalable -- you need to pay more if you hold higher value assets. Affects everyone -- you need to pay it regardless of your job or status. Realistic -- you need to keep your idea in realistic frames. Comment your best money sink ideas and I will create a mega suggestion ("economy update") from the most upvoted ideas! Recommended video before commenting: MMO Economies - Hyperinflation, Reserve Currencies & You! - Extra Credits

Short description: Make it so you own the item you buy, until you NC/CK. Properties have wardrobes too. Detailed description: To explain it in debt, so nobody misunderstands what I'm getting at. What I'm saying is; you buy a clothing item, but you don't have to buy it again on another outfit, it stays in your property wardrobe until you either NC or CK. Meaning, you could one a black textured hoodie, you'd own that specific hoodie on that character until you make a new one. Now, you might have a question or two; wardrobes? Pricing? Wardrobes would be scripted into properties, and whatnot whilst pricing would be revamped and be priced to match the GTA: World economy. Maybe a hoodie costs $2,000; per texture, depending if it's designer or not. Maybe designer heels cost $5,000 per texture? This adds more realism, and actually stops the economy from being inflated. Plus, with the clothing mods being added in 1.1 I don't see any downsides. If you have a counterargument; what if someone buys everything? Well with how the clothing would be priced it'd stop that as that might run someone $900,000 in total... I doubt anyone would do that. Not to mention you can own literally up to 999 outfits now if you buy that many slots, so this is all +'s. Commands to add: /wardrobe. Items to add: A property wardrobe and clothing menu revamp. How would your suggestion improve the server? It'd improve the server because you would have actual realism, when you buy something on that character, you actually own it. Plus, when someone NCs or CKs? Their clothing ownership resets and maybe they could own what's in the first 3 outfits and the rest must be bought again; a/k/a stopping an inflated economy. Additional information: N/A. I think this is actually pretty logical, in-fact quite surprised it isn't suggested already; not to be confused with the clothing inv item suggestion.

Short description: add new money sinks to the game to create a more realistic and better working economy. Detailed description: The pieces of this suggestion come from the Inflation & Economy Discussion. Thank you for everybody who contributed with ideas. Introduction Our current economic system on the server is far from realistic. We can easily gather and gather assets like cars and houses without also gathering expenses. In reality, every liability (the things you use) will cause you to lose money every month and the more luxurious the liability is, the more you will need to spend to support your luxurious living standards. This suggestion will propose five new and unavoidable game mechanics which will help the players to keep balance in their roleplay and to create a more realistic economic situation. 1.) Utility Bills Owning a property should cost money. Every single month, on a given date, we should receive a utility bill based on the property price and type. For residential properties, the utility cost would be five percent, for commercial buildings, ten percent. For example: if you own a house with a $150,000 market value, your utility bill will be $7,500. For your business with a $250,000 market value, you will pay $25,000 monthly for your utilities. Once you received your utility bill, you have 15 days to pay, otherwise, the government will receive a notification and they can take actions against you. First, your utilities will be cut then you as your debt increases, you can lose your house. Commands to add: /bills -- check your outstanding bills /bills pay id -- pay a utility bill (with the ability to pay for other's bills) /bills debt property_name -- check the outstanding bills and debt amount (LEOs and GOV members should be able to check any property) Other: the Government should have a new function on their website to receive notifications for properties with outstanding bills, I can code this part. 2.) Foods & Drinks Our characters should be forced to eat and drink at least once a day. After every eight online hours, you will receive a notification that your character is hungry/thirsty. Then you will have a four-hour window to go to a place where you can eat and drink. Either home, a restaurant, a shop. Let's say you play four hours a day, it means you will have to care about drinking and eating every third day you play. This way it will not become annoying but definitely a good, unavoidable way to make you spend money. If you ignore your hunger or thirst level, the notifications will become more frequent and after four online hours, you will lose consciousness, then eventually die. Commands to add: /hunger -- prints your current hunger and thirst level 3.) Wearing vehicle parts Owning a vehicle is not only the ability to purchase it. You need to care about the maintenance and the more luxurious your car is, the more you will end up paying monthly/yearly. To start this system, one part of your car would wear off over time: your tires. The replacement price depends on the market value of your car. You will have three tire options: low-mid-high quality for 3-5-7 percent of your car's market value. Different tiers will last for different times. Low tier: 500 miles, mid-tier: 1000 miles, high-tier: 1500 miles. You can check the remaining miles on your vehicle stats. For example, you own a Kawaii with a $95,000 market price. When you purchase the vehicle, it comes with a low tier tire. After 500 miles, you will need to spend $2,850 for another set of low-tier tires. If your tire completely wears off, your car's speed will be limited to 20 miles an hour. In the future, more parts can be added to this system. 4.) Passive income for creative roleplayers Even if we triple our player base, some people will never be able to make as much money to finance their lives because of the roleplay they play. We should introduce a system where you can apply for a passive income if you roleplay something unpopular but creative. There would be three tiers: $10,000; $25,000; $50,000 weekly, for 20 hours playtime. Let's say you roleplay a band with your friends and realistically you would sell CDs, you would earn money from Spotify and YouTube but due to the server's limitation, you cannot make money. You apply for a medium passive income pack and you receive $25,000 each week if you spent at least 20 hours ingame and you earned zero money from scripted jobs. 5.) Revamp the newcomer bonus The current $200,000 for every character is way too much. Introduce a system where you can select from three tiers and you will receive your welcoming bonus according to that. After you create your character and you log in, you should receive three options you can choose from. Poor: $1,000 for 40 hours then $100 per paycheck for unemployment. Mid-class: $2,000 for 40 hours then $250 per paycheck for unemployment. High-class: $4,000 for 40 hours then $500 per paycheck for unemployment. Items to add: N/A How would your suggestion improve the server? Explained above. Additional information: N/A

Please keep this discussion civil, as I'd rather encourage an open dialog rather than getting this closed in less than 24 hours. Tagging @Keane as this is part of what I feel should be more of a discussion of role play quality, rather than a suggestion. I put it in general so that this could be more of an open discussion rather than just suggesting a concrete rule change in the rules section. Two parts to this issue, one is not portraying the economy correctly and the other is businesses selling items at unrealistic prices because of the business bonus. This may be just me, but I'm going to put this out here anyways. Most businesses (bars, coffee shops, nightclubs, etc.) that have access to the business bonus sell products at or near 100% loss. Why isn't this an issue? Bartenders keep all the money from alcohol sales as their salary for the night. How does that make sense? Beers that sell for $60 in an alcohol store are sold for $30 or less in some places. Coffee shops sell products far below their actual value. For example, coffee shops selling coffees (custom made items) for $4, when they cost more to actually make the item through the custom item script. Donuts and sandwiches being sold for less than $10 when they cost much more than that in a 24/7. Business owners have no care in the world to sell these items at a realistic price point based on the GTAW economy because they don't care about the loss. This is not how businesses are supposed to run, in GTAW or otherwise. I believe this creates confusion as to how this economy works and leads to people expecting real world prices. This is why you see people complain about a $400 door fee, when in actuality $400 is nothing in the GTAW world. This is why you see people complain when a drink is $200 in a bar, because other businesses sell them for much less at a complete loss (because pricing doesn't inherently matter with the business bonus). It's not supposed to be based on a 1:1 real world dollar to GTAW dollar. For me, this is a huge issue and I believe it creates a continuity issue for this economy. If we're role playing inflated incomes (paychecks at $500+ an hour), we should be role playing inflated price points for everything else. If a sandwich costs $90 in a 24/7, it shouldn't be sold for $4 in a business. That's just stupid. It should be one or the other in this case. If GTAW administration is going for an inflated economy where it isn't a 1:1 real world to GTAW dollar ratio, then everything after that should be enforced as a role play quality standard. Businesses should not be selling items at a complete loss, they should be selling at realistic prices based on what they actually bought the item for in order to make a profit. That's how business works. Businesses should not be selling items for real world prices, they should be inflated to what GTAW administration have established as realistic within our in-game economy. If people want real world prices, then the economy needs to be revamped to reflect real world incomes and many other factors (which I don't think is feasible). There needs to be some intervention here as I have seen this get more and more common in-game with expectation of real world pricing, whether it is door fees, drink prices, custom product prices, etc. Discuss.

Short description: The current system of how businesses sell their products is very unrealistic. Generally what happens now is the employees sell the item (custom made, alcohol, etc.) and keep the money from the sale of the item as well as any tips a customer may give them. This is no where near realistic and only viable because businesses profit from the business bonus. This needs to be changed so that the ecosystem of businesses can improve. Detailed description: First part - Establishments that sell alcohol (Bars, Clubs, & Lounges, not liquor stores) (This is going to be a little long, with more than one part) Allow alcoholic establishments (bars & clubs) to obtain access to the liquor purchasing script that is used in consumer-based liquor stores. Bars and clubs are basically larger, liquor stores in reality. I would suggest that only employees (designated through the business manager) to be able to access the menu through pressing "Y" just as you would in a regular store. The only addition I would suggest is for the business owner to be able to designate custom prices from within the business manager for the existing selections (if possible). Basically, the RP for a customer buying a drink would be the same. The customer would order a drink, the bartender would RP making it and collect the price of the drink + hopefully a tip. The bartender would use the liquor menu to purchase the alcohol instead of accessing the property inventory to get the item. This would ensure the sale of the alcohol goes to the business, while the bartender keeps the tip. This also makes for the argument to allow bartenders access to the hourly stipend, as it would be the same type of job as working at a restaurant or coffee shop as a server or barista. It's a win-win scenario for both the business owner and the worker. Instead of a business owner purchasing alcohol from a consumer facing store and placing it in their property inventory, they would have to purchase components just like all other liquor stores do in order for there to be alcohol in-stock. This helps to simulate liquor being purchased at a lower cost through a supplier as well as alcohol to be sold at a decent price, while still making a profit. Those worried about liquor stores losing revenue, I can understand that. However, alcohol-based businesses would normally work through a supplier not a customer-facing liquor store. Liquor stores can still operate and receive money from the public coming in to buy alcohol, especially when nothing else is open. This change would do several things: It would tie bars, clubs & lounges into the closed ecosystem for supply & demand of products for trucking purposes. Truckers would be able to deliver crates to bars & nightclubs who would be in need of components to supply the alcohol from within the script. This would more closely tie into what would happen realistically where a supplier would bring the alcohol to a business rather than the owner going to buy his own alcohol from a local liquor store meant primarily for consumers, not businesses. It would ensure that the sale of each product actually goes to the business, rather than the employee keeping 100% of the sale proceeds. This ensure a healthy business RP that more closely resembles what really happens. The employee would still receive the hourly stipend as well as any tips they procure during their shift. Second part - Establishments using custom made items Any custom made item should be recorded in a transaction log (if it isn't already), based on the employee who created it. Showing something like: [Employee] Charles Hanson created 1 x Glazed Donut [Employee] Sylvia Brenner created 2 x Green Tea This transaction log would then be used by the business owner to collect the sales of products at the end of shift, ensuring the business benefits from selling products while making sure employees receive the hourly stipend and any tips they collected. Yes, I'm suggesting the business owner has to do some small math calculations for each employee to ensure they collect the right amount from them at the end of each shift. Welcome to running a business! ? How would your suggestion improve the server? I feel the server is long overdue for an overhaul of the way businesses operate. It's highly unrealistic for businesses to sell products at a complete loss (even though they get a bonus), where the employees keep 100% of the sales as well as the tips. This system would move the business RP in a more realistic direction, where businesses have to make their price points realistic and profitable. That's the point of running a business at the end of the day. Workers in bars would also now benefit from the hourly stipend since they are in a service-based business, just like restaurant servers or people working in custom item shops. The trucking industry would get a boost in delivery locations now as bars will also need component deliveries to ensure their stock for alcohol. There are a lot of benefits to modifying these certain aspects of business RP. I feel it would benefit the server in many ways and help to push the business/economy in a better direction.

Implementing the nessesity and production of goods and services to create capital good and economic value. For example; Hunger/Thirst, Production of Food, Vehicles, Housing, Weapons ect. If it needs to be made, it should be made, not magically placed into the world, in order for the economy to thrive, items need to be real because they where actually made, somebody RPed creating that item. Production of Weapons in Los Santos: - LSPD order 200 Glock 17's - Weapon factory recieves order, based on stock, either starts production or orders materials - Weapons get sold to LSPD - Ammunation Sandy Shores orders 10 M9's - Process repeats Production of Vehicles in Los Santos: - Car Dealership orders 20 Vapid Stainers via script. - Car Factory receives order for Vapid Stainer, if the factory has the cars, they send them for delivery, if the factory doesn't, they start production of the vehicles. - If Car Factory is stocked in materials but no vehicles have yet been produced, they will start producing vehicles, in a manner similar to the early day's construction companies, RPing building the cars. - If Car Factory is NOT stocked in materials, they place an order from the refinery - Miners mine ore, loading it at the refinery - Refinery sells ore to Car Factory For now, I think all jobs should be salary based unless a point of economic change is made ICly, i.e an Anarcho-Syndicalist social uprising.

Simple question. Why is the economy for auto sales so messed up or are people just cheap because they can be? ? I get you can be patient and wait for that one person who will give a fair price for a car, but other than that people just try to be as cheap as possible. I buy a car for 50,000 and then put all the performance parts/upgrades into it. If you do engine, turbo, brakes, transmission that's what 25,000 roughly? Add a new paint job on top of it. I understand depreciation but holy crap ? After purchase price, registration and performance upgrades you've got about 80,000 into it and someone will come along and be like, "I'll give you 35,000". I just don't get it lol. How did it get so messed up? Or am I just crazy? You can be honest lol. This is just my opinion. Note: I understand that no one will pay over the original dealership price, I was just implying that there should be more reasonable offers. People are just cheap I guess, lol.

I apologize if there has been a discussion about this before. I tried browsing through, but didn't find an exact match on my points here. So here it is. Short description: Consider price changes on existing cars to create affordable vehicles for the average consumer and potentially make other cars more out of reach, to help facilitate realistic role play. There is too much abuse of the $5,000 paychecks to simply just save and buy an expensive car. I would love to see more people driving around realistic cars. Too many times I drive by an auto garage and see mechanics driving in-game equivalents of Mercedes, BMW, Corvettes, etc. Many times I have RP'd with people with expensive cars and asked what they do for a living and they say something along the lines of Courier Driver or Mechanic. It's pretty dull and shallow role play, to be honest. Detailed description: Looking over the Vehicle Dealership guide, I noticed a huge lack of realistically affordable vehicles for the average person. By realistic, I consider a baseline of $25,000 or less. From a real perspective, that's what I would consider somewhat affordable under normal working conditions and anyone who's not making six figures or more per year. Let's take a look at the numbers: Not including boats, aircraft and major industrial/utility vehicles, the amount of cars/bikes/motorcycles under $25,000 is 28. When you count up the total vehicles that would normally be purchased by your average consumer (again not including boats/aircraft/huge utility vehicles and trucks), I counted up around 224 vehicles. That's a grand total of 12.5%. Only 12.5% of vehicles can be classified as truly affordable by realistic means. These number goes even lower if you go one step further and take into account people who don't know how to operate a motorcycle or don't want to buy a junker car that they can't keep running (i.e. Ratloader, Rusty cars, etc). How would your suggestion improve the server?: Honestly, this situation is pretty unrealistic and I'm not sure what the reasoning behind the car pricing was at the time. I'm not insinuating that anyone did anything wrong, I'm just pointing out the facts. I would welcome an Admin response and the reasoning behind it, maybe it's something that I haven't considered. If we're considered a heavier role play server, along with the conversations that I've seen where there is already a high amount of improper portrayals of wealth (expensive cars, etc), I would think we would all welcome an influx of more realistically affordable vehicles for people to role play with. Now I understand that these cars can't be placed at their real pricing, but this is just for discussion purposes. Dinka Blista Compact (based on an older Honda CR-X) - $41,000 https://gta.fandom.com/wiki/Blista_Compact https://www.autotrader.com/Honda/CRX/1991 - Original MSRP even for the Coupe Si was under $12,000 (this assumes it was new). In-game, this thing costs $41,000? That's completely unrealistic for what the car is, what it does and especially how it looks. This is an example of a car that should be more affordable, just to encourage people to buy these kinds of cars. I would LOVE to see people role playing with a larger variety of cars like this, rather than all the unrealistic people who have an expensive car with no means to justify how they bought it. I could go on with plenty more, but didn't want to get too lengthy. You get my point here. Like I said, I would welcome an Admin to come in and explain their reasoning as I'm not part of the team and there could be something I'm completely missing. Just trying to look at this from a realistic point of view, a lot of the cars are over priced and one could probably go the other way and suggest some are under priced. Side Note: I do understand the basics of an in-game economy and that they are different from real life. I am not suggesting to make prices the same as real life. I was just using examples as a reference point to suggest that the pricing of some vehicles in this game do not make sense, as some cars are older than others and do not reflect what accurate pricing would look like even in an in-game economy.

Realism in the Economy Welcome to GTA World! I'm sure you're wondering, "What sets you guys apart from the other GTA V Roleplay Servers?" Well, one of the many things that sets us apart is our realistic economy system that we have spent hours upon hours deciding upon, with input from experts in the field. We don't want you to spend hours upon hours grinding a fishing job, a trucking job, a trash job, or any other script jobs. We want to encourage roleplay, and encourage roleplay ways of earning that money. We want this to be the furthest thing away from an RPG game, and completely focus this on becoming more of a "real life" simulator, in both the economy and the roleplay standards that we expect our players to hold themselves to. Everyone will receive "basic income" until you reach $150,000 in assets. (This means, in bank cash, on hand cash, your properties, your vehicles, and all of the things that you may own.) This is to help people that are starting off on the server and to "simulate" a program of welfare on the server. Once you reach $150,000 in assets, you no longer receive this basic income, and you must find other ways to supplement your income. You're free to roleplay it as welfare from the government, money from your characters parents, or any way of receiving a "base" income. This means that for those whom may want to roleplay in lower socioeconomic classes, such as those roleplaying gangsters, you can hop right into roleplaying and there's no need for them to "grind" for money, as they will be the one's with much less cash. We want things to remain realistic, but fair to all, and this was one of the first steps we developed in coming to one of the more realistic simulations of a real life economy. Secondly, there will be a 0.0035% Tax of all of your assets that are taken each hour. Before you worry, realize that this is a significantly small number if you are your average person on the server. If you have $800,000 in assets, you will only pay $2,500 per hour. This will help keep things more balanced, preventing the problem of what was had on many different communities before where people would hold millions upon millions of dollars for years, and the economy would inflate significantly with the money going nowhere. There will also be a slightly higher tax for those whom are millionaires, raising the tax bracket to 0.005% which also takes your bank money into account. This would mean that you are paying $5,000 an hour with $1,000,000 in total assets. This means, if you want to keep your money, you're going to have to be smart with it. Don't worry, there will be many ways for those whom want to be millionaires and live the lavish lifestyles to continue to do so, you will just have to be smart to keep your lifestyle that way. In terms of prices of vehicles, items, and houses, we are keeping them at real life-realistic prices. An average house in the poorer parts of the city might be $70,000, whilst one in the "richer" parts of the city might go for $300,000. Vehicles are priced (for the most part) with their real life counter parts. You will not see many people driving around unrealistic vehicles such as helicopters and sports cars, unless they actually work to keep their assets and money. We hope that you all will appreciate this system of more realism and we are always open to suggestions from others. -Missi